How to combat the Sicilian..?

Sort:
Xander_is_OkayAtChess

I keep facing the Sicilian whenever I play e4 and after 5-10 moves I almost always get a Sicilian Dragon. I want to find a way to keep the game out of theory so my opponent can't just play top engine moves.

Recently I've been trying to play the Alapin because it's very straightforward.

Any suggestions?

phuo12456736688
Oh WOW
1Lindamea1
Smith morra, alapin, yugoslav attack, mengarini,
Coach_Kashchei

You should be happy to play against the dragon. It's bad for black if white is well prepared. On the top level nobody plays it anymore.

satan_llama

Open sicilian with mostly the English attack set up would be my recommendation (trust me, you don't need to know theory till 15moves, just watch master games and u will be fine), but if you want something easier then the Smith morra.

gik-tally

Smith morra gambit for life!!!!

It has winning stats in EVERY LINE and is playable up to 2500 where players STILL can't refute it. It's just they play some different lines than the ones that work 1600-2000.

There's a video of a 1700 beating a 2500 (2700?) with it on youtube.

When I first started playing it as a 1400 or 1500 simply memorizing about 50 lines up to around 25 moves, I had about a 90% win rate with it and would have had a rating 300 points higher if I only played sicilians.

It puts a lot of pressure on Black while you have pieces everywhere ready to pounce on ANY weakness. It just felt so natural back then following pretty much the same Qe2/Rfd1/Rac1 plans in almost every line.

It's not so easy nowadays as a 1700 with sicilians pretty much all having pet lines for it, buti still have winning stats with it without studying and refamiliarizing myself with it. I could do much better if I studied it as lines like the 1 that's SO BRUTAL, you don't capture whatever piece black puts on e7 to block check with YOUR PAWN, because it's MATING SEASON! LOL

It's a paulsen/kan/pin/fianchetto transpositional maze if you really want to book up. I gave up on creating a book to study when it got too complicated to navigate the theory at around 40 transpositions with a tool that only shows transpositions at the line where you FIRST reached a position instead of BOTH ENDS, and it doesn't MARK the transposition point making it a needle in a haystack problem as you scroll back and forth through a few hundred lines of theory.

It's all good... I'm doing JUST FINE with the basics and always looking for tactics.

I bet a beginner could jump right in and do OK watching a few youtube videos and building theory one line at a time in lines they do poorly in as I did switching from 5.Bc4 to 5.Nf3 because my results there are better.

The more you know, the better it is, but a basic understanding us good enough if you're a ruthless attacker

The very first game I played, my opponent resigned after I played 3.c3! that player did not like the smith morra, as im sure many other do too because they can't refute it and have slightly losing (8%, i think) stats against it on average.

It's THE strongest performing line at the amateur level i'm pretty sure

AngusByers

The Sicilian is a very strong fighting defense to face, and due to the large number of variations, it can be time consuming for White to prepare for them all, or even a decent number of them, until well into one's chess career. On the other hand, any 1. e4 player is going to face it fairly often, so it's not something to put off. Personally, until you get to 2000+, you can more or less choose almost any of the major variations and do well if you know and understand it. The problem is finding a line where White has a greater ability to dictate the variation, that way you can gain experience with that line, while you "book up" over time on some of the other variations you may face.
The Grand Prix attack might be worth looking into for that reason. It's a good opening for most players, and will serve you well up up to around 2000 or so. It also has a fairly straight forward set of attacking ideas, and you will probably get to practice that particular variation regularly, which will result in learning some generalizable tactical skills and patterns.

gik-tally

grand prix attack, advance variation, exchange variation & wing gambit were all variations I attempted to play and failed miserably with, but smith morra kicks butt

it DOES have better stats than grand prix as I thought, and NOTHING refutes it. thesestats are all filtered for 1600-2000, but even up to 2500, smith morra is rock solid

grand prix is perfectly playable, but NOTHING like king's gambit as I'd hoped. looking at the stats, the second most popular line doesn't look to be advantageous and that's about 1/3 of one's games

I was thinking the closed variation is brutal, but I was following lines after black -plays the rare 2...e5, but following the closed variation to the fianchetto variation is SUPER playable

is the most promising continuation
 

2nd most popular 2...d6 isn't a problem at all either, in fact it's preferable

and 2...e6 is no threat either covering 88% of what you'd face

i'd never play it because I hate both closed positions AND fianchettos, but if you're just starting out, closed fianchetto looks like it drives italy nuts. i just looked at 6% fianchetto vs fianchetto stats, and white is winning there too and is even doing fine in 3% 2...a6 with equality in the main line and winning in the sidelines.

i'll stick to kamikaze smith morra because it ain't busted and suits my style best, but gosh golly closed fianchetto stats rock at a 9% or BETTER edge including sidelines in each of the 3 main lines

smith morra if you wanna gambit, closed fianchetto if you want to smother

AngryPuffer

all these anti sicilians are trash and non challenging to the black pieces (with the execption of the smith morra gambit.

if you really want to challenge black and go for the kill, then play the open sicilian agianst everything and actually put time into learning it. The open sicilian is the most challenging option that white has and black struggles agianst it. Not to mention but its very fun for both sides and will generate some of the most sharp, dynamic, and fun games. stop trying to avoid the open sicilian and start playing it for yourself. you will find that you will win alot more games.

one last thing to note, if you have trouble with learning lines agianst the dragon, taimanov, najdorf, or whatever, then message me because i know the sicilian very well from hours of study and i can help for free

gik-tally
AngryPuffer wrote:

all these anti sicilians are trash and non challenging to the black pieces (with the execption of the smith morra gambit.

if you really want to challenge black and go for the kill, then play the open sicilian agianst everything and actually put time into learning it. The open sicilian is the most challenging option that white has and black struggles agianst it. Not to mention but its very fun for both sides and will generate some of the most sharp, dynamic, and fun games. stop trying to avoid the open sicilian and start playing it for yourself. you will find that you will win alot more games.

one last thing to note, if you have trouble with learning lines agianst the dragon, taimanov, najdorf, or whatever, then message me because i know the sicilian very well from hours of study and i can help for free

funny how you trash everything, then espouse a line with mediocre stats. black has a 2% edge in the main line. how does that compare with the 9% plus by move 3 closed variation? you call lines that perform better trash. cognitive dissonant much?

if by open, you mean the prins variation after 4...Nf6 5.f3, then yes, white has some winning chances, but if black does HIS homework and plays the venice attack, there goes your claim out the window and all of a sudden, the open gets the dumpster treatment, and 6.Bb5+ is white's STRONGEST performing line

a well prepared to face the prins black opponent is doing fine against white's main line

roughly equal in the main line and winning in all the sidelines.

play the 5.Nf3 modern main line, and black has NOTHING to worry about, and even has a slight edge in the main lines

yeah... no way i'd drop smith morra for that, and i'd take my chances with the stat crushing closed variation before that. call lines that win trash and promote ones that don't. OK

this is why I don't listen to absolutists and do my own homework.

looking at continuations in the closed, white is winning in EVERY line. if that's "trash", then black is throwing his ratings points out on the curb every monday

blueemu

The 2. c3 Alapin is one good anti-Sicilian line, yes.

The 3. Bb5 Rossolimo (against 2. ... Nc6) or Moscow (against 2. ... d6) is another perfectly sound choice.

Or you could use one of the closed systems, such as the Closed itself, or the Grand Prix (2. Nc3 and 3. f4).

1Lindamea1
2.b3
gik-tally

alapin has good stats overall, but is easy to equalize against or better with prep, and sicilians do their homework

huh... following the next line, transposes

AngryPuffer
gik-tally wrote:
AngryPuffer wrote:

all these anti sicilians are trash and non challenging to the black pieces (with the execption of the smith morra gambit.

if you really want to challenge black and go for the kill, then play the open sicilian agianst everything and actually put time into learning it. The open sicilian is the most challenging option that white has and black struggles agianst it. Not to mention but its very fun for both sides and will generate some of the most sharp, dynamic, and fun games. stop trying to avoid the open sicilian and start playing it for yourself. you will find that you will win alot more games.

one last thing to note, if you have trouble with learning lines agianst the dragon, taimanov, najdorf, or whatever, then message me because i know the sicilian very well from hours of study and i can help for free

funny how you trash everything, then espouse a line with mediocre stats. black has a 2% edge in the main line. how does that compare with the 9% plus by move 3 closed variation? you call lines that perform better trash. cognitive dissonant much?

if by open, you mean the prins variation after 4...Nf6 5.f3, then yes, white has some winning chances, but if black does HIS homework and plays the venice attack, there goes your claim out the window and all of a sudden, the open gets the dumpster treatment, and 6.Bb5+ is white's STRONGEST performing line

a well prepared to face the prins black opponent is doing fine against white's main line

roughly equal in the main line and winning in all the sidelines.

play the 5.Nf3 modern main line, and black has NOTHING to worry about, and even has a slight edge in the main lines

yeah... no way i'd drop smith morra for that, and i'd take my chances with the stat crushing closed variation before that. call lines that win trash and promote ones that don't. OK

this is why I don't listen to absolutists and do my own homework.

looking at continuations in the closed, white is winning in EVERY line. if that's "trash", then black is throwing his ratings points out on the curb every monday

relaying on the win rates of 1300's from lichess is not great. the reason why black's win rate is higher in the player database is because the people who are 1000-2000 lichess ranking likely have not studied it as much as black has, but you cannot deny that the open sicilian is the most challenging option. white is better in the open sicilian and black has a harder time equalizing then in one of your corny closed sicilian lines where its probably -0.3

AngryPuffer

according to stats black wins more in the closed sicilian, and white wins more in the open

gik-tally

you lying sack! the stats are right there, and you're DENYING REALITY

get over your DELUSIONS!

you know, ANYONE can go to lichess and see for themselves that I'm telling the truth, and you don't know what the heck you're talking about. i don't have an agenda promoting the closed, i just followed the stats to the wins. stats don't lie, YOU DO.

blueemu
AngryPuffer wrote:

according to stats black wins more in the closed sicilian, and white wins more in the open

That's probably an artifact, though.

Weaker players would be somewhat more likely to play the Closed instead of the Open, when faced by a stronger opponent. And contra-wise, a stronger player will very likely choose to play the Open against a weaker opponent, rather than the Closed.

... so some of that "black wins more in the closed sicilian" will just be attributable to the difference in playing strength.

AngryPuffer
gik-tally wrote:

you lying sack! the stats are right there, and you're DENYING REALITY

get over your DELUSIONS!

you know, ANYONE can go to lichess and see for themselves that I'm telling the truth, and you don't know what the heck you're talking about. i don't have an agenda promoting the closed, i just followed the stats to the wins. stats don't lie, YOU DO.

you lying sack! the stats are right there, and you're DENYING REALITY

get over your DELUSIONS!

you know, ANYONE can go to lichess and see for themselves that I'm telling the truth, and you don't know what the heck you're talking about. i don't have an agenda promoting the open, i just followed the stats to the wins. stats don't lie, YOU DO.

gik-tally

you don't know how to use the site. you're showing GRANDMASTER STATS and you are NOT a grandmaster. GMs stats are MEANINGLESS in the amateur world.

cherry picking stats is a tool liars love.

ANYONE who's used a database can tell those are grandmaster stats just by looking at all the BORING draws.

back to the real world, here's closed stats 2000-2500

HINT: select the lichess tab, then go to the gear icon to the left, and select WHATEVER ratings range you want, like THIS:

please DO fact check me anyone that doesn't believe the stats I post. don't ever take anything anyone claims for granted.

i have NO AGENDA promoting the closed variation other than the FACT it's the most winning line 1600-2000 and still winning 2000-2500, if not still the strongest variation, which might be smith morra

here's the 2000-2500 stats for smith morra for all the trolls that CLAIM it can be refuted

NOPE! winning in EVERY LINE!

only grandmasters can exploit the extra pawn. THAT is the grandmaster database, which the site displays by default. at the GM level, 3.Nf3, the morphy gambit is what you play to win with.

seeing the different results for 1600-2000, 2000-2500 and the 2500+ GM database, you can see WHY GM games are entirely irrelevant in the real world.

VERY INTERESTING! actually, the smith morra DOES win at the gM level, following the main line if white choses 11.Nd5!

if white plays anything else, black wins more. oh, and that's the MASTERS database, my bad, not grandmasters

Xander_is_OkayAtChess

Alright so I've learned a some theory and opening ideas behind a few variations, here's some of my expanded repertoire:

I learned a little bit about the fianchetto line and Smith-Morra gambit but I don't know enough to include it.

I'm still an amateur (1500 on chess.com) so I'm considering the win rates in my rating range.

GM stats would be useful if I was over 2000 but that is not the case.

Thanks for all of the feedback