King's Gambit A Challenge From Ponz

My results as White are very good. I have never lost in CC play. But, here's the problem ... against players with poor knowledge of the KG I win (always), and against players with good knowledge I draw (almost always). That last observation is enough to question my use of it. Against 2300+ I found I simply could not win as White. I use the Goring now in CC.

No particular reason not to play the Kings Gambit as White.  However, I would suggest you do not play this line: 1. e4  e5  2. f4  exf4  3. Bc4 because of the defense starting with 3. Bc4  Nc6  [as per many pages in the book by Shaw]

While I doubt its a true refutation, it does require white to be extremely accurate, and honestly I think his analysis if pretty darn good on it so I won't argue with him on that point too much.

The line 1. e4  e5  2. f4  exf4  3. Bc4  is not "refuted" in that White should lose.  The line is just not a great line for White as very often Black can get a slight advantage and [as jetfighter 13 mentions--White has to be extremely accurate to avoid falling into a losing position]

yes that is true, but black also has to be careful, eg the two Short-Kasparov Games I listed in my research thread on the KG.

To be honest, I never bothered to check Shaw's analysis. 3.Bc4?! d5! is good enough for me: white has to surrender the bishop pair that early for no structural compensation after 4.Bxd5 Nf6, and 4.ed5? Qh4+ is the famous game J. Polgar- Topalov, where Topa blundered and lost in a completely winning position.

3.Bc4 is a secondrate move- end of story.

thanks roi  I think I will "retire" from these exhibitions.  The other one was when I played the black side of the Ponziani [my favorite opening].

I am glad you did not beat me or I would have had to give one of my poems!

Right now my score is 5 wins and 2 draws but here is the poem anyway!

The old gray ponz, he ain't what he used to be

ain't what he used to be--ain't what he used to be

He thought he would make like a bandit

and take on the Kings Gambit

He would grab the pawn

and his competence add on

to what end? A game drawn?

He had delusions of grandeur

that his play as a centaur

would run up a big score

 but his play was so poor

 he could use a public defender

In this kind of chess

he must confess

he was not a success...

Another result   ChessKingdreamer  1/2  ponz111 1/2

It turns out that [by mistake} this was set up as a rated game.  When this was discovered I contacted staff and he suggested to make the game a draw and then we would have the option of playing an unrated centaur game from the current postion.

My communications with ChessKingDreamer were not clear. In any event I  I made my 16th move and offtered a draw and he accepted which I think was a fair result.  He is the 2nd person not to lose to this sequence of moves:  1. e4  e5  2. f4  exf5  3. Nf3  g5

So 4 wins with this variation and 2 draws but oe game left with the variation.

Also, Luft Waffles drew against 1. e4  e5  2. f4  exf4  3. Nf3  d5  

There was one game with 1. e4  e5 2. f4  exf4  3. Bc4 where I gained only a very slight advantage but eventually won.

Here is the game with ChessKingdreamer vs ponz111

One game left and here are the moves so far:

RRM888 vs ponz111

Will have more comments when this last game is finished.

This Challenge to the King's Gambit is now over.  I played Black in all games and chess engines were allowed and encouraged.  Thus is was "Centaur Chess"

Final score  Ponz111 won 4 games    drew  3 games with no losses.

Here is the last game, just finished:

RRM888  vs ponz111

Cannot give the moves now but will do so later.

Here are results per variation

1. e4  e5  2. f4  exf4  3. Nf3  d5  game eventually drawn LuftWaffles White

1. e4  e5  2. f4  exf4  3. Bc4  Nc6 4. d4  Nf6   This game Black had a very slight advantage for a long time.  Finally Black got a good advantage and White lost on time.  There was plenty of play left at the end.

Here is the line most often played:

1. 1. e4  e5  2. f4  exf4  3. Nf3  g4  4. h4   g4  5. Ne5  Qe7!  in this line Black scored 3 wins and 1 draw.  Chess King Dreamer did draw against this line.

This line was played in the last game which I will give later when my internet working better.

Good job Ponzi!

TY Hopefully this will contribute to the theory of how to play against the King's Gambit.

Congratulations!

Here is the last and 7th game of this King's Gambit Challenge

RM888 vs ponz111

Great job. 

To answer your questions:

I played the strongest chess players I could find up to over-the-board master.

This exhibition was based on both sides using chess engines. A player with a chess engine is stronger than chess engines alone.

In this exhibition we found some very good lines for Black. Lines that can be used over-the-board.

For any opening [including the Kings Gambit in this case], it is not so good to play White knowing there are lines where you get a disadvantage from the opening. [it does not matter if you think the lines stink or not]

The lines are quite easy to play for Black and White has to fight to try and draw.

Black has at least one dozen ways to a good game in the King's Gambit (the counting was done by GM Short, who's playing the white side pretty regularly) and about half of them are in the declined lines: 2...Nc6, 2...Nf6, 2...Bc5, 2...Qh4+, 2...d5 3.exd5 c6, 2...d5 3.exd5 exf4, and so on. To claim "In the KGD, it's a different matter entirely. I think those lines stink for black. It is like giving white an automatic edge."  you need first and foremost a fat arse- else where you could pull that big thing out of?

Finding an easy, risk free edge for Black, isn't an easy task, though.

IMO Black's best chance is in the rather forgotten line 2...exf4 3.Nf3 Nf6! which I may (or may not) analyse in my blog in the foreseeable future.

Oh...and yes. In case someone has not understood that yet: engines are quite useful for analysing. I won't charge you for that piece of info this time... 

Engine use during games: Not even once.

I would love to see an analysis of 1. e4  e5 2. f4  exf4 3. Nf3  Nf6! by pfren or anybody else as I think it gives Black some advantage.