Kings Gambit

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serperior

Hey, can anyone give me some tips on how to play AGAINST the Kings Gambit. It is complicated and I dont know what to play against it. please give some tips. Thanks!!!

Ziggy_Zugzwang

Accepting seems to be best. Then hanging on to it :-) The KGA takes some time to understand IMO. The extra pawn is not only an extra pawn, but part of a wedge into white's kingside. It makes for interesting chess.

I play the Fischer 3...d6 move.Orginally because I'm a fan of his and gradually because it produced very interesting rich positions. Of course other than 1e4 e5 2f4 ef 3Nf3, you need to research 3Bc4.

DrSpudnik

The modern Cunningham Gambit

1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3. Nf3 Be7 4. Bc4 Nf6

BigKingBud

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King%27s_Gambit

ipcress12

I'd say it depends on how much time you want to put into it.

If you accept the gambit, you have to defend both 3.Nf3 and 3.Bc4 as Ziggy points out. In both cases play is rich and complex and White will probably know his side better than you.

Or you can cross White up and come out counterpunching with the Falkbeer Countergambit. 1.e4 e5 2.f4 d5.

Theory gives Black the nod in the Kings Gambit Accepted, while giving Black a lesser edge in the Falkbeer.

If you want to punish White for his presumption, study like hell and accept the gambit.

If you are content with a more comfortable equality, where you are not walking into White's preparation, the Falkbeer is a good choice.

The_Ghostess_Lola

Yes, always play 3...d6!!

The gullible Bobby Fischer swore by it 'cuz he busted the gambit with this one move and it hasn't been valid....since 1961 !

(....finger into throat....) 

tmkroll

Well if someone plays the line from that chesswebsite video just play Bd6 and you're winning. That video is terrible. g5 is the sharpest and will play into your opponent's prep, but it's good if you study it. An early d5 super safe and can be played against the Bishop's Gambit as well as the Knight's. That line seems most popular at the high levels. The Modern Cunningham is probably good idea too. Also you might try some Ne7 stuff. There seem to be many ways off the beaten path where Black is fine if you don't want to study a lot and play into your opponent's prep.

ponz111

The problem with the Kings Gambit is that Black can obtain a slight advantage rather easily against the main line  with 1. e4  e5 2. f4 exf4 3. Nf3  g5!. [note this is not the Fischer Defense]

So, the Kings Gambit will not work against a prepared expert or master.

However, very few players are experts or masters, so the Kings Gambit is ok against more than 99% of all chess players.

ponz111
Najdorfian wrote:
ponz111 wrote:

The problem with the Kings Gambit is that Black can obtain a slight advantage rather easily against the main line  with 1. e4  e5 2. f4 exf4 3. Nf3  g5!. [note this is not the Fischer Defense]

So, the Kings Gambit will not work against a prepared expert or master.

However, very few players are experts or masters, so the Kings Gambit is ok against more than 99% of all chess players.

The King's Gambit has been used by Carlsen and Nakamura with great success.

I would guess they will not play it again.

nescitus

Depends how much preparation You want to put into this fairly rare opening. If not much, then the way to go might well be 1. e4 e5 2. f4 d5 3. exd5 exf4 5. Nf3 Nf6 (main 6th moves being Bc4 and Bb5). This move order has the benefit of side-stepping 1.e4 e5 2. f4 exf4 3.Bc4 lines completely and if White goes wrong, it is easy to counterattack.

The problem is that if the counterattack backfires, White queenside pawn mass becomes dangerous in the endgame.

DrSpudnik
Najdorfian wrote:
DrSpudnik wrote:

The modern Cunningham Gambit

1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3. Nf3 Be7 4. Bb4 Nf6

4. Bb4? Did you mean 4. Bc4?

Thanks, corrected.

tmkroll

The Qh4+ line against Bc4 is what White is hoping for When s/he plays the Bishop out. The King is actually very happy on f1 and White can develop the rook with h4 or castle by hand while the Black Queen will be chased around a bit. The whole point of Bc4 is to provoke the Queen check. That does't mean it's a bad move. It might be arguably best; by all means play it if you like those positions. I think most strong players prefer the plan of Nf6 and c6-d5 in that line. Shaw thinks Nc6 in that position is so good White shoudln't play the Bishop's Gambit but he seems to be alone in that opinion. Also again when White goes g3, f3 closing the Kingside is the response s/he's hoping for but that's a pretty fine point for this kind of thread. There's more than one good book on it as Najdorfian said. The Gallagher might be an easier read but I think it's pretty White leaning if I remember right. The odd thing about the Shaw is the more I read it the more I like Black's chances, so I think it is a great book to learn to play against the gambit, but it's a big chunk of time. The thing is huge.

The_Ghostess_Lola

(Najdorfian #12) The King's Gambit has been used by Carlsen and Nakamura with great success.

Wait a second ....I thought BF busted it with his self-proclaimed double exclamation 3...d6!!

Amazing to me then that these two still play it....hmmm.

DrFrank124c

The Falkbeer Counter Gambit-- 1. e4 e5 2. f4 d5--also gives interesting results!

ipcress12

What gets me is that black has so many viable defenses, and only needs to learn one. White needs to get his theory on for several. Thus, the ratio of useful preparation time is heavily weighted in black's favour.

Point taken -- if Black knows White will play the King's Gambit.

The big picture though is that Black must also prepare for White's Ruy, Scotch, Piano, Bishop's, Vienna, Evan's Gambit, Goring's Gambit and maybe even a full Danish.

Given that the KG is played only a few percent of the time even at the class level and that opening knowledge decays unless periodically refreshed, there's a good chance Black is going to be blurry on his KG defense, while White probably reviewed his lines the night before.

ponz111
ipcress12 wrote:

What gets me is that black has so many viable defenses, and only needs to learn one. White needs to get his theory on for several. Thus, the ratio of useful preparation time is heavily weighted in black's favour.

Point taken -- if Black knows White will play the King's Gambit.

The big picture though is that Black must also prepare for White's Ruy, Scotch, Piano, Bishop's, Vienna, Evan's Gambit, Goring's Gambit and maybe even a full Danish.

Given that the KG is played only a few percent of the time even at the class level and that opening knowledge decays unless periodically refreshed, there's a good chance Black is going to be blurry on his KG defense, while White probably reviewed his lines the night before.

If Black wants a good defense to the Kings Gambit, if he picks the correct variation, then the preparation time would only be about 3 or 4 hours.  

TheOldReb

One of the most interesting things to me is that of the great KG players (white pieces )  some clearly preferred 3 Nf3 while some preferred 3 Bc4 .  I have played the KG as white over the years and have always preferred 3 Nf3 personally . Black has many good choices against the KG so white has a great deal of work to do if they want to use this opening with any success . I have 3 books on the KG but wish Spassky had written one on it as he was , imo, the foremost expert on the opening . 

ipcress12
ponz111 wrote:

If Black wants a good defense to the Kings Gambit, if he picks the correct variation, then the preparation time would only be about 3 or 4 hours.  

It's not that simple.

It's going to take Black several additional hours to "pick the correct variation." (And what if he picks an incorrect variation?)

Furthermore, as I said, Black will have to periodically refresh those lines and maybe even check for new theory.

All this for an opening Black will only see once every year or two in tournament play.

At the class level this is a lot to expect.

ponz111
ipcress12 wrote:
ponz111 wrote:

If Black wants a good defense to the Kings Gambit, if he picks the correct variation, then the preparation time would only be about 3 or 4 hours.  

It's not that simple.

It's going to take Black several additional hours to "pick the correct variation." (And what if he picks an incorrect variation?)

Furthermore, as I said, Black will have to periodically refresh those lines and maybe even check for new theory.

All this for an opening Black will only see once every year or two in tournament play.

At the class level this is a lot to expect.

I am assuming the correct variations have been picked for him.

Also, there may be a very easy variation to learn and also it would be a variation that could not be upset by new theory.

ThrillerFan
serperior wrote:

Hey, can anyone give me some tips on how to play AGAINST the Kings Gambit. It is complicated and I dont know what to play against it. please give some tips. Thanks!!!

If your desire is simplicity and survival, and you aren't looking to outright refute it, your best bet is the Classical Variation:

1.e4 e5 2.f4 Bc5! 3.Nf3 d6.

It doesn't "bust" the King's Gambit like accepting it does, but it's simple, effective, and gives Black at least full equality.

There is really just one rule of thumb you must keep in mind.  Don't develop your Queen's Knight to c6 until after White has moved his King's Bishop.  After say, 1.e4 e5 2.f4 Bc5 3.Nf3 d6 4.Nc3, 4...Nc6 is a mistake because of 5.Bb5!, which is very strong.  But after say, 1.e4 e5 2.f4 Bc5 3.Nf3 d6 4.Bc4 (or 5.Bc4, then doing it move 5 is fine), here 4...Nc6 is perfectly fine because if White now wants to pin you, he has to waste a move doing it, and you can put the extra move to good use.