simple defense for queen's pawn opening needed

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Benoni defense and King's Indian are too complicated and long term.  I like how the Scandinavian defense is simple and tractable but flexible, and also siezes control of initiative for Black. However it is in response to King's pawn openings.  So I need something analogous for Queen's pawn.  Doesn't necessarily need to feature the Black Queen early on, though (although it could).  (Should also neutralize Queen's gambit from white.)

phyxius

interesting game involing simple defense for queen's pawn opening needed

Slav55

I don't think there is a queen's pawn opening that plays quite like the scandinavian, but I would suggest the albin counter-gambit.

This can be complicated tactically, but does not tend to have the carefully planned and percisely timed counterattack that the king's indian and Benoni require.  Black's development is also much easier and freer than in other lines.  It keeps some of the spirit of the scandinavian with the early simplification in the center and gives the initiative to black.  On the other hand, it does cost a pawn, but it may be worth it.

lastwarrior2010

this is very simple

Elubas
Slav55 wrote:

I don't think there is a queen's pawn opening that plays quite like the scandinavian, but I would suggest the albin counter-gambit.

 

This can be complicated tactically, but does not tend to have the carefully planned and percisely timed counterattack that the king's indian and Benoni require.  Black's development is also much easier and freer than in other lines.  It keeps some of the spirit of the scandinavian with the early simplification in the center and gives the initiative to black.  On the other hand, it does cost a pawn, but it may be worth it.

 


Don't recomend an unsound opening! It's unreliable and although black can sometimes get the initiative, if white avoids the traps (like an early e3) he can play in a way that black gets little for the pawn. And it's not simple! If black expects to win like this he better be able to calculate better than white.

By the way, the scandinavian does not by any means give black the initiative. After the main line e4 d5 exd5 Qxd5 Nc3 Qa5 d4 white has some more central space and a knight already developed, so it's really he who has the quiet initiative. But it's solid and simple, I just don't see how it seizes the initiative.

pvmike

the albin-counter gambit is fine, for someone at your level being a pawn down isn't fatal, you'll have plenty of chances to regain the material in the middle game. 

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Thanks experts.  I will analyze the above suggestions carefully.  Interestingly the first two times I played Scandanavian was yesterday, and I won on both of them, with white declining the queen's pawn.  The next three times I played, the pawn was accepted and I loss. 

OMGdidIrealyjustsact

I've always had trouble deciding on a defence to d4. You need a lot of strategic skill to play well from both sides so I don't think an easy/simple opening will present itself.

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lastwarrior2010 [#4]:  Looks to be "Queen's Gambit Declined: Orthodox Defense, Rubinstein Variation Flohr Line" through the first 8 moves.

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Ran across the following quote regarding the Albin countergambit: "This reprehensible pawn sacrifice is frowned upon in every single theoretical manual available and yet Black continues to win a lot of games! Some very attractive effects are possible."

lesvertpois

ignore centre open flanks for bishops. it is the simple defence even simple is avance centre pawn a square or try to play dutch defence...

Odie_Spud

As lastwarrior2010 suggested the Lasker Defense is simple and solid. You might also consider the Chigorin Defense: 1.d4 d5 2.c4 Nc6. It is better than its reputation, offers a lot of piece play and develops with a direct effect on the center. The number of lines is also somewhat limied.

hicetnunc

QGD Lasker's defence and Albin are both good ideas, though very different in nature (first one is very solid but passive, second one offers free piece play).

I'm curious what variation Elubas has in mind when he says the opening is unsound. It has been endorsed by strong GMs recently, and I think it's better than its reputation...

Myprecious

very interesting and simple

Spiffe

Albin Countergambit is poor.  It's trappy, and you might win some games with it at your level, but ultimately it's not a good opening as you improve.  I have a hard time believing it's been endorsed by "strong GMs".

Chigorin defense is not a bad suggestion.  Something else that has not been mentioned is the Benko Gambit.

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Thanks for all the new suggestions - I will assess all of them.

sableWhist

The Dutch Defense: not too much theory, no QG, and allows for a strong attack on the king side. The Cambridge-Springs Defense can also be quite tactical and has many traps white can fall for. I enjoy both.

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Since I started this thread by talking about the Scandinavian, I can say now after 6 games that I'm not sure I like it. It's too open and not enough defense. I just tried it with the icelandic gambit and that's a little better in the defense department (I won that game). However, its much better for me if the black Queen's pawn is declined by white to begin with.

As far as the the Albin Countergambit the first game I reviewed is pretty impressive for black:

 

http://www.chess.com/games/view.html?id=43946

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It looks like a big part of the lasker is considered the standard QG defense, and cambridge springs is directly related to that as well.  The Binko and chigorin were comprehensible also.  Couldn't find any good videos on the Dutch though.

playe4

Hi

I have asked just that question too! What to play against 1 d4 ?

I have played the Slav, the SemiSlav, Benoni etc etc. All of those are fine (if you know what you are doing!) but not simple.

So for a simple response I recommend 1. d4 e6

I quite like this because amazingly some opponents reply 2.e4 which can then transpose to one of my favourite 1.e4  defences-the French defence (ie 1 d4 e6 2 e4 d5).

Otherwise often the opponent will play 2. c4 and you can play Nf6 and then you can go for a simple Queen's Gambit game. Many good players have played this way (lots of GM's- just search any database for 1d4 e6 & see!0.

As an example here is a fantastic GM game from yesteryear:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hope this helps

Ricardo_Morro

By its nature the queen's pawn opening is more sophisticated than the king's pawn and lends itself more to positional play rather than tactical. To avoid having to learn a lot of opening lines against the queen's pawn, I play Dutch Defense. I play the Leningrad variation because the first several moves can be made by rote almost regardless of what White does; so I do not have to think until the opening is well advanced.