The Catalan belongs to the classical school of openings, not the hypermodern one.

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Avatar of Uhohspaghettio1

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As we all know a hypermodern opening is where a player attempts not to occupy the center with pawns, but to control it from afar with pieces. The Catalan occupies it with pawns - so what's the problem?

The Indian defences are examples of hypermodern openings. The Larsen or the Reti would be examples of hypermodern openings for white. 

So why is the Catalan ever lumped in with the hypermodern openings? Is it the fianchetto, is that the problem? The centre is already occupied by white's pawns and white is trying to keep up pressure on the central squares - in pure classical style.  

White fianchettoes his bishop all the time in main lines of the Queen's Indian or Bogo-Indian - does this mean white is now playing hypermodern just because he has fianchettoed his bishop? Is the closed sicilian or vienna with g3 all hypermodern? I find it hard to imagine how or why the likes of Steinitz or Tarrasch would believe fianchettoing the bishop, even when it's clearly a good idea, was not part of their classical theory of chess. Bd3 is blocking the queen's control of d4 and making a threat on h7 that may not be of any use - hardly an intrinsic tenet of the classical school, which emphasizes central above all. 

What's more in the Catalan White very often plays e3 or e4 in the main lines. It's not like how black tries to avoid moving his e-pawn when he fianchettoes kingside, white's e-pawn is often very active.  

I feel like the only reason the Catalan was ever called a hypermodern opening is because Tartakower first developed it for a tournament in Barcelona in 1929, and Tartakower was very much into the hypermodern school of thought, even writing an influential book on it.   

  

Avatar of llama44

Don't all hypermodern openings put a pawn in the center sooner or later?

I don't really know, I've never thought about it.

Avatar of Uhohspaghettio1
llama44 wrote:

Don't all hypermodern openings put a pawn in the center sooner or later?

I don't really know, I've never thought about it.

Not all - the Grunfeld plays d5 but it's liquidated immediately, the Benoni/Benko defences also don't get much of a pawn centre. 

Black puts pawns in the center in the Nimzo-Indian and KID but I guess the idea is they have used a hypermodern opening to force white into a favourable position where they can now use the more traditional technique of trying to occupy the centre. The Catalan is relying on classical technique from the start.   

A good illustration of the fundamental difference of fianchetting the kingside when you have the centre occupied and controlled by pawns vs when you fianchetto it and allow the opponent to occupy it with pawns is how play is in them both - the former is usually quiet and strategic while the latter becomes full of unfathomable tactics. 

Avatar of llama44

Ok, so, by your own admission, all the hypermodern openings you can think of put a pawn in the center... which of course fundamentally and totally undermines your OP.

Good to know.

Avatar of Uhohspaghettio1

Ah I see your Mr. Hyde side is raising its ugly head again. If you don't think hypermodern vs classical theory is a meaningful concept then that's fine but don't troll other people who wish to talk about it. Don't be a troll. 

Avatar of llama44

Ok, sorry.

Avatar of KovenFan

The pawns in the center must not always come before the fianchetto. The Catalan is definitely reachable from 1.Nf3 or 1.g3.

Avatar of ThrillerFan

I do not own the book any more, but an old book from the 90s called "Winning with the Hypermodern" by Raymond Keene had a checklist of 3 rules that defined a hypermodern opening.  It was that no central pawn was advanced more than 1 square early, at least 1 bishop was fianchettoed, and I do not recall the third.  I remember thinking there was some contradiction because not all Nimzo lines see ...b6 and not all Alekhine lines see ...g6.

 

Then I remember wondering in 1996 how a book "Beating the Flank Openings" had 5 chapters.  History on various flank openings, 2 chapters on the English, and 2 chapters on the Catalan, and almost every Catalan game in there was 1.d4 by White.

 

So yes, the Catalan violates the rules of Hypermodern strategy if you go strictly based on what Keene said, but his definition I think is also somewhat off because I have seen Nimzo games with Black Bishops on b4 and d7, and some lines with an early d5, like 4.f3 d5.

Avatar of darkunorthodox88

the mistake here to assume hypermodern vs classical openings are a discrete binary. They arent,not only is there is plenty of overlap in some openings (for example, is the g3 vienna,, a classical opening or a hypermodern opening?)  but the hypermodern school is merely an extension of classical thought.