Which is better, Bird's or English?

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BananaGelato

Hello. Recently, I have started to pick up chess. While my middle game could use some work, I usually think that it is because of my horrible pawn structure. To climb ratings I wanted to use a unique opening that not many players would know how to respond to. My play style is very er... odd, so I do not know whether I should use Bird's or English as my opening. Thank you in advance if you choose to give advice (because otherwise, I'm stuck playing bongcloud for all my life).

ThrillerFan

English by a landslide!

BananaGelato

Ok thanks. I'll check out some vids on it

JoshuaBok

English is more sound, indeed. The nature of the English Opening, however, is highly flexible and can lead to many transpositions. If you choose to pursue the English (which I encourage!), be sure to:

- Have a sturdy look at  the Symmetrical (1. ...c5), which can lead to several other openings such as the QGD or the Open Sicilian. Be sure to map out your lines: do you want to break early with d2-d4? Do you want to fianchetto? 

- The Reversed Sicilian (1. ...e5) is a different beast to tackle when playing the English. Less transpositions and having more of its own theory, it can be quite challenging to master.

- Have a flexible plan when faced with other 'flexible' replies such as 1. ...Nf6, 1. ...g6, 1. ...c6 or 1. ...e6. Be prepared to try and 'steer' the opening towards something you are comfortable playing. For instance: If you open with 1. c4 e6 2. g3 d5 you can reply with a number of moves, but if you're comfortable playing the Catalan you can immediately reply with 3. d4 and work your way from there. Perhaps not the best or most illustrative example, but it will do the trick for now.

 

Bird's Opening, on the other hand, requires you to study From's Gambit closely (before losing yourself in that mayhem!), but aside from that sharp play there is a number of ways to employ 1. f4. You could go with a Reversed Leningrad Dutch with 2. g3, you could try out the Stonewall Attack with c3-d4-e3-f4, you can control the e5 square with the b3-Bb2 system or you could try a quiet approach with Nf3-e3-Be2-d3 and castling short. The only downside of the Bird (and hence why the English is more encouraged!) is that your kingside is weakened and more exposed. 

Hope this helped!

BananaGelato

It did. Thank you so much

Fromper

Grandmasters play the English a lot more than the Bird, which still doesn't answer your question. Really, the words "better" and "best" get thrown around a lot in talking about chess openings, but they have absolutely no meaning to anyone whose first name isn't "Grandmaster".  

Instead of answering your question, I'm here to tell you that you're asking the wrong question.

As you said, you're still a beginner. You may think your play style is odd, but it isn't. You don't have a play style. Play style might start to matter when you reach 2000+ rating, but the rest of us just have a collection of weaknesses, not a style.

The most common recommendation for beginners is to stick to both sides of 1. e4 e5, because it will lead to the types of open games where you can learn about tactics and attacking. Until you learn those things, you have no business worrying about the more subtle positional play that comes from closed openings like these. All closed games open up eventually, so you need to learn to play open positions before playing closed ones.

So stick to 1. e4 e5 until you're rated at least 1600 online (maybe 1400 OTB). Answer anything other than 1. e4 as black by advancing a center pawn two squares. 

 

KajaMarieSnare

The birds opening isn't very good. It's just a demonstrable fact. Look up the statistics. 

BananaGelato

@Fromper Thanks for the advice. I asked this because I was bored of the Giuoco Piano but I'll stick to it till I get better :D

Fromper
BananaGelato wrote:

@Fromper Thanks for the advice. I asked this because I was bored of the Giuoco Piano but I'll stick to it till I get better :D

It doesn't necessarily have to be the Giuoco Piano. If you're bored with that, try the Scotch, the King's Gambit, the Danish Gambit, the Goring Gambit, etc. There are plenty of lines to try just in 1. e4 e5 openings. 

BananaGelato
Fromper wrote:
BananaGelato wrote:

@Fromper Thanks for the advice. I asked this because I was bored of the Giuoco Piano but I'll stick to it till I get better :D

It doesn't necessarily have to be the Giuoco Piano. If you're bored with that, try the Scotch, the King's Gambit, the Danish Gambit, the Goring Gambit, etc. There are plenty of lines to try just in 1. e4 e5 openings. 

(xQc flashbacks) Sure I'll check those gambits out

annxe2010

Well English is played more often because it dominates the center and creates no weaknesses, but I generally prefer bird. The bird opening leads to a reversed dutch, and I really like compromising on king safety to gain some center space. Your center is a lot more important then closing the short diagonal. 

tygxc

If you play Sicilian as black, then English, if you play Dutch as black then Bird.

Mpirani
tygxc wrote:

If you play Sicilian as black, then English, if you play Dutch as black then Bird.

this makes no sense. The Sicilian is an opening against e4, the Dutch is an opening against d4.

StumpyBlitzer

I think the English because at higher levels the bird gets destroyed and English is solid and played at master level 

Mpirani
BananaGelato wrote:

Hello. Recently, I have started to pick up chess. While my middle game could use some work, I usually think that it is because of my horrible pawn structure. To climb ratings I wanted to use a unique opening that not many players would know how to respond to. My play style is very er... odd, so I do not know whether I should use Bird's or English as my opening. Thank you in advance if you choose to give advice (because otherwise, I'm stuck playing bongcloud for all my life).

I would suggest the bird, which seems a little unusual but my reasoning is that if you're playing f4 or c4, you're probably trying to avoid a ton of opening theory, and against c5, you will often face the kings indian defence, which is one of the most theoretical openings there is. Up to you, but between the two I feel as though I'd rather not play against the kings indian, especially if your opponent knows their theory.

Mpirani
StumpyBlitzer wrote:

I think the English because at higher levels the bird gets destroyed and English is solid and played at master level 

I feel as though those "facts" should be taken with a grain of salt. The Scandinavian defence isn't played much at top levels either, doesn't make it a bad opening in any way, it's just sub-optimal. If your opponent knows all their theory, it's still equal. 

Marcyful

English by a milestone

adityasaxena4

English by a universe as you can always transpose to a Vampire or an Indian Game : Accelerated Variation or a Modern Defence : Three Pawns Attack with 2.f4! or to a Modern Defence : Three Pawns Attack or to a Modern or to an English Opening : Symmetrical Variation , Wing Gambit with the Bird there are very little if no transpositional options except maybe to a Vampire or a Kings Gambit and the Bird Opening opens the king in a very unsafe manner which requires a lot of defence to make sure you aren't lost yet!

ZastilZastol
Bird’s opening is unexplored and many players don’t play it because of this. There are many lines that we do not now. Some of the greatest players, like Magnus, sometimes play it. I think that someday Bird’s become classical.
0000000000000zx

English is better