Why does the Nimzo-Indian fare better than the Tarrasch?

I'm thinking of two lines that result in similar pawn structures, yet the Nimzo line is played at the top level far more often, and has a bit better win % for black. 

Tarrasch:

White: 40 Draw: 40 Black: 20

Nimzo:

White: 34 Draw: 42 Black: 24

 Edit: Percentages are from an online database, for these exact positions. I realize 6% isn't a huge difference, and that win % are kind of arbitrary, but it's a big enough difference to spark my interest that such a minor change -the placement of the bishop on g2 vs d3- is apparently so important for both success and popularity of each position. 

The tarrasch is actually !?, white can get a clear cut advantage in most lines, at least that is my understanding.

However the theory is obviously quite difficult to memorise, so below GM level it is 100% good and really gives black some nice prospects.

The nimzo on the other hand is 100% solid, black runs much less risk and can equalise much of the time, which is all top GMs really want in an opening as black.

Also note white gets to fianchetto in the tarrasch, while in the line you posted white made the concession of e3 and therefor does not have as active counterplay.

The white bishop on g2 attacks the black isolani and ties down pieces to it's defense, and there's no kingside attack in that Tarrasch line. The bishop can go to e3 or g5. In the Nimzo line the black bishop is locked in, and the white bishop actually isn't very active on d3 and might even be misplaced after Bg4.

What's wrong with the 2nd picture? A: The KB is not bearing down on the IQP from g2 and the QB is hemmed in by e3, although I suppose it will eventually end up on b2.

BUT according to your unattributed stats, White's winning percentage is 60% in the 1st diagram and 56% in the 2nd - which doesn't strike me as being extremely significant without knowing all sorts of other minor details, like whichworld-class GMs play the openings here as Black and how recently these lines have been played. And the winning percentages can vary wildly from move to move depending on what is played at each turn. Ergo I'd just as soon play the Tarrasch IF I felt comfortable with it and felt I knew more about it than the NID. 

Spassky used the Tarrasch as Black vs Petrosian in the 1969 WCH succesfully BTW, although I suppose that's ancient history by now.

I believe kasparov was very fond of it as well, but once karpov (i think?) started getting good positions against him he abandoned it.

For whatever reason the diagram positions in b3nnyhaha's first post are not coming up on my computer - so Im not sure whether the original question is specifically about those particular positions or about the 2 openings in general.

Ive played the Nimzo a lot as black and Ive played against it a lot as white and Ive also played against the Tarrasch a lot as white too. To my mind, the main difference lies in the structural (pawn) weakenesses in the 2 openings. In the Nimzo, white generally has the isolated pawn or the doubled c-pawns (ie white has the structural weakenesses) while in the Tarrasch, black has the isolated pawn or hanging pawns (ie black has the structural weaknesses).

While these structural weaknesses dont necessarily mean that the position is worse, the do make the position harder to play - and thus when you play with (rather than against) an isolated pawn for instance, you tend to use more clock time and you pretty much HAVE to get some sort of advantage before the endgame. When you play against the isolated pawn (or other structural weakness) you have the option of exchanging down to an endgame.

In other words, while the position may not be technically worse, when playing with a structural weakness, the position will usually be harder to play. And in a hard position, its easier to make mistakes and thus its easier to lose.

So while the Nimzo is very easy to play against an opponent of similar strength (regardless of ones level), the Tarrasch is much harder to play accurately - and unless you are someone who feels very very comfortable playing in very open dynamic positions or unless you are Kasparov or a player of his level, the Tarrasch will be generally much harder to play than the Nimzo...

Hope this makes sense.

Cheers, FM Grant Szuveges

For whatever reason the diagram positions in b3nnyhaha's first post are not coming up on my computer -whiterino

Sometimes the dam diagrams just take forever to load, try hitting the reload button. If that doesn't help here's some more things you can try, although it's probably just a temporary glitch

http://www.chess.com/blog/NimzoRoy/diagnosing-and-fixing-internet-problems?_domain=old_blog_host&_parent=old_frontend_blog_view

whiterhino - I think chess.com gives free premium memberships to titled players.

Really? So where does that leave me? What do I get as part of the premium membership? I assume that Id have to prove that I am who I say I am but I can do that easily. Tell me more! I only really started posting on here to publicise my youtube videos. This info could really help me actually!

Cheers, Grant

Maybe send it to me in a private message so it doesnt clog up this thread

i have a theory that the tarrasch is played by many players that dont know what they are doing with it while the nimzo is easy enough to understand how to play that most people get it which gives tarrasch worse stats. i think a good tarraschplayer can make life tricky for white in a sound way

Yeah I reckon thats a sound theory: It supports the argument that it is harder to play a position with structural weaknesses than it is to play a position against structural weaknesses.

I think this thread talks about it some:

http://www.chess.com/forum/view/premium_members/free-membership-for-nm

See post 5 for the link to get it.

I want to send it in the thread - I get points!!!

hahaha

Ive figured out how to do it but thanks anyway. In a day or two my name should have my FM title with it. Ive just got to photocopy and scan my passport and give them my FIDE number I think.

Black has a space advantage. First black plays 15...h6 to prevent the knight from moving. Then Black plays Be6 and Rad8 and gets a good game.

Ive just sent them a scan of my passport - how long does the process usually take?

I don't know, I've never done it - being rated only about 1700 USCF (2200 qualifies you for the membership).

I'm interested in this position - does black have any advantage, or are pieces necesarry to take advantage of the isolated pawn.