Fischer had the best 2 years in a row EVER!!! Prove me wrong.

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JamieDelarosa
fissionfowl wrote:
JamieDelarosa wrote:

You are a chess player, not a nincompoop.  Try searching for "Bobby Fischer IQ."  You will get lots of hits.

I'm aware of such sites. All I've seen just say stuff like 'he reportedly had an IQ of 181' without providing any evidence. If you can't name any source that does provide evidence then I can presume you haven't seen anything that isn't just made up.

I gave you the source -Fischer biographer Frank Brady, and I told you where the documentation can be found

buzzboltx2478ace

ok

 

fissionfowl
JamieDelarosa wrote:

I gave you the source -Fischer biographer Frank Brady, and I told you where the documentation can be found

No, you wrote: "The source of the information is Fischer's biographer, Frank Brady, who reported that while Bobby was still a student at Erasmus High School, NYC, aged 15, he sat for a Stanford-Binet test."

So are you now saying that the 180-190 figure comes from Brady? Your original post and 2nd reply  say the figure comes generally from the internet.

JamieDelarosa
fissionfowl wrote:
JamieDelarosa wrote:

I gave you the source -Fischer biographer Frank Brady, and I told you where the documentation can be found

No, you wrote: "The source of the information is Fischer's biographer, Frank Brady, who reported that while Bobby was still a student at Erasmus High School, NYC, aged 15, he sat for a Stanford-Binet test."

So are you now saying that the 180-190 figure comes from Brady? Your original post and 2nd reply  say the figure comes generally from the internet.

Search for a blog on this site entitled "The Mind of Bobby Fischer."  It contains a section taken from Brady's 1975 book.  It was posted by "maricheri" in Feb 2018.

"I wrote, "In an article written by Brady, reported at BobbyFischer.net ..."

fabelhaft
fissionfowl wrote:
JamieDelarosa wrote:

I gave you the source -Fischer biographer Frank Brady, and I told you where the documentation can be found

No, you wrote: "The source of the information is Fischer's biographer, Frank Brady, who reported that while Bobby was still a student at Erasmus High School, NYC, aged 15, he sat for a Stanford-Binet test."

So are you now saying that the 180-190 figure comes from Brady? Your original post and 2nd reply  say the figure comes generally from the internet.

There is no named source since it is just an estimate, according to Brady. The original quote from page 22 of Profile of a Prodigy:

"Recently, I spoke to a professor who used to work in the Grade Advisor's Office at Eramus Hall while Bobby was a student there. 'His I.Q. was definitely in the 180s,' he said. 'Give or take a point or two. He was definitely a "high" genius, but with no interest or capacity for schoolwork.'

The thing with “give or take a point or two” shows that it is an estimate (made after Fischer had become a famous chess player) and the person that is supposed to have made said estimate isn’t even named, so not much to go by.

fabelhaft

Chess players and IQ is a subject in itself. Fischer famously objected to being called a chess genius and meant that he was an all around genius who happened to play chess. Kasparov would probably not express himself the same way, but when it comes to history and politics and computers etc I think he sees himself as quite bright, and maybe isn’t too far from Fischer’s self assessment.

Carlsen is a bit different in that respect and really knows his limitations: ”My father is considerably more intelligent than I am”. But when it comes to chess alone he was never humble. In an interview 3 1/2 years before winning the World Championship he said that he was clearly superior to Kasparov with regards to assessing positions and finding the necessary plan (while Kasparov was better at calculating and openings). He said he didn’t want to know his IQ and that the result might come as a nasty surprise, and that someone like GM Nunn was enormously more intelligent than him.

Damonevic-Smithlov

I'm thinking that at one point Carlsen was about 80 above the #2. Somebody might wanna check that. 

In this era that's amazing.... if that's the case. 

buzzboltx2478ace

 

JamieDelarosa
fabelhaft wrote:

Chess players and IQ is a subject in itself. Fischer famously objected to being called a chess genius and meant that he was an all around genius who happened to play chess. Kasparov would probably not express himself the same way, but when it comes to history and politics and computers etc I think he sees himself as quite bright, and maybe isn’t too far from Fischer’s self assessment.

Carlsen is a bit different in that respect and really knows his limitations: ”My father is considerably more intelligent than I am”. But when it comes to chess alone he was never humble. In an interview 3 1/2 years before winning the World Championship he said that he was clearly superior to Kasparov with regards to assessing positions and finding the necessary plan (while Kasparov was better at calculating and openings). He said he didn’t want to know his IQ and that the result might come as a nasty surprise, and that someone like GM Nunn was enormously more intelligent than him.

All measures of "intelligence" have a degree of uncertainty and are, thus, best expressed as a range.  I think the strength of Brady's analysis comes not from his "hearsay" reporting of statements of a social scientist who had access to Fischer's confidentisl school records, but of the anecdotal accounts of Fischer's extraordinary skills.

Chessnut_Cael_300

I expected the article to be shorter but...oh, well. I didn't know a whole lot about Fischer until now. I will be surprised if anyone does find a GM with a better two years of Chess.

Thank you very much. 🙏🏾🙂

CrassJack
SpartanYoda wrote:

being world champion is one thing, but how much better you are than your contemporaries should also be part of the equation in the eternal debate of the “greatest”...

 

But arguing a person is the greast because of how dominant they were kind of depends on the other players of their era. 

JamieDelarosa

I get around.

JamieDelarosa

CallingAllTals, can you please stop spamming the topic?

JamieDelarosa

I enjoy quality spam.  But it has to have a certain panache.  CallingAllTals is just a troll.

JamieDelarosa

It was said by John "Bugsy" Blythe

 

SpartanYoda can just do us all a favor and block CallingAllTals.  Problem solved

JamieDelarosa
Itude wrote:

No it wasn't, it was said by John "Bugsy" Blythe at my old Grammer School

Whenever one of us was asked a question and we said "I think"

He would stop us and say " You aren't capable of the process lad"

That's what I said.  Bugsy was a real joker..

JamieDelarosa
Itude wrote:

Ha ha I know your tricks Madame

That's a £20 fine for editing your answer !

Moi???

quietheathen1st
CrassJack wrote:
SpartanYoda wrote:

being world champion is one thing, but how much better you are than your contemporaries should also be part of the equation in the eternal debate of the “greatest”...

 

But arguing a person is the greast because of how dominant they were kind of depends on the other players of their era. 

Very true

JamieDelarosa

According to Chessmetrics (Jeff Sonas), during the time Fischer was the top-ranked player (Feb-1964 to Apr-1965, and Aug-1966 until afterthe 1972  Spassky match), Botvinnik, Smyslov, Tal, Petrosian, and Spassky all ranked variously in the Top-5.  Not to mention perennial championship candidates like Korchnoi and Keres.

quietheathen1st

The Fischer elo rating deal is really not that impressive when u know that he had been the highest rated since 64, and was never the strongest in the world until 71. Almost all the games that Fischer and spassky played before 72, Fischer had the higher rating and still lost or drew.