All you people are crazy. The roman army was freaking amazing, but It wouldn't stand a chance against Napoleon let alone the Modern U.S. army. What on earth makes you think Fischer could could beat superior technology and overall chess knowledge that Josh had?
A spurious argument. Bobby and Josh had the same weapons.
I´m trying to make a similar argument, to the one defended here:
Those saying that Fischer doesn´t have a chance because of all the knowledge that Waitzkin received from the past masters and the technology would defend this:
GM Shaked Tal would defeat Karpov because he received all the knowledge that Karpov had.
Shaked Tal has a 2468 elo similar to Waitzkin 2464, and is 2 years younger.
Since Karpov is the next champion after Fischer, then we could apply the same logic.
Would those people say that Shaked can defeat Karpov?
Sorry about the english, but all this time travelling and hypothetical scenarios require a difficult grammar for me.
Joke thread? When, with the exception of Nakamura, did the US produce a grandmaster who could compete with the top 20 or so?
Yes.
Yasser Seirawan was born in Damascus, but emigrated to the US when he was seven. He didn't start playing chess until he was 12 or 13. The US "produced" him
Also, there was Larry Christiansen, who tied for first with Karpov at Linares in 1981.
There have been others, but those are two Americans who competed in the top 20 in the world.
Gata Kamsky, who is American, is also competing in the top 20. One could argue that the US did not "produce" him, but he has played most of his career as an American.
All you people are crazy. The roman army was freaking amazing, but It wouldn't stand a chance against Napoleon let alone the Modern U.S. army. What on earth makes you think Fischer could could beat superior technology and overall chess knowledge that Josh had?
I seem to recall a retroactive analysis performed once upon a time which revealed the highest rate of engine matching was achieved by Capablanca. I wonder just how much non-opening chess knowledge has really changed over the last 100 years?
were forgeting the big question: how would we get fischer and josh to play when the were both 20?
All you people are crazy. The roman army was freaking amazing, but It wouldn't stand a chance against Napoleon let alone the Modern U.S. army. What on earth makes you think Fischer could could beat superior technology and overall chess knowledge that Josh had?
true, true think about the spanish vs the incas they won with 1000 to 1 odds against them, not because they were stronger or smarter or resiliant, but because they had guns and germs. these were both outside forces that didn't effect at all how good a fighter the spanish were but rather they were an extra reasorce like starting with and extra queen or having help from and engine.
I dont know why you guys always talk about this wunderkind Waitzkin. Where are the unforgettable games of him ?
I can name 10 or more great talents of the last 3 decades who are/where not less good then him.
fischer. waitzkin is only an IM.
On the other hand Josh Waitzkin does have a black belt in martial arts so a 20 year old Josh could have beat up a 20 year old Fischer just not at the chess board.
FISCHER is better than him at chess, obviously
Shaked Tal has a 2468 elo similar to Waitzkin 2464, and is 2 years younger.
Please note. For the record, his first name is Tal and his last name is Shaked.
I was disappointed when I heard Tal Shaked stopped playing competitive chess. He hasn't played since 1999, which is why few of today's young players even know who he is. He works for Google now.
As most players have already stated above, the result wouldn't even be close. Fischer was much, much stronger than Waitzkin. A BETTER question would be to ask who was stronger... Tal Shaked or Josh Waitzkin? And based upon some of Tal Shaked's achievements, I'd have to go with him.
Interesting that both of these young players stopped playing about the same time. If chess were a more prestigious game in the United States, (meaning, if there was more money in it) both of these young talents might still be playing today.
I agree that Josh was not even close to Fischer's level.
Which makes me wonder why aren't more Americans rated among the world's top players? Are most of us too obsessed with sports to bother with chess? Has there been anyone other than Fischer in the last 50 years? I think Morphy played in the 40's or so.
I agree that Josh was not even close to Fischer's level.
Which makes me wonder why aren't more Americans rated among the world's top players? Are most of us too obsessed with sports to bother with chess? Has there been anyone other than Fischer in the last 50 years? I think Morphy played in the 40's or so.
Morphy was in the late 1800s.
I agree that Josh was not even close to Fischer's level.
Which makes me wonder why aren't more Americans rated among the world's top players? Are most of us too obsessed with sports to bother with chess? Has there been anyone other than Fischer in the last 50 years? I think Morphy played in the 40's or so.
Morphy was in the late 1800s.
Yikes - so anyone else in the 20th century? (Reuben Fine I guess; Reshevsky - not sure if he's american)
I agree that Josh was not even close to Fischer's level.
Which makes me wonder why aren't more Americans rated among the world's top players? Are most of us too obsessed with sports to bother with chess? Has there been anyone other than Fischer in the last 50 years? I think Morphy played in the 40's or so.
Morphy was in the late 1800s.
Yikes - so anyone else in the 20th century? (Reuben Fine I guess; Reshevsky - not sure if he's american)
I'm not too up on it, myself, but I do know America sucks at chess in general.
There are lots of American kids now faced with that dilemma. Let's see..pro basketball or chess GM. Hmm.. In fact, I heard Dwyane Wade the other day on TV say - "When I came out of high school they weren't going to let me hoop for Marquette cause of me not doing well on the SAT and that Prop 48 bs. On top of that, my hole life people been teasing me that my momma didn't even know how to spell Dwayne. I was thinking I'd show them that I was smart and be a chess grandmaster. I signed up for chess.com but it was just a bunch of dweebs discussing Fischer vs Kasparov so I went back to hoops"
wow did not know the only option in chess was grandmaster and the only option in sports is Dwayne Wade; actually most sports fans stay home, drink beer, watch football etc; nothing to do with playing sports.
very weak argument; both a red herring and a non-sequitur
There are lots of American kids now faced with that dilemma. Let's see..pro basketball or chess GM. Hmm.. In fact, I heard Dwyane Wade the other day on TV say - "When I came out of high school they weren't going to let me hoop for Marquette cause of me not doing well on the SAT and that Prop 48 bs. On top of that, my hole life people been teasing me that my momma didn't even know how to spell Dwayne. I was thinking I'd show them that I was smart and be a chess grandmaster. I signed up for chess.com but it was just a bunch of dweebs discussing Fischer vs Kasparov so I went back to hoops"
wow did not know the only option in chess was grandmaster and the only option in sports is Dwayne Wade; actually most sports fans stay home, drink beer, watch football etc; nothing to do with playing sports.
very weak argument; both a red herring and a non-sequitur
oops left out false dichotomy
On the other hand Josh Waitzkin does have a black belt in martial arts so a 20 year old Josh could have beat up a 20 year old Fischer just not at the chess board.