Did Chess.com Upgrade the Bots???

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mauriciopastana

So just one more view I had playing some games here, they seem exactly the same bots as the chess.com app bots, they have been up there a long time already and the website seems to be using them from now on, since I played a lot on mobile I can give some differences I spotted.

The ratings are closer to FIDE ratings than before, 1500- elo are harder and very punishing on blunders, but the 1700+ elo are slightly easier than before.

They punish blunders like a savage, but if you get ahead they are more likely to blunder themselves more than before, at least for lower rating bots.

They are much more aggressive than the older bots, if they spot any weaknesses, they go all in on it.

The openings they play exactly as their older counterpart.

overall the ratings being closer is better, but they play much less like real people, they spot blunders and punish them in a way their rating wouldn't allow them to, but they also hang some pieces that in their rating it shouldn't happen, so I think they are worse to play than the older ones since its less human-like.

 

 

redapplesonly
mauriciopastana wrote:

So just one more view I had playing some games here, they seem exactly the same bots as the chess.com app bots, they have been up there a long time already and the website seems to be using them from now on, since I played a lot on mobile I can give some differences I spotted.

The ratings are closer to FIDE ratings than before, 1500- elo are harder and very punishing on blunders, but the 1700+ elo are slightly easier than before.

They punish blunders like a savage, but if you get ahead they are more likely to blunder themselves more than before, at least for lower rating bots.

They are much more aggressive than the older bots, if they spot any weaknesses, they go all in on it.

The openings they play exactly as their older counterpart.

overall the ratings being closer is better, but they play much less like real people, they spot blunders and punish them in a way their rating wouldn't allow them to, but they also hang some pieces that in their rating it shouldn't happen, so I think they are worse to play than the older ones since its less human-like.

 

Wow, thanks for looking into this.  I don't have the expertise to verify your suppositions, but your work sounds spot-on.  Really wish I could be a fly on the wall at chess.com headquarters when they discuss how to tweak the bots.  Would have preferred the retired the old bots and introduced new ones with the new attributes, actually.

 

kemmrich

It would be nice to be able to play "rated" games against the bots.  That way the ratings would seek their own level naturally.

Right now I am starting over with the 1000 level bots -- but they hang their queens way too often.

redapplesonly

Yeah, I'm thinking of resetting all my wins, too.  Its a pity, as a month ago, I was regularly walloping the 1600 bots... now I'm a 1000 player again.  Why didn't chess.com make an announcement?  I thought I suffered a mini stroke, or something...

Killbray

Yeah, I noticed that something had to have changed, because I used to regularly play Isabel (1600) and I won around 50% of the times. The thing about her, as she used to be, is that she had a solid opening and mid game but then she completely sucked at the end game. Now she completely destroys me in the end game.

And Nelson? All that he had about him was a good theory on how to quickly attack with the Queen, but as long as you protected all of his attempts and developed he would then be a joke to beat. Now it's not so easy.

I guess it makes more sense for the bots to be more consistent, but I kinda miss how they were originally.

BabYagun

The skill levels of some bots have recently been updated. Today, their skills have been rebalanced again. I do not disclose the list of these bots in order to avoid biased reviews / opinions.

If you think that a bot is too strong or too weak, please post a saved game link here or send me a private message if you prefer.

BabYagun

> What I've noticed is that some of the bots that are 1200 or 1300 rated are particularly good at playing certain types of games, such as Sicilian Defense positions, but they may be really weak in another area, like the Italian Game, for example

True. Bots have different opening books.

If you want to win more often vs weaker bots you can try unpopular openings.

kemmrich

I am starting off with the 1000 bots again and I think Emir hangs his queen too often.   I just played him 3 times in a row this morning and he lost his queen in all 3 games -- although in the first game, if he had followed up correctly it would have been a better sacrifice (but still not good).  In the other 2 games he just gave it for no good reason (or at least that I could tell).

I am not really moving on until I can beat the 1000's (black and white) with at least 85 accuracy.  I still make too many blunders myself.

redapplesonly
BabYagun wrote:

The skill levels of some bots have recently been updated. Today, their skills have been rebalanced again. I do not disclose the list of these bots in order to avoid biased reviews / opinions.

If you think that a bot is too strong or too weak, please post a saved game link here or send me a private message if you prefer.

Hey Bab,

I'm the original poster of this thread.  I see you are on the chess.com staff, and I just wanted to say that I'm really grateful for your attention and consideration of this topic.  Its nice to know that chess.com is keeping an eye on discussions like these, that makes me feel a lot better about the site.  Much appreciated!

goommba88

hmmm/ I wonder if they also made changes to the bots they also use, when u are supposed to be playing against "real" players in live chess...

 

Martin_Stahl
goommba88 wrote:

hmmm/ I wonder if they also made changes to the bots they also use, when u are supposed to be playing against "real" players in live chess...

 

 

The site doesn't employ bots in live/play

goommba88

M y bad bro, I have heard that some sites do this though

JohnNapierSanDiego

The 1200 rated bot Maria is certainly harder, no doubt about that.

 

How can she be 1200 before, and 1200 now, yet she's significantly harder now?  lol that doesn't make sense.

BabYagun

Guys, please share links to games. If you think that a bot blunders queens too often or became stronger, please show examples.

kemmrich

I didn't keep an accurate count, but it just seemed to me that Emir regularly gave up the queen for no reason (2 out of 3 games?)  I  just did a quick game against Emir and he hung the queen pretty quickly in this game:

Chess: kemmrich vs Emir-Bot - 11500635 - Chess.com 

Here's the PGN, if that makes it easier:

[Event "Emir like to hang the queen"]
[Date "2022.05.16"]
[White "kemmrich"]
[Black "Emir"]
[Result "0-1"]

1. d4 Nf6 2. Bf4 c5 3. e3 g6 4. c3 Bg7 5. Nd2 O-O 6. Bd3 b6 7. Ngf3 Ba6 8. Be2
h6 9. O-O d6 10. e4 Bxe2 11. Qxe2 e6 12. e5 Nd5 13. Bg3 h5 14. Bh4 Nf4 0-1

please_can_i_win_a_game

Bots have definitely been upgraded. Even Jimmy - whom I'd usually play matches with as a punching bag - has now been kicking my butt throughout today. 

What's going on?

Kratuu

Yep, Jimmy (600 adaptive) is now giving me more trouble than Emir (1000).

kemmrich

I did another one with Emir this morning, he hung the queen again:  Chess: kemmrich vs Emir-Bot - 11543645 - Chess.com  

[Event "vs Computer"]
[Date "2022.05.17"]
[White "kemmrich"]
[Black "Emir-BOT"]
[Result "0-1"]

1. d4 Nf6 2. Bf4 c5 3. e3 e6 4. c3 b6 5. Nd2 Bb7 6. Ngf3 h6 7. Bd3 g5 8. Bg3 Bd5
9. O-O Qe7 10. e4 Nc6 11. exd5 g4 12. dxc6 dxc6 13. Ne5 cxd4 14. Nxc6 Qc5 15.
Nxd4 Nd7 16. N4b3 Qd5 17. Be4 Rg8 0-1

kemmrich

I did one with black and Emir did it again (although the queen loss was not that bad for Emir -- but I was just queen hunting).  So that was 3 in a row.

Chess: Emir-Bot vs kemmrich - 11544127 - Chess.com

[Event "vs Computer"]
[Date "2022.05.17"]
[White "Emir-BOT"]
[Black "kemmrich"]
[Result "0-1"]

1. d4 d6 2. c4 Nf6 3. Nf3 c6 4. Nc3 Nbd7 5. e4 Qa5 6. Qc2 e5 7. Be2 Be7 8. O-O
O-O 9. Be3 b5 10. cxb5 cxb5 11. Bxb5 Ba6 12. Rac1 Bxb5 13. Nxb5 Qxb5 14. Rfd1
Nb6 15. dxe5 Rac8 16. exf6 Rxc2 17. Rxc2 Bxf6 18. Nd4 Bxd4 19. Rxd4 Rd8 20. Bf4
Nc8 21. Rd5 Qb4 22. Bd2 Qxe4 23. f3 Qxd5 24. b3 Qf5 25. Bc1 Qxc2 26. Be3 Re8 27.
Bf2 Re2 28. Bg3 Rxg2+ 29. Kh1 Re2 30. h3 Qc1+ 31. Be1 Qxe1# 0-1

mistmade23

hmmm. i think they got weaker. Even this 2k bot plays like a noob wink.png  

https://www.chess.com/game/computer/11544745

To be honest the 1600 bot was even more challenging.