How many of you play games online, but have a physical board right next to you?

You failed to understand the issue with Wesley So - saying taking notes as he did is not possibly of any assistance (equating assistance directly to that of obtaining an advantage) You were proven wrong- his innocent notes totally unrelated to chess moves caused him the forfeiture of a game. You strongly disagreed that notes of any kind could be against the rules - citing examples that in your mind justified taking such notes. You are wrong again in the example of a 2nd board. Your logic has failed you.

That's because taking or using notes is not allowed. Not counting notation of course. Those notes are allowed. Nowhere did I disagree that "notes of any kind could be against the rules". You might be thinking of someone else who might have said that. I asked if notation, which is obviously notes, is allowed. 

I'm sure that using a second board in otb would not be allowed either. The most obvious reason is you already have a real board in front of you, so there is no point in relaying moves to a more convenient format. It's already the most convenient.

A computer screen is different though. It's not 3d, you can't pick up the pieces, it's much harder for people like me, an average 1700 player to visualize a real board with real pieces on a computer screen. When I play online I choose the color and piece options to mimic the board I have in the den but it's still not the same. Also, when relaying moves from the computer screen to the board, there is less chance of a mistake if the computer screen format closely resembles the real board and pieces. 

I'm not a serious chess player. I'm not playing for money, or titles, or anything like that. It's purely for fun which is why most of my games are not online, they are in the den or at a friends house. So I have nothing to gain or lose by NOT playing the exact moves. There are MANY times I have declined a draw in a losing position for me. I would rather the opponent play out the checkmate than have it be a draw. It's the way chess was intended. 

“I'm sure that using a second board in otb would not be allowed either. The most obvious reason is you already have a real board in front of you, so there is no point in relaying moves to a more convenient format. It's already the most convenient.” @ -PG 

This is where your logic fails. For some - as attested to in this thread- find the 3D experience a distraction as they learned on a 2D screen. One poster said he had to stand as the perspective of sitting was hard to adjust to at OTB. Your notion of what is real, what constitutes a “real experience” is singular to you. Your reasoning that one is more real than another - thus making the use of a 2nd board completely OK to use is illogical. Again - an advantage need no be gained for “any kind of outside assistance @ to be technically against the rules. I suggest contacting the Fair Play Team - perhaps in the cheating forum to get set straight by Staff. 
@Monitor is the head guy. Don’t take the advice of any Mod - but go straight to the horses mouth.

(if using a 2nd board is against the rules OTB as you rightly say) and the online experience is supposed to replicate OTB along with it’s rules - yet you manage to rationalize it’s use because of personal convenience and preference?

But the issue is Not solely one of advantages possibly gained  as the sole criteria.

What of Wesley So forfeiting a game for writing down play harder?  Was this of any advantage? Certainly not - but it is against the rules.

Hey guys - I have no issues with the practice. It’s a disadvantage to begin with. The question is - as a new player/ beginner is it a good practice ?

The answer is generally no.
If it helps the learning curve in adjusting to 2D - by all means. But play unrated games or against the bots 

Great ! Play unrated or against the bots and No issues whatsoever exist. Practice to your hearts content.

@TumpaiTubo- try this thought experiment. You are at your Club and playing in a Rated OTB game. Your opponent sets down on the table a 2nd small board and uses it to first make his moves. He claims it should be perfectly OK - as he is not cheating. He has a big online tournament next week and wants to replicate the 2D experience- a much smaller board . The game is rated mind you. Would you be comfortable? The TD certainly would tell the player his board is not allowed.

PG is under the impression that because 3D is somehow more “ real” the practice in the reverse situation now becomes OK. The truth is it is against the rules in both cases. I do not and others do not think the intent is to cheat , for you or anybody else. The rule is a preventative one. It’s a poor habit to get into (unless used for training as you do). But if you want to play rated online games you need to learn to play with but a single board.

There are 1000’s of beginners here - all looking to improve who play unrated games for training purposes. Use your 2nd board for training - a good practice- but not for rated games. You do realize - many longer games end up in a time scramble anyway where the 2nd will have to be abandoned.

It never occurred to me to practice for otb tournaments, but that's a good point. Chess.com has said they want to mimic the real (otb) experience as much as possible. Wouldn't that also include rated games? I don't play otb rated games, but it would make sense when playing against someone here, or another site, to duplicate the real life situation as much as possible. That would include knowing it's a rated game. 

You brought up a good point about a second board at a tournament. If someone wanted to practice for an online tournament, and wanted to relay moves to a computer screen to help practice for online play, I can see where that would not be allowed. Why? The difference is chess.com has said they want to mimic real life play as much as possible. But I've never heard of an otb tournament say they want to mimic online play as much as possible. 

The rule had been quoted several times - Live play No outside assistance of any kind is allowed. The issue for some is they interpret the rule to mean an advantage must be gained to be breaking the rule. Not so. No such language is used.

Yes. The board and pieces themselves are not outside assistance. Using them to analyze IS outside assistance. It's pretty hard to play the game, as it has been played for many hundreds of years, and call that outside assistance. If using a real board and real pieces is "outside assistance" imagine all the other things that could be interpreted as assistance. 

I understand, and agree with your comments about notes. But the difference is taking or using notes is specifically prohibited. It doesn't matter if they are assistance or not. That's not the case here. Here is it NOT specifically prohibited. Imagine prohibiting the very thing that makes the game what it is. It would be like prohibiting basketballs for a basketball game. 

BadBish-

You are missing the point. It is not because of being uncomfortable with a 2D board. I am extremely comfortable with a 2D board - too much in fact. 

Back in the 80's thru the mid 90's (around the time internet chess really took off) I played exclusively OTB chess at chess clubs. Other than playing computers there was no other choice. I was very comfortable with a 3D board. (which as I said in an earlier post is very different for your eyes and your brain. the 3D board is much bigger and requires much more of your peripheral vision). 

Then around 1995 internet chess exploded on the scene. I embraced that and played quite a bit of both internet chess, and OTB chess for about the next 10 years or so. Again, very comfortable with both 2D and 3D boards during this time period. 

Starting around 2005 I have played nearly exclusively internet chess due to other life demands. (family, running a company, being on some boards, etc. )

So for the last 15 years I have become very comfortable with a 2D board, but have dreams of getting back to an actual chess club sometime in the near future. I would like to play again in some OTB tournaments. 

My point in replicating moves (not testing out positions or analyzing games in progress - just simply playing the game the same as if you are on a 2D computer screen) is to re-gain the ability to play well on a 3D board, because I have lost that feel. 

If you are simply replicating moves on a second board - it is no different than using a DGT board. you are not cheating. you are not using assistance, you are not really doing anything different other than just playing chess. Again, we are talking about simply replicating moves on a 3D board so as to simulate playing OTB chess. If anything, it is a slight disadvantage to do so as it consumes time to look over at the screen, make the move on the board, study the board, then make the move on both the board and computer screen. 

The board is NOT being used for analyzing during a game. It is not cheating. 

*1e4_1-0* AMBW

you used to be Morphys-revenge, right?

Interesting. I have seen where at tournaments, like the world championship, a big display is put up where people can see the game without having to look at the actual board and pieces themselves. I wonder if the contestants are prohibited from looking at that screen that is duplicating their game. 

Interesting inquiry. These rules are purposely written in general, broad terms allowing Arbiters to make decisions on individual basis. They themselves do not  always agree. They too become influenced by outside factors.  I have not been involved with TD or arbitration in quite a long spell. I have seen enforcement policies evolve and become more “ by the book”, universally/equally applied. Would not surprise in the least if today’s Arbiters made the reverse decision.

It is perfectly OK for players to look at demonstration boards available for the public. Korchnois issue I think was more about the use of a 2nd private room. Another example would be Anthony Miles. He received permission to play on a stretcher due to a bad back. This included his private masseuse! I can’t imagine it being approved today- a 2nd person closely watching a game and at the same time with hands on the player.

That poses a bit of a problem for the theory that a second, real, board is assistance then. If the game is just being duplicated, move for move, and nothing else is done it would be just like this demonstration board. I didn't know that's what they are called.

I'll bet if the players could see that demonstration board, which is apparently perfectly allowed, but different moves were being tried out, that would be against the rules. 

No, they are not prohibited. I actually worked the demo board  during a WCC quarterfinal match between Karpov and Hjartarsen in Seattle back in 1989. I was standing right next to them as they played, then made the moves on a huge demo board nearby for the crowd in the auditorium watching. Once in awhile either player would get up and stroll around the staGe. They clearly looked a t the demo board often. (theirs was the only game in the auditorium, so they were not looking at any game but their own). carol Jarecki was the chief arbiter during the match.

So, at that time at least, looking at a second board that did nothing other than duplicate the original game, move for move, was not considered assistance? I mean it makes sense to me, but I didn't know there were real life examples of it in tournaments. 

Seems a couple of trolls are way off topic- perhaps trying to hi-hack the thread. The OP needs to block them. Thanks