Super simple noob questions

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sianne99
I've taken the training, played with the bots, and played over 100 puzzles and I'm still confused about a couple things I can't find answers to: 1-Can a pawn put a King in check, or mate him? 2-Where does the piece have to be to mate the King? I thought I read you don't "capture" Kings, but I've put many a piece right up next to him and won a few, but have gotten many more captured by the King because play continued when I thought I had mated him. 3-Why do the puzzles call "Mate" when there is clearly at least one more move left by the opponent or myself that can be made to wiggle out of mate?
sianne99

I'm sorry, TNON, but I really am THAT new to chess and I was kind of looking for more specific answers to my questions. Can you help me out?

manekapa

If a piece or pawn is attacking the king and there are no legal moves to stop the attack, then that's checkmate.

You must either capture the checking piece, block the checking piece, or move the king out of check to stop the check. If you can't, then it's checkmate.

nklristic

King can always take the opponent's piece if it is unprotected. If another opponent's piece defends the opponent's piece that lands next to your king, you can't take it because that would be an illegal move (AKA your king would remain in check which is not allowed).


To checkmate a king, you have to put the king in check and it has to be without legal moves. If the opponent can't go out of check either by taking the piece, or bliocking a check, or moving its king it is a checkmate.

As for number 1, any piece can check/checkmate the king, so the pawn can do it as well.

First an example where you can take the queen.


Let's see another example where you can't take the same queen.



812Superfast

Any piece can deliver a checkmate.  To determine if there is a checkmate you just have to verify if there is a possible move where any of your pieces can stop the "check" with your next move (eg. capturing another piece, by blocking with your piece, by moving away to another square..etc).  If not, then it is mate.

manekapa
nklristic wrote:

For some reason it doesn't allow me to make a diagram, but I will try to explain.

Try clicking on the edit button and then repost.

nklristic
manekapa wrote:
nklristic wrote:

For some reason it doesn't allow me to make a diagram, but I will try to explain.

Try clicking on the edit button and then repost.

Thanks a lot. happy.png This hasn't happened before, but I noticed that it happens for some time now. happy.png

Solmyr1234

White moved his queen.

Now it's Black's turn.

Black will choose a move. let's say Kf7.

Now it's White's turn. - White will capture the black king - Qxf7.

---

If we reach a situation, in which no matter what move Black is playing, in the next move White will capture the black king, then this situation is checkmate (sheikh is dead / collapsing). we don't need to actually see Black making a move, and then White capturing the king.

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Checkmate

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Checkmate_pattern

 

Can a pawn checkmate the king? yes, he takes his crown:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7PmxJZnOkdY

okay, I wanted the old Battle Chess, the 2D one, but... well...

Solmyr1234

Amiga 500 Battle Chess All Death Animations

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ADcEI84wMX0

minute 1:00 - soldier takes king's crown. i Told you.

sianne99

You guys are awesome. The explanations were really clear for me and the videos and animations were really helpful (& entertaining, lol). I think I've got it now. Thank you so much!

sianne99

Actually, one more thing I was wondering... When mating, does the piece have to land (in theory on the next move) exactly on the king? For example, would the knight only mate if he were to "capture" the king on the next move by moving in the L shape exactly (with no other outs for the King)? Or could he land on a square right next to the King? Would the Pawn only be able to mate the King via a diagonal move, with the obvious appearance he would, in theory only, if given a next move (again, assuming no other outs) "capture" so to speak (I know capturing the King does not happen), the King and so on, as in diagonal only for the bishop? Or can they approach check or mate outside their standard regular movements because of proximity to the King? Thanks in advance!

nklristic
sianne99 wrote:

Actually, one more thing I was wondering... When mating, does the piece have to land (in theory on the next move) exactly on the king? For example, would the knight only mate if he were to "capture" the king on the next move by moving in the L shape exactly (with no other outs for the King)? Or could he land on a square right next to the King? Would the Pawn only be able to mate the King via a diagonal move, with the obvious appearance he would, in theory only, if given a next move (again, assuming no other outs) "capture" so to speak (I know capturing the King does not happen), the King and so on, as in diagonal only for the bishop? Or can they approach check or mate outside their standard regular movements because of proximity to the King? Thanks in advance!

By definition checkmate is when the king is attacked AKA in check and there is no move on the board that will get the king out of check.

So no,  a knight or a bishop or a pawn (unless it is placed diagonally as in the example below) next to a king will not put the king in check, therefore it will not be a checkmate.

 



sianne99

nklristic: so in the second diagram, if black chose to move Bd1 instead of the pawn first, the exact same case would apply, as would Re1?

sianne99

Wait! Could Re2 (I meant to say Re2 above) work? Wouldn't that be mate?

theoof11

NO the rook is undefened

theoof11

wait, for the first diagram, yes, second, no

nklristic
sianne99 wrote:

nklristic: so in the second diagram, if black chose to move Bd1 instead of the pawn first, the exact same case would apply, as would Re1?

In the second diagram if you just play Bd1 before that e2 white king can just take the bishop as it is undefended.

And you need to know how each piece work. Bishop on d1 doesn't attack the king that is on e1. Bishop affects squares diagonally in every direction from its own position.

As for the rook question. In the first diagram Re2 is checkmate as the rook is defended by a pawn and king can't go anywhere. In the second diagram Re2 is check but the rook is undefended and can be taken by a king.

I would learn first how the pieces work. Check this out for starters:


https://www.chess.com/learn-how-to-play-chess#chess-pieces-move


There are surely many other resources online to get the hang on how the pieces work.

sianne99

I thought that because the pawn above could move in down to attack on the diagonal in either direction if he attempted to capture the bishop, that would be forcing the king to make a move where he was still going to end up in check (by one of the two pawns), which would be an illegal move. But what you're saying is the bishop can't sit next to the king and have him be in check or mate; he has to be in a diagonal square around the king. That was a part of my confusion in my second question above. Where do the pieces have to land on the kings perimeter, when all other options are null for the king, to be considered valid mates, esp. Pawns (a diagonal square), Knights (an L shape away and where does the tail of the L have to land?) and Bishops (do they need to be exactly on the same diagonal trajectory as the king or are there exceptions in mate)?

nklristic
sianne99 wrote:

I thought that because the pawn above could move in down to attack on the diagonal in either direction if he attempted to capture the bishop, that would be forcing the king to make a move where he was still going to end up in check (by one of the two pawns), which would be an illegal move. But what you're saying is the bishop can't sit next to the king and have him be in check or mate; he has to be in a diagonal square around the king. That was a part of my confusion in my second question above. Where do the pieces have to land on the kings perimeter, when all other options are null for the king, to be considered valid mates, esp. Pawns (a diagonal square), Knights (an L shape away and where does the tail of the L have to land?) and Bishops (do they need to be exactly on the same diagonal trajectory as the king or are there exceptions in mate)?

As I've said, you have a bit of work learning the rules and generally how do the pieces work.


So to sum up, in order to give a check (and of course checkmate), you have to attack a square where the king lies. Every piece attacks differently, so the knight does not attack in the same way as a rook or a queen. Queen next to a king will put the king in check as it attacks diagonally, horizontally and vertically, while knight will not as it attacks differently.


As I've said, look up that link, and try to understand how every piece moves and attacks (the pawn is the only piece that moves in one way and attacks a bit differently). The way pieces attack, in the same way they are giving checks.

sianne99

I really appreciate your time and patience! I will return to the lessons as you suggested. Thank you :D