I wish my school had offered chess. I would've found this great game a lot sooner!
CHESS IN SCHOOLS
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AdorableMogwai wrote:
They say that kids who play chess do better in school, but couldn't that be because parents who put their kids into chess classes place more value on school in general? Parents who think it's important to teach their kids chess would probably also be trying to teach them other things like math and reading. As opposed to parents that don't really care what their kids do and just let them play video games.
If so, there is no real correlation between chess and doing better in school. It is actually just a corelation between parents who get their kids into chess and parents who have an active parenting style, value education, and are likely to doing things to prepare their kids for school.
I let my kids play video games.
My oldest is in 11th grade, has a 4.0 unweighted GPA, has been accepted into the NHS, is taking two college credit courses at the local state college (in preparation for getting his AA BEFORE he actually graduates from HS) in addition to all of his HS courses.
My youngest is in 7th grade, is in all advanced placement courses, has a 3.9 unweighted GPA and has participated for his school in the county Social Studies competition.
Both play sports (swimming and basketball), the oldest has more community service hours than most college students (over 1000 hours), the youngest is in band and has hundreds of community service hours already and neither one wants to play chess even though there are four boards always setup and ready to play around the house.
Does that mean I am a bad parent because I let them play video games and don't force chess on them?
Rsava wrote:
AdorableMogwai wrote:
They say that kids who play chess do better in school, but couldn't that be because parents who put their kids into chess classes place more value on school in general? Parents who think it's important to teach their kids chess would probably also be trying to teach them other things like math and reading. As opposed to parents that don't really care what their kids do and just let them play video games.
If so, there is no real correlation between chess and doing better in school. It is actually just a corelation between parents who get their kids into chess and parents who have an active parenting style, value education, and are likely to doing things to prepare their kids for school.
I let my kids play video games.
My oldest is in 11th grade, has a 4.0 unweighted GPA, has been accepted into the NHS, is taking two college credit courses at the local state college (in preparation for getting his AA BEFORE he actually graduates from HS) in addition to all of his HS courses.
My youngest is in 7th grade, is in all advanced placement courses, has a 3.9 unweighted GPA and has participated for his school in the county Social Studies competition.
Both play sports (swimming and basketball), the oldest has more community service hours than most college students (over 1000 hours), the youngest is in band and has hundreds of community service hours already and neither one wants to play chess even though there are four boards always setup and ready to play around the house.
Does that mean I am a bad parent because I let them play video games and don't force chess on them?
Yes it does. VERY bad! Kidding. I read that video games are supposed to help your brain too.
Sep 15, 2013
0
#25
Conflagration_Planet wrote:
Rsava wrote:
AdorableMogwai wrote:
They say that kids who play chess do better in school, but couldn't that be because parents who put their kids into chess classes place more value on school in general? Parents who think it's important to teach their kids chess would probably also be trying to teach them other things like math and reading. As opposed to parents that don't really care what their kids do and just let them play video games.
If so, there is no real correlation between chess and doing better in school. It is actually just a corelation between parents who get their kids into chess and parents who have an active parenting style, value education, and are likely to doing things to prepare their kids for school.
I let my kids play video games.
My oldest is in 11th grade, has a 4.0 unweighted GPA, has been accepted into the NHS, is taking two college credit courses at the local state college (in preparation for getting his AA BEFORE he actually graduates from HS) in addition to all of his HS courses.
My youngest is in 7th grade, is in all advanced placement courses, has a 3.9 unweighted GPA and has participated for his school in the county Social Studies competition.
Both play sports (swimming and basketball), the oldest has more community service hours than most college students (over 1000 hours), the youngest is in band and has hundreds of community service hours already and neither one wants to play chess even though there are four boards always setup and ready to play around the house.
Does that mean I am a bad parent because I let them play video games and don't force chess on them?
Yes it does. VERY bad! Kidding. I read that video games are supposed to help your brain too.
It is said that video games keep you happy in old age.
Yet Rsava, you clearly have encouraged them to play chess by leaving boards set up around the house, they just didn't want to.
So you actually prove my point, parents who encourage their kids to play chess as you did, regardless of whether the kids actually play it or not, have a parenting style that values education and tries to get their kids involved in extracurricular school activities like sports, band, etc and other things that look good on college applications.
i say yes! 45 minutes, once a week should be mandatory, there should also be a LOT of optional chess.
AdorableMogwai wrote:
Yet Rsava, you clearly have encouraged them to play chess by leaving boards set up around the house, they just didn't want to.
So you actually prove my point, parents who encourage their kids to play chess as you did, regardless of whether the kids actually play it or not, have a parenting style that values education and tries to get their kids involved in extracurricular school activities like sports, band, etc and other things that look good on college applications.
That is a HUGE stretch. That in no way "encourages" them to play chess. You are trying to twist something to prove your point and it actually works against you.
In fact that is such a huge stretch that it is an insult to people's intelligence. That is like saying that leaving guns around encourages murder (even though I never actually got them how to fire the gun) or leaving my car keys laying around and the car in the driveway encourages them to drive (even though I never got them to drive) or leaving spoons around encourages them eat (even though I never actually got them to eat).
Except playing with guns and driving are things that kids know they're not supposed to do and would get in big trouble for...
You're surrounding your kids with chess sets, that's a form of encouragement. Get over it.
In my house growing up there were no chess sets laying about and my parents never once brought up the subject of me going to college. Contrast that with your parenting style, where you're putting chess sets all around your house and getting your kids involved in all these scholastic and extracurricular activities.
The connection between chess and scholastic achievement in kids is the parenting style. Parents who want thier kids to play chess also value education highly, and they try everything they can to help their kids achieve in school.
Sep 23, 2013
0
#30
A new study by the Wisconsin Center for Educational Research provides more evidence that chess improves math and reading skills: http://thechessacademy.org/CPSChessAcademySESproviderimpacts2013.pdf
I don't like the idea of mandatory chess classes in school. Sure, you could argue that the skills you get from playing chess will still be useful later, but isn't that the case for almost any sport?
Karate for instance, you become physically fit, you learn self defense, you learn how to keep going when things get tough, coming up with a fight plan is important,etc. All useful skills.
I think you can make a list like that for any sport and even any video game. They are certainly beneficial, there's just no time to study them all.
So yeah, I don't like forcing kids to learn chess. We're all chess players here, so ofcourse we like the idea of our favourite game to be an actual graded subject in school. I'm pretty sure if the thread was about including karate or ballet dancing in schools we would regard it as nonsense.
It would be a bad thing if a talented artist couldn't get to university because he failed chess. It would be a bad thing if a talented medical student couldn't be a surgeon because he failed a dancing class.
A voluntary chess club after the school hours is great though, as with any other sport. I just don't like forcing hobbies onto others
Sep 23, 2013
0
#32
They shouldn't force students to learn math either, as everyone will have a calculator and very few will ever need the advanced concepts of calculus.
Ziryab wrote:
A new study by the Wisconsin Center for Educational Research provides more evidence that chess improves math and reading skills: http://thechessacademy.org/CPSChessAcademySESproviderimpacts2013.pdf
So kids taking tutoring at the chess academy which describes itself as "The World's First Integrated Math and Chess Curriculum!" have improved math skills? Why is that a surpise, they're being tutored in math alongside chess.Furthermore they have parents and teachers who are active enough to enroll them in such an after-school tutoring program in the first place, which is of course just as beneficial as the tutoring itself. Parents taking an active role in thier kids education like that surely makes an impact, as opposed to all the parents that don't even think about getting their kids tutoring and they just play video games after school.
HattrickStinkyduiker wrote:
I don't like the idea of mandatory chess classes in school. Sure, you could argue that the skills you get from playing chess will still be useful later, but isn't that the case for almost any sport?
Karate for instance, you become physically fit, you learn self defense, you learn how to keep going when things get tough, coming up with a fight plan is important,etc. All useful skills.
I think you can make a list like that for any sport and even any video game. They are certainly beneficial, there's just no time to study them all.
So yeah, I don't like forcing kids to learn chess. We're all chess players here, so ofcourse we like the idea of our favourite game to be an actual graded subject in school. I'm pretty sure if the thread was about including karate or ballet dancing in schools we would regard it as nonsense.
It would be a bad thing if a talented artist couldn't get to university because he failed chess. It would be a bad thing if a talented medical student couldn't be a surgeon because he failed a dancing class.
A voluntary chess club after the school hours is great though, as with any other sport. I just don't like forcing hobbies onto others
that is what PE (physical education) does. chess develops the minds, it help problem solving skills, critical thinking, memory, prioritizing, things that are needed academecly not physicly, also chess could become a substitute for video games, there is chess on the internet but not any other sport (i don't care if you don't think it is a sport, that is not the point and if you try to argue about it then you are trying to attack me for something completely unrelated so SHAME ON YOU).
Sep 23, 2013
0
#35
AdorableMogwai wrote:
Ziryab wrote:
A new study by the Wisconsin Center for Educational Research provides more evidence that chess improves math and reading skills: http://thechessacademy.org/CPSChessAcademySESproviderimpacts2013.pdf
So kids taking tutoring at the chess academy which describes itself as "The World's First Integrated Math and Chess Curriculum!" have improved math skills? Why is that a surpise, they're being tutored in math alongside chess.Furthermore they have parents and teachers who are active enough to enroll them in such an after-school tutoring program in the first place, which is of course just as beneficial as the tutoring itself. Parents taking an active role in thier kids education like that surely makes an impact, as opposed to all the parents that don't even think about getting their kids tutoring and they just play video games after school.
You either did not look at the link, or you failed to comprehend it. The study compared a wide array of tutoring programs, not only the tutored and the untutored. The Chess Academy had stronger success than most other tutoring programs.
ajttja wrote:
that is what PE (physical education) does. chess develops the minds, it help problem solving skills, critical thinking, memory, prioritizing, things that are needed academecly not physicly, also chess could become a substitute for video games, there is chess on the internet but not any other sport (i don't care if you don't think it is a sport, that is not the point and if you try to argue about it then you are trying to attack me for something completely unrelated so SHAME ON YOU).
I don't care if chess is a sport or not. It's a boring arguement really about how one would define sports.
Sure, we have PE for physical sports, but it's such a huge mix that you don't really learn about any of the details. Don't underestimate the mental factors in physical sports either, quite a lot of the points you mentioned also apply to a high level tennis game for instance.
You're talking about chess being a substitute for video games. AFAIK video games isn't a subject in schools either. My point is that you could put in all kinds of other sports/games instead of chess. If you want non-physical sports/games in school, why not make bridge/checkers/go/starcraft/league of legends/age of empires a subject?
All of those involve critical thinking/prioritising/strategy/memorising/problem solving, you can play them online, you can become a pro if you're really good.
I just don't like the idea of forcing a certain sport to kids. Encourage them, sure! Maybe thinking sports should be included in PE even.
I don't like forcing chess into schools though, it would just be super annoying for people without talent in that area.
Same with the forced arts stuff that actually is in schools. I hated those classes from the beginning and I haven't learned a thing from them. I can't make a head from clay, I don't care about haiku's, I will never be able to sing like Adele. Just leave me alone with those hobbies, please. that stuff took at least 20% of my education time, if those wasted hours would be spend on french and german I'd be decent in 4 languages now instead of 2.
Ziryab wrote:
You either did not look at the link, or you failed to comprehend it. The study compared a wide array of tutoring programs, not only the tutored and the untutored. The Chess Academy had stronger success than most other tutoring programs.
I looked at it, I also saw that the average hours of tutoring provided per student was much higher for Chess Academy than any of the others they compared. For example in the year 2008-2009 the average hours of tutoring at Chess Academy was 48.4 versus say Brilliance Academy that was only 24.7. Of course when one tutoring program spends twice as much time as another one it will be shown to be more effective.
Sep 23, 2013
0
#38
AdorableMogwai wrote:
Ziryab wrote:
You either did not look at the link, or you failed to comprehend it. The study compared a wide array of tutoring programs, not only the tutored and the untutored. The Chess Academy had stronger success than most other tutoring programs.
I looked at it, I also saw that the average hours of tutoring provided per student was much higher for Chess Academy than any of the others they compared. For example in the year 2008-2009 the average hours of tutoring at Chess Academy was 48.4 versus say Brilliance Academy that was only 24.7. Of course when one tutoring program spends twice as much time as another one it will be shown to be more effective.
You are cherry picking. Better to read the summary at the end:
"... the following SES providers were found to have impacts on student reading and/or math achievement every year (average hours of tutoring provided in 2011-12 in parentheses): A.I.M. High (50.6), Brain Hurricane (34.8), Chess Academy (42.4), Huntington (35.3), Newton Learning (38.7), Orion’s Mind (34.6), SES of Illinois (33.1), School Service Systems (52.1) and Unparalleled Solutions (54.4)."
None of those programs referred to in the paragraph are listed in the chart except for Chess Academy and Huntington. This indicates that the Chess Academy website is leaving out some pages in the report, as the chart is in alphabetical order and cuts off before B and ends after I. Where are the rest of the pages and why did the Chess Academy site leave them out?
Also 2011-12 just happens to be the year that Chess Academy spent the lowest number of hours per student. Still it looks like others such as Huntington are achieving the same results with less time spent.
Sep 23, 2013
0
#40
AdorableMogwai wrote:
Where are the rest of the pages and why did the Chess Academy site leave them out?
Could be copyright. They are not supressing information; they are highlighting the portions that laud their work.
In any case, you have opposed any and all comments in this thread concerning the educational benefits of chess without citing even the sort of truncated research presented in my link. There have been hundreds of studies done concerning the benefits of chess. Some of these studies have been done in ways that control for your suggestions regarding parenting.
If you would like to understand this issue from the point of view of actual inquiry, rather than simple mouthing off with your pet hypothesis every time someone else posts anything in this thread, then you might subscribe to the publications of the Wisconsin Center for Educational Research. That way you could get the whole study.
http://www.wcer.wisc.edu/publications/index.php
They say that kids who play chess do better in school, but couldn't that be because parents who put their kids into chess classes place more value on school in general? Parents who think it's important to teach their kids chess would probably also be trying to teach them other things like math and reading. As opposed to parents that don't really care what their kids do and just let them play video games.
If so, there is no real correlation between chess and doing better in school. It is actually just a corelation between parents who get their kids into chess and parents who have an active parenting style, value education, and are likely to doing things to prepare their kids for school.
Agreed.
It all depends on how students take it!