Chess in USA vs Chess in Europe

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Avatar of TheOldReb

I played chess in the USA (southeast) from 1973-1997 and then moved to Europe and have now been playing since then. (Portugal and Spain mostly) When I was in the US I often wondered what the differences were and now I know firsthand. One of the big differences is that in Europe the organizers of events furnish clocks, pieces, boards and even scoresheets. In the US I had to provide these things and every player usually took their little carry all bag that held pieces, clocks, board. :-)  There are other differences ofcourse and we can discuss them if there is interest here .

Avatar of Thijs

I also heard that, that people in North America are expected to bring their own stuff. Here it's just normal that everything is provided by the tournament organization. I usually only bring a pen to a chess match/tournament, and sometimes I even forget that! Laughing

 

Another big difference is that in the US, entry fees are usually alot higher than here. Entry fees here vary from € 5 (smaller, usually blitz tournaments) to € 50 (the Dutch Open). Most weekend swisses are about € 25.  (€ 1.00 ~ $1.42)


Avatar of TheOldReb
Indeed , higher entry fees for a shot at less prize money is common in the USA. The ratio of prize money to entry fee is very bad in the US compared to Europe. I won a small one day rapid event in Portugal and won $300 for a $7. entry fee!  In the US if first is $300. the entry fee will be $50. or more . The reason for this is simple, in the US the prizes come from entry fees and in Europe there is more support/sponsorship for chess.
Avatar of Etienne
Well I know in quebec, tournaments organisers don't really get much funds to organise tournaments, what often happens is that organizers organise a tournament, they don't have material enough for everyone so people are asked to bring their stuff and the prize money (and expenses) comes exclusively or almost from entry fees. Chess organisations are not very rich here.
Avatar of Lord-Svenstikov

It is pretty much the same over here compared with the netherlands by the sound of it. I'd never really considered having to supply my own clock for tournaments (I don't even own one).

Are there restrictions on what type of clock and chess set you are allowed to bring? Surely it just brings up a lot more confusing regulations. 


Avatar of Meowdar
I've never played a tournament in the states.  But I have looked at their entry fees, and the lowest I've seen lately was $70!  Ridiculous!  When my brother and I played in Portugal and Spain with dad (Reb), I was under the impression that every tournament organization supplied sets and clocks (I thought this was so for the states as well, but as I said, I've never played in tourneys here)...shows how much I know.  Surprised
Avatar of Gideon

That's sad though.  I think the goverment should help supply chess sets, since they benefit from it in long term.  I haven't met a chess player that didn't make a success with his/her life!!

 Here in South Africa the chess sets are supplied in tournaments. Ok, clocks are a bit on the short side so only the top bords are supplied with clocks, but it still works.  Interesting how countries differ Smile


Avatar of ATJ1968
The club i play for ask for £15 per year. With that i get an ECF grading. In matches score sheets, clocks, board, pieces are already supplied. I played in the county U100 ( U1400 ELO ) final last year in Leicester and the ECF ( English chess federation ) supplied brand new chess sets and FIDE official digital timers. We won and we each got an engraved wooden plaque trophy. Even the losers got one, even players who played in previous rounds who missed the final got one. All we had to pay was £2 each for each game upto the final, and that was just to contribute to refreshments and sandwiches. Yes, we're spoilt in England.
Avatar of TheOldReb
Yes, in the US the pieces and board must meet certain requirements. In Portugal I play for a team/club and pay no dues/fees . The club actually pays for my federation fees/membership and pays all my expenses when I play for the team. When I play as an individual they often pay the entry fee but nothing more. I dont have a fide title, if I did it would be even better as titled players are often paid to play above their expenses. The big difference is that the state gives money each year to the National chess federation, which in turn gives money to the various clubs/districts.  On top of that some businesses and local govts also support chess through donations.
Avatar of Fromper

Yes, here in the USA, you have to supply your own equipment. Whoever has the black pieces gets to choose the equipment to use that game, although it often just comes down to whoever gets to the table first and starts setting up.

 

There are rules to make sure sets are all Staunton design, meet certain size and weight requirements, etc. For instance, boards have to have squares between 2 and 2.5 inches, and almost everyone has the standard vinyl rollup board with 2.25 inch squares. Mine has only 2 inch squares, which is still allowed for tournaments, but I've actually had opponents complain that it's smaller than they're used to.

 

As for clocks, anything goes, pretty much. If the clock can't handle the delay (which is now standard in USCF tournaments), then the opponent can insist on using a clock that does.

 

As for entry fees and prizes, Reb explained it perfectly. There's no outside funding. So the entry fees ARE the prize fund, except that the club has to keep a small portion of the entry fees to pay USCF to rate the tournament. Also, some tournament organizers keep a small percentage for their club or even for themselves, as their "salary" for running the event. Usually, prize funds are about 70% of the entry fees.

 

And yes, some tournament entry fees are outrageously high. But there are some smaller tournaments where entry fees are much smaller. For some reason, they have skyrocketed recently, though. When I started playing in tournaments in 2001, I payed $5 to play in a 4 round tournament at one game per week. Now, such tournaments have entry fees of $15. I don't know any tournaments down here that are cheaper than that. The entry fees for large weekend tournaments have also gone up, from $40-50 a few years ago to at least $90 these days. :(

 

Since I just want to play and don't care about prizes, I'd rather pay low entry fees and compete for lower prizes, but I do understand that the large prizes attract more players.

 

--Fromper 


Avatar of TheOldReb
In US events when you supply your own sets whoever plays black does have choice, but if the player of white pieces arrives on time and the player of the black pieces is late then the right of choice passes to the player that arrived on time.
Avatar of KingLeopold

Ok, I not only play tournaments here in the US but help to organize them too. Almost every tournament here that I know of, the organizer supplies the boards, sets, and score sheets. The players bring clocks and pensils/pens.

Why?

 As an organizer, we hold tournaments that attract 300-400 scholastic students. This happens 8-10 times per semester. That would be in the neighbor hood of 200 clocks at a price of $40 min. X 200 is something which we just can not afford. We have about 10-15 clocks which we rotate upon the top boards.

We charge $15 per student. (Not outrageous)

Our expenses run $700-1500 for rental fee of the playing hall. Another $1,000 for trophies. Plus we have to carry Insurance and the initail layout for all the boards and sets. Computers (laptops which are $1000 each, we have two) and printers & software (USCF compatable software),to run the tournament and payroll for the TDs.

Now think of the above expenses where a weekend adult tournament only attracts about 100-150 players and you will see why the EF is so high.

Remember, America is a market driven society (supply and demand), and not goverment sponsered.

There are some successfull tournaments here in America which have excellent cash prizes for the high entry fees. The American Open, The National Open, The World Open & The North American Open to name a few. Many of these mentioned tournaments attract top european players who come to try and win the Big Bucks. Also, most IM's and GM's play for free, only having their EF deducted if they win large cash prizes.

I hope I was able to explain clearly to you how and why American tournaments run expensively. 


Avatar of TheOldReb
It sounds like you are speaking of scholastic tournies Leo. I played my first rated chess at age 20 so never played any scholastic events. I started in 1973 and played until 1997 only in US Southeastern states. In all that time the boards, sets and clocks were never furnished until I Played a few times in the Atlanta chess center where some of those things were furnished. In Europe tournies are often held in places other than big banquet rooms of some hotel. This greatly reduces cost but means there may be other disadvantages, such as no airconditioning or heat in summer/winter. The fact that there is so little sponsorship for chess in the US hurts chess greatly I know. In Europe there is much more sponsorship thus the prize monies are not dependant on entry fees and so entry fees are very low compared to the US .
Avatar of Paul-Lebon
Phobetor wrote:

I also heard that, that people in North America are expected to bring their own stuff.


 Excepting Canada, it's pretty much dog eat dog, live and let die and do onto others before they can do onto you over here, in chess and otherwise.


Avatar of TheOldReb
I also like the one round per day format of many European tournaments. I had never played one in the US , even with 25 years of playing there. I shudder to think of going back to 2 and even 3 rounds a day of slow chess!  Surprised
Avatar of EEShelton
KingLeopold wrote:

Ok, I not only play tournaments here in the US but help to organize them too. Almost every tournament here that I know of, the organizer supplies the boards, sets, and score sheets. The players bring clocks and pensils/pens.

Why?

 As an organizer, we hold tournaments that attract 300-400 scholastic students. This happens 8-10 times per semester. That would be in the neighbor hood of 200 clocks at a price of $40 min. X 200 is something which we just can not afford. We have about 10-15 clocks which we rotate upon the top boards.

We charge $15 per student. (Not outrageous)

Our expenses run $700-1500 for rental fee of the playing hall. Another $1,000 for trophies. Plus we have to carry Insurance and the initail layout for all the boards and sets. Computers (laptops which are $1000 each, we have two) and printers & software (USCF compatable software),to run the tournament and payroll for the TDs.

Now think of the above expenses where a weekend adult tournament only attracts about 100-150 players and you will see why the EF is so high.

Remember, America is a market driven society (supply and demand), and not goverment sponsered.

There are some successfull tournaments here in America which have excellent cash prizes for the high entry fees. The American Open, The National Open, The World Open & The North American Open to name a few. Many of these mentioned tournaments attract top european players who come to try and win the Big Bucks. Also, most IM's and GM's play for free, only having their EF deducted if they win large cash prizes.

I hope I was able to explain clearly to you how and why American tournaments run expensively. 


KingLeopold is obviously only referring to SCHOLASTIC chess, where it is common to have boards and sets provided for the players. But outside of scholastic events this is NOT the norm here in the U.S.

 I actually like taking MY set, board and clock. I am familiar with how the clock functions, am comfortable with the pieces and can even choose the color of the squares on my board (I have a board with ORANGE squares, for when I'm feeling crazy!). However, I understand why some would find this less than ideal. I DO believe that players at the top boards, especially titled players, should have their boards. sets and clocks provided as they are professionals: they shculd be treated as such.

The club I belong to has quick rated tournaments frequently and we normally charge $5 for 3-4 games. If we do a longer time control for a full day of chess, we normally charge no more that $20.


Avatar of mxdplay4
My experience of tournaments is that sets etc are provided by a chess centre for the duration of the tournament on the basis that they will sell books, equipment and so on to the punters who are playing. That seems an obvious scenario to me and I am surprised it isn't normal elsewhere.
Avatar of Fromper
mxdplay4 wrote: My experience of tournaments is that sets etc are provided by a chess centre for the duration of the tournament on the basis that they will sell books, equipment and so on to the punters who are playing. That seems an obvious scenario to me and I am surprised it isn't normal elsewhere.

 I think the key there is your words "chess centre". The USA is a much larger country, and I doubt if there are more than twenty chess clubs in the whole country that have their own location and place to store equipment. Most chess clubs rent/borrow space from community centers, schools, businesses, or even churches to have some place to meet. The question is not only how much can a chess club afford to buy, but also how much can the tournament director fit in their car.

 

 --Fromper


Avatar of KingLeopold

Actually, if you read my post carefully, I'm not talking just about scholastic chess. At the chess emporium which is a chess center in the US, we hold both scholastic and adult events on and off site. I don't know what it is like back east for most small local tournaments, but the adult events I play, American Open, National Open, Western States Open all suppy boards and sets, & notation sheets. All one has to bring is a clock if you have one and a pen/pencil.

Now I have a few questions for you: What would a carpnter be without his hammer? Of course he has a hammer as he has the tools in which to get the work done. Then why would a chess player be any different? He should have the tools of his craft, score pad, pens pencils, board & set. Other wise he is not a chess player, rather he is someone who just plays at chess and has no room to talk.

Please don't tell me you don't own your own board and set never-the-less your own chess clock. How could you play chess with out your own set? Do you rely upon others to provide everything for you? If you do then why don't you apply to your government to supply you with your needs? Tell them that you are a chess player and that they should supply you with a board, set, clock etc. I am sure you are entitled to it.


Avatar of mxdplay4
Fromper wrote: mxdplay4 wrote: My experience of tournaments is that sets etc are provided by a chess centre for the duration of the tournament on the basis that they will sell books, equipment and so on to the punters who are playing. That seems an obvious scenario to me and I am surprised it isn't normal elsewhere.

 I think the key there is your words "chess centre". The USA is a much larger country, and I doubt if there are more than twenty chess clubs in the whole country that have their own location and place to store equipment. Most chess clubs rent/borrow space from community centers, schools, businesses, or even churches to have some place to meet. The question is not only how much can a chess club afford to buy, but also how much can the tournament director fit in their car.

 

 --Fromper


Sorry, I think I am being misunderstood. When I say chess centre I mean a Chess Shop - a Chess Store. These guys seem perfectly happy to travel fair distances and have a stall with a captive audience for the weekend/Sunday. hope this clarifies my point.