Chess Opening Tier List by GM Hikaru
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There will be part 2 and 3 I guess!
Thanks, llama.
Jul 27, 2020
0
#7
Chad_Sexington wrote:
What I don't understand is why the Fools Mate is sitting in the middle of the garbage section. Either they consider it a white opening and it is at the absolute bottom, or they consider it a black opening and it is at the top of the legendary section. By definition, it is impossible for an opening to be better or worse than it.
Nakamura also put the Giuoco Piano in garbage because he thought it was a white opening with 4. c3 and 5. d4, whereas the Guioco Piano is just the name of the position after black plays 3... Bc5. Therefore the Giuoco piano should be placed in unbreakable or legendary as this is the most common move at the GM level.
He said at some point that the jerome (for example) is lower than fool's mate because with fool's mate you're at least doing it on purpose, so there's some sense to it. So basically he has more scorn for the grob and latvian because presumably someone who plays that isn't trying to lose.
But sure, objectively it would be at the bottom.
As for the guicio piano, I think you're right. I think he put it in garbage for the same reason as the french exchange, he was saying a GM as white shouldn't be trying to draw... but from the black side such openings get listed as unbreakable e.g. petrov. So yeah, I think you're right.
Jul 27, 2020
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#8
I have to disagree with several of those classifications.
Of course, that might be why he's a GM and I'm not.
Jul 27, 2020
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#9
blueemu wrote:
I have to disagree with several of those classifications.
Of course, that might be why he's a GM and I'm not.
He said the list would be different if it were for the level of club players, and a few of them were not very objective, it's more like... practical chances, and whether you're playing for 2 results, and with which color.
For example he put 1.b4 higher than the french exchange with the reasoning that 1.b4 can equalize... well obviously so can the french exchange, but I think he sees the exchange french as giving away all winning chances, while an objectively worse, but unbalanced opening like 1.b4, doesn't in practical play.
Jul 27, 2020
0
#10
And then queen's gambit not in legendary makes no sense. I don't know what to say to that. I've even seen fairly recent games of Naka failing to equalize as black and just being outplayed and losing... and it's been played by practically every GM for over 100 years.
Jul 31, 2020
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#12
blueemu hat geschrieben:
I have to disagree with several of those classifications.
Of course, that might be why he's a GM and I'm not.
Go on, I´d love to hear your take. Is it just me or does the Nimzo-Larsen seem a little high? For me, legendary and unbreakable openings are the sort of openings you wouldn´t be surprised to see in a World Championship match.
Jul 31, 2020
0
#13
solflores927 hat geschrieben:
I feel this doesn't really apply so much at club or even CM-FM level, where things like the Scandi or even the Alekhine can be hard to get a real advantage against.
He specifically says at the GM level multiple times during the video (as well as being in the title of the clip). They also did an opening tier list for patzers on twitch but it hasn´t been uploaded yet.
Bong cloud is definitely legendary XD
Infact it should be even better than legendary
How is the Reti Opening not "Legendary"?? It's the opening that felled Jose Raul Capablanca, who hadn't dropped a game in over 8 years. Does it get any more "Legendary" than that? Further, it is objectively better than the English, by simple virtue of the fact that 1. ..e5 can't be played in reply.
Also, Alapin is a great anti-sicilian system. Might not fit in with Nakamura's style, and it will annoy the hell out of most Sicilian players, but it's perfectly good.
what about traxler counter
Honestly when I watched it I realized as good as Hikaru is at playing chess I disagree with so much of what he says. As someone mentioned he didn’t know the Italian game is more general than the c3 d4 idea, and as blue emu says none of us get a leg to stand on. Levy had input that was closer to my own but I always remember that he is over well over 3000 blitz and on a good day I can’t crack 2300 so I’m aware I’m wrong it can be hard to beat the feeling that skill in a specific way does not prove an overarching general understanding but I am aware that as I say that that is a lack of understanding viewpoint.
But yeah that comment about the queens gambit not being legendary is also what I am talking about I mean sure Hikaru is better than us but I’m sure all the world champs would consider that one legendary. So it does cast doubt on other opinions on openings of his I feel strongly to be wrong.