Chess Speaks for itself

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lfPatriotGames
TrainingOnATrain wrote:
lfPatriotGames wrote:

I don't doubt it's common, I just don't understand why. Why would the players who have the best chance of winning not have to pay to enter?

 

The GM status attracts players, more players, more money overall. Why does Tom Brady do the "Let's Go" Hertz commercials?

 

In the end, they get more money. Why do we have to pay subscriptions on Twitch to play GMs, but the GMs don't have to subscribe to us? Same thing.

I don't know, but it does make them look like cheapskates. Of course I would never pay money to play a grandmaster because there is no value in it for me. But that's just me. 

lfPatriotGames

If the GM wont pay 10 dollars to help a charity then that just reaffirms their cheapskate status. In other professions the high level participant would be ashamed and embarrassed if they refused to help out. Often it's the complete opposite, the people at the very highest level pay even MORE than everyone else because they want the perception of helping more, caring more. Which in turn motivates more people to also help out or participate. 

Maybe GMs have spent so much time playing chess they haven't learned the social skills necessary to recognize when they should be embarrassed. I don't know, but either way it's not a good look. 

Batman2508
lfPatriotGames wrote:

If the GM wont pay 10 dollars to help a charity then that just reaffirms their cheapskate status. In other professions the high level participant would be ashamed and embarrassed if they refused to help out. Often it's the complete opposite, the people at the very highest level pay even MORE than everyone else because they want the perception of helping more, caring more. Which in turn motivates more people to also help out or participate. 

Maybe GMs have spent so much time playing chess they haven't learned the social skills necessary to recognize when they should be embarrassed. I don't know, but either way it's not a good look. 

I personally feel like it was acceptable not to pay but he should have been more respectful about it. And you also have no knowledge with gms not paying so perhaps your taking this harshly 

lfPatriotGames
Batman2508 wrote:
lfPatriotGames wrote:

If the GM wont pay 10 dollars to help a charity then that just reaffirms their cheapskate status. In other professions the high level participant would be ashamed and embarrassed if they refused to help out. Often it's the complete opposite, the people at the very highest level pay even MORE than everyone else because they want the perception of helping more, caring more. Which in turn motivates more people to also help out or participate. 

Maybe GMs have spent so much time playing chess they haven't learned the social skills necessary to recognize when they should be embarrassed. I don't know, but either way it's not a good look. 

I personally feel like it was acceptable not to pay but he should have been more respectful about it. And you also have no knowledge with gms not paying so perhaps your taking this harshly 

You are right, I have no knowledge about what they pay, other than what has been presented here. So that is what I'm going by. If they squawk at paying 10 dollars for a charity event, that's a bad look. If they pay several hundred or several thousand to enter a regular tournament, then that would be more appropriate. 

Me personally, I wouldn't want someone like that even associated with the event with that kind of attitude. If I were the event promoter, I wouldn't want them there, because if people hear about it, they will figure if the GM doesn't care about this event, why should I?

If they want to draw a bigger crowd, the GMs should pay a substantially larger amount greater than everyone else. That would send the message they really care about this charity event. I would compare it to a charity auction, where the person who has voluntarily given up something for the auction and they STILL bid on something similar. In other words buying something they don't need and are already giving away. That drives interest because it sends the message they really care about the cause. 

blueemu
Anonymous_Dragon wrote:

Imagine scoring no points in an entire 7 round tournament . 

Colonel Charles Moreau went zero-for-26 in the 1903 Monte Carlo Masters tournament.

No wins, no draws, twenty-six losses.

 

Kowarenai

ouch but i mean thats still kinda not comparable tho in terms of our modern age

lfPatriotGames
Mr-Mudd wrote:
lfPatriotGames wrote:
Batman2508 wrote:
lfPatriotGames wrote:
TrainingOnATrain wrote:

GM Hans Niemann refuses to pay $5 for a charity tournament

 

I don't understand why a grandmaster feels like they shouldn't pay to enter a chess tournament. I assume they keep the money if they win something. I must be missing something. 

Its in respect of titled players so they don't have to pay

OK, now I know I'm missing something. I understand the respect earned for being a grandmaster. There are like about 1700 of them in the entire world. I thought the respect is in the title itself, grandmaster. That's an extremely rare position to hold. 

But I don't understand why they wouldn't have to pay to enter a tournament where they get to keep money if they win. In golf the OWGR ranks players based on performance and if someone can get in the top 50 (a MUCH more rare feat than being a grandmaster) they are exempt from certain tournament requirements. But they still have to pay to enter. Which makes sense because if they are in the world top 50 they have a much better chance of winning than most. 

I realize there are different ability levels in a chess tournament, whereas in a golf tournament only the best compete, but I still don't understand why someone who keeps money they win feels like they shouldn't pay to participate. 

So, at first, something makes sense because you understand it.  But later, something you don't understand doesn't make sense.

Have you heard of the comparing "apples to oranges" analogy?  (....golf.....chess........)

I compared golf to chess because both are competitions, often to win money (at high levels anyway). I don't know about chess, but golf is a VERY popular avenue for charity events. It appears in this article the chess tournament was also a charity event. People will pay money to play with the professionals. 

So it seems like a reasonable analogy. But what if you learned that the professional was disturbed at the idea of giving up 10 dollars for this charity event? I recall a recent charity golf tournament where the winner gave every single cent back to the charity. I don't know the exact amount but it was north of a million dollars. Why? Because this drives interest. People say "hey, he really cares about this charity". So even more people will now participate and/or donate to this cause. I have no doubt many professionals were given a free entrance into the tournament (although I don't know for sure). It would be understandable if they were. So I guess the difference is so many of the golf pros aren't looking for a handout, it's the opposite. They are looking for ways to help the charity. 

I guess it comes down to promotion. If the promoters of this chess charity event feel what they are doing is the best thing, then that's what they should do. But I can certainly understand why it's controversial. 

Wits-end

Here’s what I understand: When Hans refused to pay a $5.00 fee for an event to raise money to fight cancer, he was being an ignorant, pompous fool. It isn’t anything bigger than that. $5.00 dollars. Let’s not be a d**k. Let’s fight cancer.  Go be a d**k another day.🤦‍♂️

lfPatriotGames
TrainingOnATrain wrote:

"I recall a recent charity golf tournament where the winner gave every single cent back to the charity."

And was Hans demanding prize money? NO.

Neither was the winner of the golf tournament. But the point is the golf pros were looking for ways to help the charity. Squawking over 10 dollars doesn't exactly give the impression he's excited about giving. 

lfPatriotGames
lfPatriotGames wrote:

OK , now that's just weird. It was FIVE dollars, not ten? I have second Wits comment. 

Seriously, who does things like that? That's exactly why I wouldn't want him (or anyone like that) associated with the event. 

 

lfPatriotGames
TrainingOnATrain wrote:
Wits-end wrote:

Here’s what I understand: When Hans refused to pay a $5.00 fee for an event to raise money to fight cancer, he was being an ignorant, pompous fool. It isn’t anything bigger than that. $5.00 dollars. Let’s not be a d**k. Let’s fight cancer.  Go be a d**k another day.🤦‍♂️

 

How do you know he doesn't donate regularly to causes like fighting cancer? He could be growing that hair out and donating it to cancer patients to make a wig worth 100s of dollars. 

 

Ben Finegold has already bought one and he doesn't even have cancer I understand.

 

Right, and in his spare time save puppies and kittens. How do we know he doesn't donate regularly to causes like fighting cancer? Because of articles and videos like the ones presented here. That's how we know.

Wits-end
TrainingOnATrain wrote:
Wits-end wrote:

Here’s what I understand: When Hans refused to pay a $5.00 fee for an event to raise money to fight cancer, he was being an ignorant, pompous fool. It isn’t anything bigger than that. $5.00 dollars. Let’s not be a d**k. Let’s fight cancer.  Go be a d**k another day.🤦‍♂️

 

How do you know he doesn't donate regularly to causes like fighting cancer? He could be growing that hair out and donating it to cancer patients to make a wig worth 100s of dollars. 

 

Ben Finegold has already bought one and he doesn't even have cancer I understand.

 

$5.00. That’s it dude. He is a cheapa$$. 

lfPatriotGames
TrainingOnATrain wrote:

But's that's $5 you could use to feed yourself. If you didn't need the $5 why did you have it in the first place? That only shows people want to look righteous in front of others, while hording all the world's wealth.

It's not about looking righteous. It's about BEING righteous. I'm only going by what's been presented here, for all we know he secretly gives billions to hunger aid. 

But squaking over 5 dollars for a charity event he showed up for shows two things we know for sure. He's cheap, and he doesn't mind looking unrighteous in front of others. 

Wits-end
TrainingOnATrain wrote:

But, that's $5 you could use to feed yourself. If you didn't need the $5 why did you have it in the first place? That only shows people want to look righteous in front of others, while hoarding all the world's wealth.

Surely you can do better than this can’t you? 

Wits-end
TrainingOnATrain wrote:
Wits-end wrote:
TrainingOnATrain wrote:

But, that's $5 you could use to feed yourself. If you didn't need the $5 why did you have it in the first place? That only shows people want to look righteous in front of others, while hoarding all the world's wealth.

Surely you can do better than this can’t you? 

 

 

Now we’re on the same. Victor!

lfPatriotGames
TrainingOnATrain wrote:

"But squaking over 5 dollars for a charity"

In order to have what one does not need, one must steal.

I hope you aren't implying that he would steal even 5 dollars. I will say that since he has enough resources and money to obtain not only means of video but also the means of becoming a grandmaster that indeed 5 dollars is not something he "needs". 

Batman2508
lfPatriotGames wrote:
TrainingOnATrain wrote:

But's that's $5 you could use to feed yourself. If you didn't need the $5 why did you have it in the first place? That only shows people want to look righteous in front of others, while hording all the world's wealth.

It's not about looking righteous. It's about BEING righteous. I'm only going by what's been presented here, for all we know he secretly gives billions to hunger aid. 

But squaking over 5 dollars for a charity event he showed up for shows two things we know for sure. He's cheap, and he doesn't mind looking unrighteous in front of others. 

You know you can get a lot of stuff for five dollars...it doesn't matter its for cancer like the point is GM's shouldn't be paying for tournaments and that is his belief, and he won't change that. Plus he may not trust the organizer why only 50% going to charity what is the other 50% doing he will use that money to his own benefit.

lfPatriotGames
TrainingOnATrain wrote:
lfPatriotGames wrote:
TrainingOnATrain wrote:

"But squaking over 5 dollars for a charity"

In order to have what one does not need, one must steal.

I hope you aren't implying that he would steal even 5 dollars. I will say that since he has enough resources and money to obtain not only means of video but also the means of becoming a grandmaster that indeed 5 dollars is not something he "needs". 

 

The implication is that those who flaunt it are facades of homage.

OK, it seemed like you were saying if he didn't need it (which he doesn't) he must have stole it. I agree flaunting is bad. I'm guilty as well. I have maliciously flaunted 5 dollars before. At first I was ashamed of spending 5 dollars for a Starbucks, sheepishly pulling out the big bill. It occurred to me that some people in Starbucks have maybe never even seen a 5 dollar bill  before. But I gathered up the courage to shamelessly lay it down on the counter, ignoring the gasps and judgmental eyes of the common folk. 

Needless to say, I'm a big flaunter now. 

lfPatriotGames

How right you are. But I'm not going to a fundraiser to complain about 5 dollars (and not tell anyone I'm going to blow the whole 5 dollars later on).

Batman2508
lfPatriotGames wrote:

How right you are. But I'm not going to a fundraiser to complain about 5 dollars (and not tell anyone I'm going to blow the whole 5 dollars later on).

ok your not really seeing the other side of the story and only looking at yours, so there is no point in discussing this anymore with you.