Does Chess.com automatically declare a draw for a positional three-fold repetition?

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Avatar of ccmambretti

Or does the player proposing to repeat the position have to announce it, and if so how? I'm referring to online/daily chess, not live chess. Or do you simply have ask for a draw and hope your opponent accepts?

Avatar of Hawksteinman

It's automatic

Avatar of Doggy_Style

There is no automatic award, the draw must be claimed.

The opponent has no say in the process.

The draw is claimed after the third instance of the same position, by hitting the draw button.

 

p.s. https://support.chess.com/customer/portal/articles/1444798-how-do-i-claim-a-draw-

Avatar of Doggy_Style
brumtown wrote:

It's automatic

Why answer when you don't know?

Avatar of jesuskevin

hola?

Avatar of Hawksteinman

I played against the computer, and it automatically drew when the threefold repetition happened.

Avatar of Doggy_Style
brumtown wrote:

I played against the computer, and it automatically drew when the threefold repetition happened.

It claimed the draw.

 

Either side may claim.

Avatar of Hawksteinman

Ok...

Avatar of pfren

There is no automatic 3-fold repetition draw, either OTB, or in chess.com, since it's aginst the rules.

Copypasting from the FIDE handbook, # 9.2:

9.2

The game is drawn upon a correct claim by the player having the move, when the same position, for at least the third time (not necessarily by a repetition of moves):

 

a.

is about to appear, if he first writes his move on his scoresheet and declares to the arbiter his intention to make this move, or

 

b.

has just appeared, and the player claiming the draw has the move.

 

Positions as in (a) and (b) areconsidered the same, if the same player has the move, pieces of the same kind and colour occupy the same squares, and the possible moves of all the pieces of both players are the same.
Positions are not the same if a pawn that could have been captured en passant can no longer be captured in this manner. When a king or a rook is forced to move, it will lose its castling rights, if any, only after it is moved.

Avatar of ccmambretti

From these somewhat conflicting statements I assume that 1) the player claiming a chess.com draw based on three-fold repetition does not have to preannounce intention to move the third time, because there is no physical way for such a player to make such an announcement in online chess; but (2) it isn't clear that chess.com will "announce" the draw after the third move; instead one or the other of the players must request a draw from the opponent. However, if the player who intentionally repeats the move is the one who wants the draw, then the opponent (who may be hoping for a win) has an infinited number of chances to refuse the draw and we end in a huge mess--especially in a tourament.

Avatar of TheGrobe
Doggy_Style wrote:
brumtown wrote:

It's automatic

Why answer when you don't know?

He probably can't help it -- it's automatic.

Avatar of TitanCG
TheGrobe wrote:
Doggy_Style wrote:
brumtown wrote:

It's automatic

Why answer when you don't know?

He probably can't help it -- it's automatic.

No way to control it

It's totally automatic

Avatar of bouncing_check
ccmambretti wrote:

(2) it isn't clear that chess.com will "announce" the draw after the third move; instead one or the other of the players must request a draw from the opponent. However, if the player who intentionally repeats the move is the one who wants the draw, then the opponent (who may be hoping for a win) has an infinited number of chances to refuse the draw .

You don't request the draw: you simply claim it by hitting the button. If all the prerequisites are met, the game is immediately drawn. The only possibility your opponent has of spoiling things for you is if he very quickly plays (or premoves) a new and different move directly after your drawing move, so that you don't have time to hit the button.

Avatar of ThrillerFan
ccmambretti wrote:

From these somewhat conflicting statements I assume that 1) the player claiming a chess.com draw based on three-fold repetition does not have to preannounce intention to move the third time, because there is no physical way for such a player to make such an announcement in online chess; but (2) it isn't clear that chess.com will "announce" the draw after the third move; instead one or the other of the players must request a draw from the opponent. However, if the player who intentionally repeats the move is the one who wants the draw, then the opponent (who may be hoping for a win) has an infinited number of chances to refuse the draw and we end in a huge mess--especially in a tourament.

In response to your item number 2, Chess.com will NOT Announce it!  Period!

The difference between Over the Board and Chess.com:

OTB - In an OTB game, let's say you are about to make a move that is 3-fold repetition, you state the move, claim 3-fold, stop the clock, and if the opponent disagrees, you get a director.  The moment you start your opponent's clock, you can no longer make the claim.

Chess.com - Because you are on the internet and the execution of the draw button is automated when clicked, it's different.  Here, when you click on the draw button, the first thing it does is check to see if anything has occurred that by rule is a draw, like 3-fold repetition of the CURRENT POSITION (you can't claim 3-fold based on moves 35, 43, and 49 when you are up to make your 58th move, you had to claim that when you made your 49th move), or the 50 move rule.  If the quota is met that a draw can be claimed, then the game ends as a draw.  The user online doesn't have to state which claim they are making, whether it be 3-fold or 50 moves.  However, if no draw quota is met, then it's treated as a draw offer, and the offer is made to the opponent.  Keep in mind that this is computerized, and so this is figured out in a nano-second, and so the user won't notice the delay in time.  Unlike OTB, where the draw claim must be made before you start their clock, here, the draw claim must be made before your opponent executes their next move, so if you make a move on move 49 that is the exact same position 3 times, all 3 times with the same player to move (if it's Black to move twice, and White to move once, that's not 3-fold), and all 3 times that player has the same legal options (if he could castle the first time, moved his King, then moved it back, that's NOT 2-fold because the first time he could castle, and this time he could not, assuming the first time he was not in check, wouldn't have to cross over check, or move into check, that is), and you click the draw button BEFORE your opponent makes his 49th move (50th move if you are Black), then you made the claim in time and a draw is called if your claim is correct, otherwise it goes as a draw offer.

Avatar of ThrillerFan
kaynight wrote:

Respect Thriller

Huh?  What does explaining the rule differences and the technical aspects of chess.com versus OTB and how the rules are stated there (see post 11) have anything to do with respect, or lackthereof?

Avatar of Scottrf

The problem is that your opponent may move before you have a chance to claim, especially with pre moves. Or on online chess with conditional moves.

Avatar of TheGrobe
ThrillerFan wrote:
kaynight wrote:

Respect Thriller

Huh?  What does explaining the rule differences and the technical aspects of chess.com versus OTB and how the rules are stated there (see post 11) have anything to do with respect, or lackthereof?

Well, to be fair there is a difference between:

"Respect Thriller"

Which appears to be a general statement targeted at a wide audience, and

"Respect, Thriller"

Which could be construed as either a reminder directed at you, or informally, acknowlegement and agreement with what you just said (usually accompanied by a fist-bump).

Avatar of TheGrobe

"No offence", or "No, offense"?

Avatar of Sundayfan

correct. It automatically does that.

Avatar of TheGrobe

...and, we've come full circle.

No, no it doesn't.