Endgame inferiority

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Avatar of ErrantDeeds

Alright folks. I've just agreed a draw with a player substantially higher rated than me. I bit his hand off, purely for the reason that my knowledge of endgames is so weak. I've looked at this position for a while now, and I have no idea weather there was a win there. What do people think? I was white, would you have agreed a draw? I think it's worth bearing in mind that any endgame I played would have been imperfect, to say the least. I have a request as well, I'd be interested in seeing what an engine thought of the position. I've checked it on a tablebase, but there are too many pieces.

Thanks,

ED.

Avatar of zxb995511

Your opponent really game you the benifit of the doubt here. Whith best play by both sides it was a very likely draw, but these kinds of endgames (Knites vs Bishop with pawns) are EXTREMELY complicated and more annoying to play for the side with the bishop in most cases.

Avatar of ErrantDeeds
zxb995511 wrote:

Your opponent really game you the benifit of the doubt here. Whith best play by both sides it was a very likely draw, but these kinds of endgames (Knites vs Bishop with pawns) are EXTREMELY complicated and more annoying to play for the side with the bishop in most cases.


 That's what I was hoping people would say! My worry was that I agreed a draw when there was some kind of technical win available. But as you say, it's very complicated indeed.

Avatar of Shivsky

 I think the draw makes sense here.  Stronger players tend to outplay weaker players in most end games because their average move quality tends to be higher and they've practiced these types of positions a whole lot more.

If he offered a draw and you can't see a win in sight, continuing to play is merely letting him pounce on a mistake that you are MORE statistically (rating difference) likely to make before he does.

However, if he was in time trouble or if you were playing to win at all costs (final round of a tournament etc.), I'd keep fighting.

Avatar of MarvsC

i think it's difficult for black to protect the e4 pawn after 1.Kf1 Nd3 2.Bd4 followed by g2-g3, Ke2-Ke3 while black had to defend his g-pawn.  But only with accurate play by White can he pull out the win against a 2100+ player.

Avatar of Loomis

It looks like the black king can defend the e-pawn.

1. Kf1 Nd2 2. Bd4 g6 3. Ke2 Ke6 4. c4 Ne5

Now the king will defend the e-pawn. White can change to a pure K and pawn ending, is he winning that ending?

5. Bxe5 Kxe5 6. Ke3 h5 7. g4 (white wants to take away squares where the king can defend the e-pawn) hxg4 8. hxg4 g5

So, I don't think white is winning the king and pawn ending, because he can't force the king away from defending the e-pawn. Are there any other tricks for white to try?

It's also possible that instead of allowing the piece trade, black could hold the ending a pawn down with knight vs. bishop by just staying on the light squares.

Avatar of Shakaali

The best way to learn these endings is to actually play them out. By agreeing to a draw you maybe gained some rating points but lost a valuable chance to learn something new.

Avatar of DMX21x1

I think your opponent didn't want the end game anymore than you did.  It does look drawish, although I think white would have to show best play. 

I suspect black is slightly better placed for 2 reasons.  Firstly his king is out in the open, ready for the endgame and headed for the centre of the board.  Yours is still under lockdown.  Secondly, you may find that his knight is more effective than your bishop, aside from mobility, black can reduce your bishops attacking capabilities by sticking to the white squares.  Plus he's probably looking to trade knight for bishop here, I don't think white could afford to allow that to happen.

On the other hand you have better pawn structure and some initiative with Kf1 or maybe c4.  I think you might have found that blacks c-file pawn would have been a problem later in the game. 

Avatar of Muetdhiver
Shakaali wrote:

The best way to learn these endings is to actually play them out. By agreeing to a draw you maybe gained some rating points but lost a valuable chance to learn something new.


Wise advice.