Bold and loud.
Guy starts chess at age of 20, is there the possibility he will ever achieve GM?

We went through this before in other threads. The reasons why older people can't is because of other stuff they have to worry about. They don't have enough time to dedicate to learning chess or other languages and stuff like that. They have to worry about bills, debt, money, surviving, etc.

The oldest person to ever become a GM did so at 72 years of age. Not sure how old he was when he started to play. I have been trying to find out the name of the person who went from beginner to IM in two years. No urban legend - it was reported in chess life magazine years ago.

I took up chess 2 years ago when i was 50.My highest to date was 1441.On the way i beat a C.M and had a draw with a G.M.I didnt think that i would get far, but on answering your question i would say yes.If you keep healthy and calm with little worries then i would say yes!.
I took up chess 2 years ago when i was 50.My highest to date was 1441.On the way i beat a C.M and had a draw with a G.M.I didnt think that i would get far, but on answering your question i would say yes.If you keep healthy and calm with little worries then i would say yes!.
Tournament games?

I would argue that while children have a more plastic brain, it does not necessarily translate to later ability. For example, lots of "early starter/prodigy" programs include classes for second languages, or musical instrument training. Generally, having higher plastic brains allow the child to learn these languages/skills quickly, which is to be expected. However, without continuing to use these skills, there is little translation into later ability. Generally, once these students reach adult age, they show no marked increased in ability compared to those that learned the abilities later on. For example, a child violin player that stopped playing at 15, would still be starting over if they picked it up at 30.
As with any skill, it is suggested that it takes 10,000 hours to master something, presumably, chess included. WIth less obligations, it's easier/faster for children to reach those hours compared to adults with other responsibilities/interruptions. With focus, it might take relatively longer for an adult to reach 10,000 total hours but still possible.
Therefore, I argue that it is indeed possible. Brains also remain plastic during our lifetimes, as proven with long-term MRI studies of taxi drivers. They show a growing hippocampus which is responsible for spacial orientation and spotting small details. This proves that the brain remains plastic throughout life.

People like to argue a lot in terms of how it's impossible for others to achieve something because they couldn't.
It's safe to say that "impossible" in these terms are very relative, and so, it's always possible.
"Because a thing seems difficult for you, do not think it impossible for anyone to accomplish. – Marcus Aurelius

The oldest person to ever become a GM did so at 72 years of age. Not sure how old he was when he started to play. I have been trying to find out the name of the person who went from beginner to IM in two years. No urban legend - it was reported in chess life magazine years ago.
Who became GM at 72? According to chessgames.com, the oldest player to earn the title was Janis Klovans from Latvia, at 62. Older players have been granted the honorary GM title. Is the 72-year-old one of these honorary title-holders? From winning the Senior World Championship?
Yes, not 72. Althought another source says Klovans 60. Look at these:
http://www.chess.com/article/view/records-in-chess?page=2
http://www.chess.com/article/view/older-chess-players

We have IM's at age of 14 like Anton Smirnov or Bogdan-Daniel Deac.
GM's at age of 15 like Sam Sevian and many others that came from 15 age.
Point is, guy starts playing at age of 20, he learns much slower than these super-boys, is there a possibility that he will ever make it to GM with tons and tons of hard work?
Just a question, cause took me 2 years to 1500 and I seem to be going nowhere above 1800 ever.
You could do it, assuming you have one of those minds which can run through Costco and years later recall the barcode on every item.
But even with that level of intellect, an elderly alcoholic horse brusher has a way higher chance of ruling the world, or being more wise & jolly and than Buddha.
That is actual scientific fact, more than gravity.
Even Walt Disney would point and laugh while telling you to give up that dream.
hahah dream crusher, its just an opinion... well its scientific fact too, but science thought the moon was cheese at one time, so don't give up.

Do you have any idea of how strong today's GMs, let alone the world top 100, are?
As well as a B player can and maybe better because I read about chess as well as play it.
Have you ever noticed how weak strong chess players can be when it comes to making substantive arguments outside the chess board?
Just becasue the 20 year-old future GM hasn't been happened yet doesn't mean it never will. Ask Roger Bannister, the first four-minute miler.
Twenty years ago who would have said that a 79 year-old could beat a super GM? Korchnoi did in 2011.
Forty years ago who would have said a woman could enter the top ten ranks of world chess players? Judit Polgar did in 2005.
For now our 20 year-old future GM is speculation, but I'm comfortable with my side of the bet.
And I still say that Chigorin is an excellent harbinger for it.
I don't know what B class is. The question is, do you sometimes play tournament games against GMs? Do you analyze with GMs? If not, I wonder what makes you so confident that you can estimate their strenght?
My last USCF rating was 1727. Obviously I don't play tournament games against GMs or analyze with them.
What's your background in education, neuroscience and the history of chess? What entitles you to limit what a 20 year-old might accomplish?
I had three friends who started chess when they were around 15. They all made 2200+. One reached 2350 and became an LM.
It doesn't seem unlikely that a gifted 20 year-old could make IM. Probably it's already happened. So why not GM?
I've read Paul Morphy's rating estimated in today's terms as 2500-2600. He wouldn't be in the running for world champion. But he would be a GM.
Your wild guess rating Chigorin at 2200-2300 strikes me as way too low.
Again, if Chigorin could start playing serious chess at 24 and eventually play two matches for the World Championship, I don't see why a 21st century Chigorin couldn't make GM.
When it happens, it will look inevitable, like Judit Polgar reaching the top ten or Korchnoi defeating a super GM at the age of 79.

The one salient point about both Korchnoi and Polgar is that they both demonstrated enormous chess talent long before they were close to 20 years old.
Which does not address my point, that the commonsense or even expert opinion of what a woman or senior might achieve could be wrong.
Therefore, the expectation of what a 20 year-old novice might achieve could be similarly wrong.
Again, the fact that Chigorin managed to reach World Champion level in his era after starting at 24 is a massive clue that it is possible for such a player to reach GM in the 21st century.
There are limits to what humans can achieve but in the realm of competition we have seen these limits broken over and over again.

bb_gum: Do you really believe that the current crop of world records won't be broken and they haven't been broken repeatedly in the past?
I suggest looking at any record book of track and field events.

C'mon it's simple math. Give the guy a probability, not some lame logic.
What would a probability be based on, aside from "lame logic"?

AxeKnight: What numbers do you have in mind?
I've provided one solid data point. Chigorin started playing serious chess at 24 and became one of the top two or three players in the world.
For now, our 20 year-old novice-to-GM is speculation, of course, but judging by the past, what has often seemed to be a solid limit, e.g. the four-minute mile, was more a matter of entrenched belief because it hadn't been done before.
Why not our 20 year-old?
And if this doesn't seem to be a useful discussion, feel free to ignore it.
Speaking of Paul the Octopus, the octopus keeps surprising us too.

Guy starts chess at age of 20, is there the possibility he will ever achieve GM?
Possibility? Yes. Likely? That seems to be where the discussion is. Many fields have late starters that are sucessful from time to time but those starting younger at least have an advantage even if it is only a headstart. Then there is the talent vs. hard work factor - even among world champions. Some had more talent than others but were lazier too.
Well, even if one has no chess talent but has a pretty good memory he/she can reach a Master level - even starting late. It's a matter of dedication and hard work + good instruction. By Master level I mean 2200 USCF (or equivalent). I'm sure that even somebody starting chess in their 30s and even 40s can do that. Even if they have absolutely zero knowledge about the game. That's probably even better. If they receive good quality instruction, they'll be able to lay a good foundation to build on. Matter of time and dedication. Chess Mastery is no different than acquiring a new trade/skill. Just take a look at older people going to college, obtaining degrees for the first time, and starting careers.
Do I know anybody who did that in chess? No! Because one has to really sacrifice a lot to achieve the 2200 level. And who has the time, money, and enthusiasm to do that? Enthusiasm is also one of those things that is harder to maintain. And, of course, obtaining chess mastery provides a very small ROI (return on investment) as compared to obtaining a new skill/trade that can land you a good paying job.
So, the answer to the orgininal question whther there is the possiblity, I'll answer Yes.