Is there such thing as "luck" in chess?

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AGC-Gambit_YT

Ziryab, Nf5 I think.

mpaetz
ChessAGC_YT wrote:

No? You're wrong, luck plays no part, luck a concept is being turned into a cliche, you're just being a joke. Winning/losing is not luck.

Then explain what chess skills determine the winner and loser in a chess.co game when a power outage shuts down one player's computer and their opponent wins. Did the winner see into the future and time the game to coincide with the outage? Did the winner get his buddy Thor, God of thunder, to blow down a power line? Or was it just luck?

AGC-Gambit_YT

"Luck" No, it was weather.

AGC-Gambit_YT

You think luck controls weather?

Jordi_Agost

Honestly, there’s no real “luck” in chess, since it’s all skill and there’s no randomness like rolling dice or drawing cards. But let’s be real, sometimes it feels like luck. Like when your opponent blunders just when you needed it, or they miss something you didn’t even plan. And in fast games like blitz or bullet, those crazy time scrambles can feel a bit like luck because you’re just moving on instinct. So yeah, it’s not actual luck, but sometimes it sure feels like it’s on your side.

AGC-Gambit_YT

@Jordi_Agost

Yes, people keep making up secenerios but keep forgetting that luck is a concept whether you believe it or not, it's not real, but real by belief, saying a cliche concept: via luck in chess is ridiculous because there is ALWAYS a reason, NOT luck, NEVER luck.

Kotshmot

That's a nice and strong statement there young man. May I ask what do you think is a reason for a result of a dice roll?

Jordi_Agost
Kotshmot escribió:

That's a nice and strong statement there young man. May I ask what do you think is a reason for a result of a dice roll?

What do you mean by reason ?

AGC-Gambit_YT

@Kotshmot

Gravity.

Kotshmot

That's the main one and maybe a couple of other factors in the mix. I'm sure you consequently wouldn't consider that an instance of luck either?

AGC-Gambit_YT

"luck" is a cliche, cliches are never factors in stuff.

AGC-Gambit_YT

cuz they aren't right.

playerafar
mpaetz wrote:

Saying "it's computer failure (or body malfunction, or whatever) not luck" that causes players to lose games rather than the players' decisions is meaningless. What chess skills did the winner use to win such games? Is chess not a contest, both players striving to outplay the other? When events beyond the control of either player are the deciding factor in victory/defeat that fits the definition of "luck".

Or do you think winning/losing is not part of the game? Perhaps we could just have judges look at games and award the point on the basis of who created the most artistically pleasing arrangement of the pieces on the board.

Good post by @mpaetz.
Regarding definitions of luck - yes - they vary.
But there's another factor.
How or where or when the luck applies. In the context of whatever.
Some people might maintain like this:
'Luck exists. Takes different forms. Has different definitions.
But doesn't apply to chess.'
With the final sentence being much too general and arbitrary.
---------------------------------
Much better:
'Luck clearly exists. As to whether luck applies to chess that depends on what aspect of chess or in what context or contexts of chess are being considered and its not binary yes or no. And also depends on what definition or definitions of luck are being considered.'
-----------------------------
Better still:
'There is clearly luck in chess and in many things. But if you wanted to narrow the defintion or aspects of luck and the aspects or contexts of chess being considered and you narrowed the definitions and aspects and contexts sufficiently you could find situations where luck wouldn't apply.'
------------------
Even more generally: If the definitions and factors and aspects and contexts of 'whatever' are 'adjusted' sufficiently then any statement could be made about anything with a claim that its valid.
One insane asylum resident to another:
'We're going to get out of here.'
Other: 'But then where are we going?'
First resident: 'We're going to steal a spaceship and then travel to the sun!'
Second: 'But its awfully hot on the Sun!'
First: 'Its okay. We're going to land at Night.'

playerafar

Shorter: Debates (or arguments) about luck applying in chess could continue on for millions of years and look about the same as they do now.
Chess is not solved.
But humanity could argue forever about luck existing.
Fortunately - time is more invested in better activities.
'Fortunately'. Also connects to 'luck'. A lot of things do.

AGC-Gambit_YT

you just said a cliche is connected to words...

DiogenesDue
Optimissed wrote:

As if. When did you last play a game of chess?

Around the last time you ran away from the forums and came back in spite of promising yourself you wouldn't, somewhere in there.

AGC-Gambit_YT

That's true tho...

AGC-Gambit_YT

Optimissed said that

DiogenesDue
ChessAGC_YT wrote:

Optimissed, u talking to me or Dio

He's talking to me.

That's twice now you have defaulted to assuming that a directly quoted reply to somebody else was meant for you instead. Worry is a self-inflicted wound. <-- Cliche.

AGC-Gambit_YT

Did you downvote me??? sad.png