I've got the center, now what?

In all my games I try very hard to move my pieces to the center, occupy and control, place my pieces in good spots that reflect the center control etc.  But lets say after a nice two-pawn center is achieved, I'm left thinking what to do next.  Almost all the time I think maybe I should advance one of the pawns, but then there is a like a hole or space that his pieces can use, and I don't gain much.  So when you have a two pawn center do you start advancing the wings? Or do you prepare your rooks behind them and roll them forwards...

Here is a game that probably shows my limited knowledge in middle-game planning, as always advice is greatly appreciated. 

Rooks traditionally belong on open/half open files OR behind pawns you are preparing to push. 16. Rc1 would have been more appropriate.

You have to be careful about those pawn pushes because if it allows the opponent an infiltration square for a knight, bishop, rook, etc, you'll be in trouble positionally and your "strong center" will be nothing but a staging ground for enemy forces.

That e5 move was weak because it gives up the d5 square and weakens a d5 push later.. If the purpose of this move was to free space for a knight on e4 then you have to note that black COULD have played f5 in response. If you were looking for a positional advantage, why not play Ne5 in that situation? there is no pawn to push back your knight and if he was looking to maintain a bishop, he would have to retreat and give your further momentum.

I agree with the post below mine.

The sexy knight: 17 Ne5? cxd4.

I don't think e5 in that position is so bad at all. You have other options but that one looks reasonable. The knight goes to d5 but you can put a knight on e4 (18 Ne4 was probably wrong though because ...c4 was strong, but Ne4 is more of a long term idea. Better might be Qe2-e4 first and then transfering the queen to the kingside) and take some momentum on the kingside, with more initiative than black seems to have. You're good there as long as d4 and e5 aren't too weak.

A common idea in that type of position is to first play d5, then e5 as a pawn sac. That way, your opponent's pawn is blocking the d5 square, so I don't know if it's good there (actually, it's probably not!) but it was worth considering.

There is no simple way to use a pawn center sometimes. Sometimes it's even a disadvantage in some rare cases where you're just tied down to it so you neither have time to gain space elsewhere nor have enough support to advance the pawns. In that position I think you were right to want to use your center dynamically, as that's often what you want to do eventually, use it as a way to develop your rooks easily on the central files and then breakthrough, open some lines and cramp the pieces when the time is right. Generally you want to control the space behind your pawns before you advance, that way your opponent has to retreat to a bad square when attacked.

You could have even played quietly with Bc2, maybe Qd3 with threats of e5. Then cxd4 gets rid of a center pawn but you still have control of it with your e pawn and centralized rooks so you're still in good shape.

Ok, I'm not actually looking into the position that much, I'm just being general with the possible ideas of using the center in that situation.

It's kind of hard to explain when to advance on the wings and when to advance the center. I think it depends on how much a wing attack weakens your center. When you're attacking in the center it's probably not going to fall apart, but with a wing attack it could.

A staging for enemy forces, that's exactly what I didn't want to be doing in my games.  Unfortunately this is the first time I've actually confronted this center control plan, this is going to improve my piece-play a lot during the middle-game! 

'Elubas' wonderful explanation, I gained a lot from your explanation, hopefully now I can apply this into my future games

Thanks for the support guys!

At move 15 I would a5, Na4, Nc5. Possible play would be 15. a5 Nc8 16. Na4 Na7 17. Nc5 Bc8.

I reviewed that Qb3 move in that game, and yes it does seem strong.  And since my rook is opposite the Black queen I should have considered d5 to open files

Thanks for the suggestions

Elubas, awesome post.  A lot to think about. 

Perplexing, for what it's worth, I'm in the "What now?" boat quite a bit and recently got this advice.  If you really are at a loss as to how to proceed and there are no immediate threats to defend against, but you can't think of a plan, you can always find your least active piece and try to improve its placement.  Sometimes I just think about where the piece would be ideally situated and see if I can come up with a plan to get it there. 

That might be a bit of a babystep between where you are and where Elubas is, although I'd be interested to here what he has to say about that advice.

Good post estragon

Yes, I think more than the Qb3 move or e5 move it would help the most to look at the position after move 13 0-0 and realize black's plan is to play the c5 or e5 break... like estragon says e5 being better but harder to pull off.  Just playing against these is good enough plan for white.

If white can stop these then he's at least ok if not better -- when he stops them and black's pieces are poor (the b6 knight and c8 bishop in this game) then white is just outright winning.  Your moves 14,15, and 16 didn't have to do with what was going on but you were still winning the whole time.  Remember you may not have an immediate action but don't foget your opponent has ideas too!  Then again, like estragon says white's ideas involve e5 which gains space and kicks the f6 knight with a kingside attack or d5 for center action.  Knowing when and where is experience but at least know the general ideas :)

I got these ideas out of Soltis' book... I didn't know it was out of print.  Many times you can still get an out of print book on amazon from people who are stilling theirs.

I agree. His middle isn't under a lot of pressure yet so he certainly has time to build up as well with a d5 push.

i want to sugjest some ting hopfully it will help.

untill recently i have never opend up a chess book or explord fanes games. so how did i know what do move? just by anilizing the next posible moves mine and most important my oppenents. thats it there are no real rules what is alliwed or not try planing a few moves forwonds every time and move accordenly! only after that learn what is idvisble by the book. its also going to give you a idvantege over your oppenent since sudenly you are not playing the regelar book game he is used to. i whould be happy if you will look at my chess online profile and see what i mean cause i realy believe there is no need in learning oppenings and what is a "good" move , its all acording to the options that will be caused by your move hope i helpt gl!!!

d5 on average is probably the more successfull plan, but you can't rule out e5 either. I have seen positions where d5 is often being prepared, at the same time I've seen positions in books where when white has his two pawn center what he's basically doing is centralizing his rooks (which defend the center but can also swing over to the kingside by lifting to the third rank) and just waiting for the right moment to chase the knight away with e5. The knight goes to d5, but it can't defend the kingside well there, and an e4 knight could be more powerful. I think everything must be considered and depending on what the opponent plays, the tactics could favor any of those moves, including the d5 sac involving e5 after.

Every pawn pushed is another brige burned

What's that supposed to mean?

"The moral: think twice before changing the pawn structure."

Exactly.

It used to bug me to see a game of lets say Alekhine where he "burns his bridges" to attack, and has 4-5 attacking pieces swarming around black's king with no clear way to break through.  Then I realized as long as his king is safe, and black is tied to defense, there's no way that many attackers will fail against 2-3 defenders, it just takes some maneuvers or pawn pushes to make it happen.

Having super GM intuition (and experience) doesn't hurt either, "my GM sense is tingling" but it still doesn't feel right for me to play this way, seems like a hope and a prayer.  Not that I wouldn't at least try if that's what the position called for... just thinking out loud.

I also have trouble playing sacs that don't lead to a completely forced win after 4 moves, but there are those piece sacs where it's tough for the opponent, even given a little bit of time to "unravel", you know what I mean? Like after a sac when it's hard for the other side to catch up in development (probably with rooks unconnected) without even losing material.

Sometimes you have to just assume the opponent can't have a defense I guess, but then again, you can get burned doing that!

I hate when Black thrusts with c5, because then my center feels so weak, so I feel like I need to force something on Black to slow him down.  But now I'm starting to understand how to handle these kinds of situations

Thank you everyone who has contributed to my topic, your advice is greatly appreciated

The guy knows how to make a point lol

Nimzowitz had a way with words that few can match. He was the Nietzsche of chess; he cared only for the truth as he saw it and nothing for other peoples' opinions.

His biggest rival, Siegbert Tarrash, said: "If you never move a pawn you'll never lose a game." A joke, but if both of them can agree on something, it might just be right.