I like it.
Nf3 forever!
Stockfish evaluation at depth 50 on all possible initial opening moves
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200 hours, holy shoot, burning disks!
Jul 4, 2017
0
#4
Good to know...I really need that extra 0.09 of a pawn advantage. 
To be serious for a moment, doesn't Stockfish have a rather high pruning factor? That might not be conducive to obtaining a highly accurate answer for this study.
Komodo evaluation, after running 189+ hours !! Depth 46. Komodo sees d4!! as the best(0.21). But still agreed Nf3 (0.18)as second best and g4 as the worst.(-0.85)!
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.520k 11.376k +0,21 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3 b6 4.g3 Bb4+ 5.Bd2 Bxd2+ 6.Qxd2 d5 7.Bg2 0-0 8.Ne5 Nbd7 9.Nc3 Bb7 10.0-0 Qe7 11.Rfd1 Rad8 12.Qf4 c5 13.cxd5 exd5 14.e3 Rfe8 15.Nxd7 Rxd7 16.b3 h6 17.Rac1 Rdd8 18.dxc5 bxc5 19.Na4 Rc8 20.Qf5 Red8 21.Qc2 c4 22.Nc3 a5 23.Rb1 Bc6 24.Rd4 cxb3 25.axb3 Bb7 26.Rbd1 Qc7
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.521k 11.376k +0,18 1.Nf3 d5 2.d4 Nf6 3.c4 c6 4.cxd5 cxd5 5.Nc3 Nc6 6.Bf4 Bf5 7.e3 e6 8.Ne5 Nxe5 9.Bxe5 Nd7 10.Bg3 h5 11.h3 Rc8 12.Rc1 Qb6 13.Qd2 h4 14.Bf4 Bd6 15.Bxd6 Qxd6 16.Bd3 Bxd3 17.Qxd3 0-0 18.0-0 Nf6 19.Rc2 Qb8 20.Rfc1 a6 21.e4 Qf4 22.e5 Ne4 23.Nxe4 Rxc2 24.Rxc2 dxe4 25.Qe3
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.522k 11.376k +0,13 1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.Nd2 c5 4.exd5 Qxd5 5.Ngf3 cxd4 6.Bc4 Qd6 7.0-0 Nf6 8.Re1 Be7 9.Nb3 Nc6 10.Nbxd4 Nxd4 11.Nxd4 0-0 12.c3 Qc7 13.Bd3 Rd8 14.Qf3 Bd6 15.h3 Be5 16.Be3 Bd7 17.Rad1 h6 18.Nb5 Bxb5 19.Bxb5 Rd5 20.Rxd5 Nxd5 21.Bd3 Rd8 22.Qe4 f5 23.Qc4 a6 24.Bd2 Qd6 25.Qb3 Bh2+ 26.Kh1
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.522k 11.376k +0,10 1.g3 c5 2.Bg2 Nc6 3.Nf3 g6 4.c4 Bg7 5.Nc3 d6 6.0-0 Bf5 7.d3 Qd7 8.Rb1 Bh3 9.a3 Nf6 10.b4 Bxg2 11.Kxg2 0-0 12.Bg5 Nh5 13.Qd2 Bxc3 14.Qxc3 f6 15.Bh6 Rfe8 16.b5 Ne5 17.Nxe5 dxe5 18.f3 Ng7 19.Bxg7 Kxg7 20.a4 Red8 21.a5 Rac8 22.Ra1 Ra8 23.Rfb1 Rac8 24.Qd2 Ra8 25.b6 Qd4 26.bxa7
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.523k 11.376k +0,10 1.c4 e5 2.Nc3 Nf6 3.Nf3 Nc6 4.g3 d5 5.cxd5 Nxd5 6.Bg2 Nb6 7.d3 Be7 8.Be3 0-0 9.0-0 Be6 10.a3 Nd5 11.Bd2 Qd7 12.Ne4 f6 13.Rc1 Rad8 14.Re1 a6 15.Qc2 Kh8 16.Nc5 Bxc5 17.Qxc5 Bh3 18.Qc2 Nde7 19.Be3 Bxg2 20.Kxg2 Nf5 21.Qb3 Qc8 22.Nd2 Nxe3+ 23.fxe3 g5 24.Qc4 f5 25.Nf3 h6 26.Qc3 Qe6
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.523k 11.376k +0,10 1.e3 Nf6 2.Nf3 d5 3.c4 e6 4.b3 Be7 5.d4 0-0 6.Bd3 dxc4 7.bxc4 c5 8.Bb2 b6 9.0-0 Bb7 10.Nc3 cxd4 11.exd4 Nc6 12.Rc1 Re8 13.Qd2 Bd6 14.Nb5 Bb4 15.Qe3 Bf8 16.h3 a6 17.Nc3 Ne7 18.Ne4 Nxe4 19.Bxe4 Nf5 20.Bxf5 exf5 21.Qb3 Be4 22.Rfe1 Qc7 23.d5 Bd6 24.Bd4 Rab8 25.a4 Bf4
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.523k 11.376k 0,00 1.c3 d5 2.Nf3 c5 3.d4 Nf6 4.Bf4 Nc6 5.e3 Nh5 6.dxc5 Nxf4 7.exf4 e6 8.b4 Qf6 9.g3 Bd7 10.Bg2 Nxb4 11.Ne5 Nc6 12.Nxd7 Kxd7 13.0-0 Kc7 14.Na3 Bxc5 15.Nb5+ Kb8 16.c4 a6 17.cxd5 exd5 18.Rc1 Bb4 19.Qxd5 axb5 20.Qxb5 Ra5 21.Qb6 Ra6 22.Qb5 Ra5
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.524k 11.376k 0,00 1.a3 c5 2.c3 d5 3.d4 e6 4.Bf4 Nf6 5.e3 Bd6 6.Nf3 Nc6 7.dxc5 Bxc5 8.c4 0-0 9.Nc3 d4 10.exd4 Nxd4 11.Be2 Nxf3+ 12.Bxf3 Bd4 13.Nb5 Bxb2 14.Rb1 e5 15.Rxb2 Qxd1+ 16.Bxd1 exf4 17.Nc7 Rb8 18.Na6 Ra8 19.Nc7
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.524k 11.376k 0,00 1.h3 d5 2.d4 c5 3.e3 Nf6 4.c4 cxd4 5.exd4 Nc6 6.Nf3 g6 7.c5 Bg7 8.Nc3 0-0 9.Bb5 Ne4 10.0-0 Qa5 11.Bxc6 bxc6 12.Bf4 Nxc3 13.bxc3 Qxc3 14.Re1 Bf5 15.Rxe7 Rfe8 16.Qe1 Qxe1+ 17.Raxe1 Be4 18.Rxe8+ Rxe8 19.Bd6 Rc8 20.Ng5 Bf5 21.Nf3 Be4
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.525k 11.376k 0,00 1.Nc3 d5 2.d4 Nf6 3.Bf4 e6 4.Nb5 Bd6 5.Nxd6+ cxd6 6.c3 Nc6 7.Nf3 0-0 8.Bg3 Qe7 9.e3 e5 10.Be2 a6 11.0-0 h6 12.Re1 Bf5 13.h3 Rfe8 14.Nd2 Qd7 15.Qb3 Qc7 16.Bh4 g5 17.Bg3 Bg6 18.Qd1 Kg7 19.Rc1 Rad8 20.Qb3 Na5 21.Qb4 Nc6 22.Qb3
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.525k 11.376k 0,00 1.b3 d5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Bb2 Bg4 4.e3 e6 5.Be2 h6 6.0-0 Nbd7 7.c4 c6 8.d4 Bd6 9.c5 Bc7 10.Nbd2 Bf5 11.b4 0-0 12.a4 Ne4 13.b5 Nxd2 14.Nxd2 Qf6 15.Nf3 Rab8 16.Rc1 Rfd8 17.Bc3 Qe7 18.h3 Be4 19.Nd2 Bf5 20.Nf3
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.526k 11.376k 0,00 1.d3 d5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.g3 c5 4.c4 dxc4 5.Qa4+ Bd7 6.Qxc4 Nc6 7.Qxc5 e5 8.Qc2 Rc8 9.Qd1 Bb4+ 10.Bd2 e4 11.dxe4 Nxe4 12.Nc3 Bxc3 13.Bxc3 Qb6 14.e3 Nxc3 15.bxc3 Qc5 16.Rc1 Bg4 17.Be2 Bh3 18.Bf1 Be6 19.Be2 Bh3
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.526k 11.376k -0,12 1.b4 e5 2.Bb2 Bxb4 3.Bxe5 Nf6 4.e3 0-0 5.c4 d5 6.Nf3 Bf5 7.a3 Bd6 8.d4 Bxe5 9.dxe5 Ne4 10.cxd5 c6 11.Be2 cxd5 12.0-0 Qe7 13.Qxd5 Rd8 14.Qb3 Nc6 15.Nc3 Nc5 16.Qa2 Nxe5 17.Nd4 Bg6 18.Nd5 Qd7 19.Nf4 Be4 20.Rfd1 Qe7 21.f3 Bc6 22.Nf5 Qf6 23.Nd4 Rac8 24.Rac1 b6 25.Qc2
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.527k 11.376k -0,15 1.a4 d5 2.d4 Bf5 3.c3 e6 4.Bf4 Bd6 5.e3 Bxf4 6.exf4 Ne7 7.Nf3 0-0 8.Be2 Nd7 9.0-0 c5 10.dxc5 Nxc5 11.Nd4 Qb6 12.Ra2 Bg6 13.g3 Nc6 14.a5 Qc7 15.Re1 Rac8 16.Ra3 Ne4 17.a6 Nxd4 18.Qxd4 b6 19.Nd2 Nd6 20.Qe3 Rfd8 21.Raa1 Bf5 22.g4 Be4 23.Nxe4 Nxe4 24.Rad1 h6
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.527k 11.376k -0,17 1.f4 Nf6 2.Nf3 c5 3.Nc3 d5 4.e3 g6 5.Bb5+ Bd7 6.Qe2 Nc6 7.Ne5 Qc7 8.Nxd7 Qxd7 9.d3 Bg7 10.e4 0-0 11.Bd2 a6 12.Bxc6 Qxc6 13.e5 Nd7 14.0-0-0 d4 15.Ne4 f5 16.exf6 exf6 17.Rhe1 Rfe8 18.Qf3 f5 19.Ng5 Qxf3 20.Nxf3 Nb6 21.g3 Nd5 22.Ne5 b6 23.Nc4 Bf6 24.b3 b5 25.Ne5 Bxe5 26.fxe5 Kf7 27.Kb2
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.534k 11.376k -0,28 1.h4 d5 2.d4 c5 3.c3 Nc6 4.Nf3 e6 5.Bf4 Bd6 6.Bxd6 Qxd6 7.e3 Nf6 8.Bb5 0-0 9.0-0 Bd7 10.a4 a6 11.Bxc6 Bxc6 12.Ne5 Ne4 13.Nxc6 bxc6 14.Nd2 Nxd2 15.dxc5 Qxc5 16.Qxd2 e5 17.h5 h6 18.Qe2 Rab8 19.e4 a5 20.exd5 cxd5 21.Rad1 Rfe8 22.Rfe1 f6 23.Rd2 d4 24.Qd3 Qd5 25.cxd4
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.534k 11.376k -0,40 1.Nh3 d5 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nf4 c5 4.e3 Nc6 5.Bb5 Qb6 6.Nc3 e6 7.0-0 Be7 8.dxc5 Qxc5 9.Nd3 Qd6 10.b3 0-0 11.Ne2 Nb8 12.Ba4 a6 13.b4 Bd7 14.Bb3 a5 15.bxa5 Nc6 16.a4 Rfc8 17.Bb2 e5 18.c4 Be6 19.c5 Qc7 20.Nc3 Qd8 21.Nb5 Ne4 22.Nxe5 Nxa5 23.c6 bxc6 24.Nd4 Qb6 25.f3 Nxb3
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.535k 11.376k -0,41 1.Na3 e5 2.c4 c6 3.d4 exd4 4.Nf3 Nf6 5.Qxd4 d5 6.e3 a6 7.cxd5 cxd5 8.Nc2 Nc6 9.Qd1 Bd6 10.Be2 0-0 11.0-0 Ne4 12.Ncd4 Re8 13.Bd2 Bd7 14.Rc1 Qb6 15.Bc3 Rac8 16.h3 h6 17.Nxc6 bxc6 18.Bd3 Bf5 19.Nd4 Bg6 20.Bxe4 Bxe4 21.b4 c5 22.bxc5 Bxc5 23.Qg4 Qg6 24.Qxg6 Bxg6 25.Rfd1 Be4
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.535k 11.376k -0,47 1.f3 e5 2.Nc3 Nc6 3.e4 Nf6 4.Bb5 Nd4 5.Nge2 c6 6.Bd3 Bc5 7.Na4 Bd6 8.0-0 Ne6 9.Bc4 0-0 10.Bxe6 fxe6 11.d3 b5 12.Nac3 Bc5+ 13.Kh1 d5 14.a3 Qb6 15.Qe1 Bb7 16.Bg5 Bd6 17.Nd1 c5 18.Nf2 Qc7 19.Ng3 a5 20.Qd2 Bc6 21.exd5 exd5 22.Nf5 h6 23.Nxd6 Qxd6 24.Bxf6 Rxf6 25.Ng4
46 189:19:46 7.753.813.535k 11.376k -0,85 1.g4 d5 2.c4 Bxg4 3.Qb3 dxc4 4.Qxb7 Nd7 5.Na3 Rb8 6.Qg2 Be6 7.Nh3 Nb6 8.Ng5 Bd5 9.e4 h6 10.Nh7 Rxh7 11.exd5 Qxd5 12.Qxd5 Nxd5 13.Nxc4 e6 14.b3 Nb4 15.Ke2 Ne7 16.Bb2 g5 17.h4 g4 18.Bg2 Ng6 19.Be5 Nxe5 20.Nxe5 f5 21.Nc6 Nxc6 22.Bxc6+ Ke7 23.Rac1 Kf6 24.d4 Bd6 25.Rhe1 Rb6 26.Rc2 h5 27.Rec1 a6 28.Rc4 Ba3 29.R1c2
BobbyTalparov wrote:
The Grob evaluated worse than a3, a4, h3, and h4? I find that hard to believe.
Because, after g4 and d5 from black white lose another tempo again to save that weak pawn on g4 .And g4 is a weak pawn under h5 thread as well.
BobbyTalparov wrote:
The Grob evaluated worse than a3, a4, h3, and h4? I find that hard to believe.
Another possible black moves after g4! According to this test, white is quite guaranteed to lose after 1. g4 d5 . Stockfish_17062123_x64_modern:
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k -0.56 1. ... f5 2.gxf5 d5 3.e4 g6 4.fxg6 hxg6 5.Bg2 d4 6.Qf3 e5 7.Qg3 Qf6 8.d3 Qg7 9.Nf3 Nc6 10.h4 Bd7 11.Bh3 0-0-0 12.Bg5 Bb4+ 13.Nbd2 Nf6 14.0-0-0 Bxd2+ 15.Rxd2 Bxh3 16.Rxh3 Rde8 17.Kb1 Nh5 18.Qg4+ Kb8 19.a3
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k -0.27 1. ... Nh6 2.h3 d5 3.d4 e6 4.Nc3 Ng8 5.e4 Nc6 6.e5 h5 7.gxh5 Bd7 8.a3 Qe7 9.Be3 0-0-0 10.Nge2 f6 11.f4 Rxh5 12.Qd2 Qf7 13.Ng3 Rh4 14.0-0-0 Nge7 15.Kb1 Kb8 16.Bd3 fxe5 17.dxe5 g6 18.Qf2
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k -0.08 1. ... g5 2.d4 d5 3.h3 h5 4.gxh5 Rxh5 5.e4 g4 6.Nc3 dxe4 7.Nxe4 Nf6 8.Nxf6+ exf6 9.Bg2 Nc6 10.hxg4 Rxh1 11.Bxh1 Qd6 12.Be3 Qb4+ 13.c3 Qxb2 14.Ne2 Bxg4 15.Rb1 Qxa2 16.Rxb7 Ne7 17.Rxc7 Nd5 18.Nc1 Bxd1 19.Nxa2 Nxc7 20.Bxa8 Nxa8 21.Kxd1 Nb6
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k -0.06 1. ... Nf6 2.g5 Nh5 3.e4 g6 4.Nc3 c6 5.d4 d5 6.Bg2 dxe4 7.Nxe4 h6 8.Ne2 Qb6 9.gxh6 Nd7 10.a4 Bxh6 11.Bxh6 Rxh6 12.Qc1 Rh8 13.a5 Qc7 14.Qe3 Kf8 15.h4 Ndf6 16.Nxf6 Nxf6 17.Qg3 Qd6 18.Qxd6
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k 0.00 1. ... b6 2.Bg2 d5 3.c4 c6 4.Nf3 h5 5.g5 e6 6.d4 Bd6 7.0-0 Ne7 8.b3 Ba6 9.Nc3 0-0 10.Re1 Bb4 11.Bd2 Ng6 12.Rc1 Nd7 13.e4 dxc4 14.bxc4 e5 15.Qa4 c5 16.Qxa6 cxd4 17.Nd5 Bxd2 18.Nxd2 Qxg5
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k +0.10 1. ... a5 2.d4 d5 3.h3 e6 4.Bf4 Bb4+ 5.Nd2 Bd6 6.Bxd6 cxd6 7.e3 Nc6 8.Ne2 Nge7 9.c3 b5 10.Ng3 b4 11.a3 bxc3 12.bxc3 0-0 13.Rb1 Qc7 14.Qc2 Ba6 15.Bxa6 Rxa6 16.0-0 Raa8 17.Ne2 Rab8 18.Rxb8 Rxb8 19.Rb1 Rxb1+ 20.Qxb1
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k +0.12 1. ... b5 2.e4 Bb7 3.Bg2 e6 4.d3 Ne7 5.Bg5 d5 6.Nd2 h6 7.Bh4 g5 8.Bg3 Ng6 9.exd5 Bxd5 10.Bxd5 Qxd5 11.Qf3 Nc6 12.a4 Nd4 13.Qxd5 exd5 14.0-0-0 bxa4 15.Ngf3 Nxf3 16.Nxf3 Be7 17.Rde1 0-0-0 18.h4 Kb7 19.hxg5
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k +0.18 1. ... c6 2.d4 d5 3.h3 c5 4.dxc5 e6 5.Bg2 Bxc5 6.c4 Ne7 7.cxd5 exd5 8.Nc3 Nbc6 9.e3 h5 10.gxh5 d4 11.exd4 Bxd4 12.Nge2 Bxc3+ 13.Nxc3 Qxd1+ 14.Nxd1 Rxh5 15.Ne3 Be6 16.b3 0-0-0 17.Bb2 f6 18.Rd1 Rxd1+ 19.Kxd1 Kc7 20.Bc3 Nd5 21.Nxd5+ Bxd5 22.Bxd5
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k +0.19 1. ... f6 2.d4 d5 3.h3 e5 4.dxe5 fxe5 5.e4 Nf6 6.exd5 Qxd5 7.Qxd5 Nxd5 8.Bc4 Nb6 9.Bb5+ Bd7 10.Nc3 Bb4 11.Bxd7+ N8xd7 12.Nge2 0-0-0 13.a3 Be7 14.b3 a5 15.Be3 a4 16.0-0 h5 17.Rfd1 hxg4 18.hxg4 axb3 19.cxb3 Nf6 20.Rxd8+ Rxd8
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k +0.24 1. ... Na6 2.Nf3 d5 3.h3 e6 4.Bg2 c5 5.c4 d4 6.d3 Bd6 7.0-0 h5 8.g5 Ne7 9.Nh4 Nf5 10.Nxf5 exf5 11.f4 0-0 12.e3 dxe3 13.Bxe3 Nb4 14.Nc3 Re8 15.Bd2 Be6 16.Qf3 Nc2 17.Qxh5 Nxa1 18.Rxa1
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k +0.24 1. ... h6 2.d4 d5 3.h3 Nf6 4.Bg2 b5 5.Nf3 e6 6.c3 Nbd7 7.Ne5 Bb7 8.0-0 c5 9.Bf4 Be7 10.a4 cxd4 11.axb5 dxc3 12.Nxc3 Nxe5 13.Bxe5 0-0 14.Qd2 Nd7 15.Bd4 a6 16.Rfc1 axb5 17.Rxa8 Qxa8 18.Nxb5 Rc8 19.Rxc8+ Qxc8
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k +0.24 1. ... g6 2.d4 d5 3.h3 Bg7 4.Nf3 h5 5.g5 e6 6.c3 Nd7 7.Bf4 Ne7 8.e3 0-0 9.h4 b6 10.Nbd2 Bb7 11.Bd3 c5 12.0-0 Nc6 13.Bd6 Re8 14.Bb5 e5 15.Nxe5 Ndxe5 16.Bxe5 Bxe5 17.dxe5 Rxe5 18.Bxc6 Bxc6
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k +0.29 1. ... h5 2.g5 e5 3.Nc3 d5 4.d4 Nc6 5.Nf3 e4 6.Nh4 Bb4 7.Bf4 Na5 8.e3 Bxc3+ 9.bxc3 Ne7 10.Be5 Kf8 11.Qd2 Be6 12.f4 Kg8 13.Rg1 a6 14.Qg2 Nf5 15.Nxf5 Bxf5 16.Be2 h4 17.Rb1 b6 18.h3 Qd7 19.Bg4 Bxg4
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k +0.35 1. ... Nc6 2.d4 d5 3.h3 h5 4.g5 Bf5 5.Nf3 Nb4 6.Na3 e6 7.Bg2 Nc6 8.Nh4 Be4 9.f3 Bh7 10.0-0 Bxa3 11.bxa3 Qd6 12.e4 Nge7 13.e5 Qd7 14.Rb1 0-0-0 15.Qd2 b6 16.Rf2 Kb7 17.Bf1 Ka8 18.Bg2
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k +0.36 1. ... d6 2.e3 h5 3.gxh5 Nf6 4.c4 e5 5.Nc3 Nc6 6.d4 exd4 7.exd4 d5 8.c5 Bg4 9.Be2 Bxe2 10.Qxe2+ Qe7 11.Nf3 Rxh5 12.Qxe7+ Bxe7 13.Rg1 Nb4 14.Ke2 Kf8 15.Rg5 Re8 16.Rxh5 Nxh5 17.Be3 c6 18.Ne5 Nc2 19.Rb1
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k +0.37 1. ... a6 2.d4 d5 3.h3 h5 4.g5 Bf5 5.Nf3 e6 6.c4 Ne7 7.Nc3 Ng6 8.e3 Bb4 9.Bd2 0-0 10.Be2 dxc4 11.Bxc4 Nd7 12.a3 Bxc3 13.Bxc3 Nb6 14.Be2 Nd5 15.Rc1 c6 16.Bd2 Qb6 17.b4 Kh8 18.h4 Rad8
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k +0.37 1. ... e6 2.d4 d5 3.Bg2 Nf6 4.h3 Be7 5.Bf4 c5 6.e3 0-0 7.dxc5 Bxc5 8.Nf3 Nc6 9.0-0 Qe7 10.Nc3 h6 11.Ne5 Nxe5 12.Bxe5 Rd8 13.Nb5 Bd7 14.Nd4 Rac8 15.c3 Ne4 16.f3 Bd6 17.fxe4 Bxe5 18.exd5
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k +0.41 1. ... c5 2.h3 h5 3.g5 Nc6 4.d3 e6 5.e4 Nge7 6.Ne2 d5 7.Bg2 g6 8.0-0 Bg7 9.c4 d4 10.Nd2 0-0 11.f4 e5 12.fxe5 Nxe5 13.Nf4 N7c6 14.Nf3 Kh8 15.Nd5 Nxf3+ 16.Rxf3 Be5 17.Bd2 Be6 18.Nf6 Qd6 19.a3
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k +0.45 1. ... e5 2.Bg2 h5 3.gxh5 d5 4.Nc3 Be6 5.Nf3 Nc6 6.d4 e4 7.Ng5 Qf6 8.Nxe6 fxe6 9.e3 0-0-0 10.Bd2 e5 11.Qg4+ Kb8 12.0-0-0 Qe7 13.dxe5 Nxe5 14.Qe2 Nf6 15.f3 exf3 16.Bxf3 Qf7 17.Kb1 Nxf3 18.Qxf3 Bc5 19.e4 d4 20.Ne2 Rxh5
33/50 2:24:53 21,849,306k 2,513k +0.80 1. ... d5 2.e3 e5 3.d4 Nc6 4.Nc3 e4 5.h4 h5 6.gxh5 Nf6 7.Be2 Bd7 8.Nh3 Ne7 9.b3 Nf5 10.Bb2 Bd6 11.Ng5 c6 12.Na4 Qe7 13.c4 0-0-0 14.Nc3 Kb8 15.a3 Bc7 16.Qc2 a6 17.c5 Nxh5 18.0-0-0
pfren wrote:
These TalkChess guys should be sued for wasting so much precious electrical energy for nothing.
Why? Computers are the way to solve chess., same as the solved game checker. Rybka author tested King gambit with massive amount to time. According to his test. After 1. e4 e5. 2. f4 ef4, the only move to get a draw from white is 3. Be2. All other moves lead to forced lose for white. Chess is partially solved these days, at lease that variation of King's gambit accepted is solved. (not sure how many variations/nodes he searched to conclude that statement) http://en.chessbase.com/post/rajlich-busting-the-king-s-gambit-this-time-for-sure
Jul 5, 2017
0
#9
drmrboss wrote:
pfren wrote:
These TalkChess guys should be sued for wasting so much precious electrical energy for nothing.
Why? Computers are the way to solve chess., same as the solved game checker. Rybka author tested King gambit with massive amount to time. According to his test. After 1. e4 e5. 2. f4 ef4, the only move to get a draw from white is 3. Be2. All other moves lead to forced lose for white. Chess is partially solved these days, at lease that variation of King's gambit accepted is solved. (not sure how many variations/nodes he searched to conclude that statement) http://en.chessbase.com/post/rajlich-busting-the-king-s-gambit-this-time-for-sure
Uh, yeah, if you say so...
https://en.chessbase.com/post/the-chebase-april-fool-s-prank
bb_gum234 wrote:
pfren wrote:
These TalkChess guys should be sued for wasting so much precious electrical energy for nothing.
I hate to agree because this was a lot of effort, but yeah, for nothing.
Engines aren't designed to be useful in this way, (and even if they were, they wouldn't be )
It's like saying hey guys, I drank my morning coffee with a spoon, isn't that amazing?! It's not amazing it's really silly.
Well how do you consume your coffee? I use a brand new straw that's NEVER been into someone's mouth. Who puts their lips on the rim of a cup that's been used over a hundred times by different people?
Utterly absurd and completely disgusting, sir.
This is the screenshot of cerebellum Demo. Again Stockfish see Nf3 as best opening scoring 0.11 at depth( 27+68)= 95 level and g4 as the worst -0.87 at depth (26+18)= 44 level.
I dont think the scores will not change that much beyond depth 100.
And my brother said I was insane when he looked at my copy of the small ECO.
Jul 23, 2017
0
#15
After 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 the best move is 3. Nc3 my dear Komodo! And after 1.Nf3 Black can play anything except ..e5, which is nothing to be sorry.
drmrboss wrote:
pfren wrote:
These TalkChess guys should be sued for wasting so much precious electrical energy for nothing.
Why? Computers are the way to solve chess., same as the solved game checker. Rybka author tested King gambit with massive amount to time. According to his test. After 1. e4 e5. 2. f4 ef4, the only move to get a draw from white is 3. Be2. All other moves lead to forced lose for white. Chess is partially solved these days, at lease that variation of King's gambit accepted is solved. (not sure how many variations/nodes he searched to conclude that statement) http://en.chessbase.com/post/rajlich-busting-the-king-s-gambit-this-time-for-sure
Chess is not checkers. The processing power required is about 10^30 times more. Checkers is closer to flipping a coin than it is to chess' complexity. You cannot solve chess that way, at least not in our lifetimes, nor in the lifespan of our sun...plus, you fell for a (very old now) April Fool's joke.
Chessbase really needs to take that stupid article down because it is always causing trouble. Ponz quoted this fake article this past week also.
10^1 10^15 10^50 10^80
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
^ Coin Flip ^ Checkers ^ Chess ^Atoms in the Universe
(Note that the above line graph is exponential, not linear, each dash is 10 times "longer" than the previous one)
So you're saying chess is solved by just 1. d4
Chess is almost solved , It is extremely drawish game. To win a game , a player must do a series of big mistakes that worth +5 material advantage in one side or value equivalent to one Rook and above. Sometimes a player has a margin to throw away even a queen +9.5 material and still a draw( compare first two diagrams) and sometimes a player has margin to throw away two potential queens (+ 19 potential materials) and still a draw. Current SF vs SF in 2 hour standard game in common 4 cores desktop lead to > 95 percent draw. ( Statistical p value >0.05 ) and we can conclude this is a draw. In next 10-20 years, we can see the draw rate will be increasing to 97-99%.
In short, u need to do extremely stupid moves to lose a game where the game is virtually extremely drawish. We still dont have 32 men tbs, but if you look at 7 men tbs you can see that you can do series of extremely bad moves and still draw.
Jul 24, 2017
0
#19
drmrboss wrote:
Current SF vs SF in 2 hour standard game in common 4 cores desktop lead to > 95 percent draw.
OK, but how can you be sure that SF will not (under same conditions) draw only 50% games against strong engine from far universe?
A guy from Talk chess forum run the infinite evaluation of initial position for 200+ hours on all possible 20 opening moves . Surprisingly, the two most popular opening moves both e4 and d4 are evaluated as 0.08+ and 0.06+ only. Nf3 scores as the best opening move with eval 0.17, while g4 is considered as the worst opening and it might possibly leady to forced lose for white with -0.92 evaluation.
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k +0,17 1.Nf3 d5 2.g3 c6 3.c4 g6 4.cxd5 cxd5 5.d4 Bg7 6.Bg2 e6 7.0-0 Ne7 8.b3 0-0 9.Qd2 Nbc6 10.Ba3 Qd7 11.Rc1 b6 12.e3 Bb7 13.Nc3 Rfc8 14.Rc2 Nf5 15.Rac1 h5 16.Bh3 a5 17.Na4 Qd8 18.Bxf5 exf5 19.h3 Bf6 20.Kg2 Bg7 21.h4 Bf6 22.Rc3 Ne7 23.Rxc8 Nxc8 24.Nc3 Nd6 25.Bxd6 Qxd6 26.Nb5 Qd7
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k +0,08 1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.Nd2 c5 4.exd5 Qxd5 5.Ngf3 cxd4 6.Bc4 Qd6 7.0-0 Nf6 8.Nb3 Nc6 9.Nbxd4 Nxd4 10.Nxd4 a6 11.Re1 Qc7 12.Bb3 Bd6 13.g3 0-0 14.Bg5 Qd8 15.c3 h6 16.Bxf6 Qxf6 17.Qf3 Qxf3 18.Nxf3 Rd8 19.Rad1 b5 20.Ne5 Bc7 21.Rxd8+ Bxd8 22.Rd1 Bc7 23.Bc2 Bb7 24.Rd7 Bxe5 25.Rxb7 Rd8 26.a4 Rd2 27.axb5 axb5
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k +0,06 1.d4 d5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.e3 e6 4.Nbd2 Be7 5.Bd3 c5 6.b3 Nc6 7.Bb2 b6 8.0-0 Bb7 9.a3 Qc7 10.Rc1 cxd4 11.exd4 Qf4 12.g3 Qh6 13.Kg2 0-0 14.Rh1 Rac8 15.Qe2 g6 16.Rce1 Qg7 17.h3 Rfd8 18.c3 Bd6 19.a4 Rc7 20.b4 h6 21.Ne5 Ne7 22.b5 Nf5 23.Ndf3 Ne4 24.c4 Bb4 25.cxd5 exd5
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k 0,00 1.c4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 e6 6.e3 Bb4 7.Be2 Ne4 8.Bd2 Nxc3 9.Bxc3 Bxc3+ 10.bxc3 0-0 11.0-0 Na5 12.Nb3 b6 13.Nxa5 bxa5 14.Rb1 Qc7 15.Bf3 Rb8 16.Rxb8 Qxb8 17.Qd4 Qb2 18.a4 Bb7 19.Qxd7 Bxf3 20.gxf3 Qe2 21.Qc6 Qd3 22.Kg2 Qg6+ 23.Kh3 Qd3 24.Kg2
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k 0,00 1.b3 d5 2.Nf3 Bf5 3.Bb2 e6 4.d3 h6 5.g3 c6 6.Nbd2 Nf6 7.Bg2 Be7 8.0-0 0-0 9.Re1 Nbd7 10.h3 Bg6 11.e4 dxe4 12.dxe4 Qc7 13.Qe2 a5 14.a3 Rfd8 15.Nh4 Bh7 16.Nhf3
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k 0,00 1.g3 c5 2.e4 d5 3.exd5 Qxd5 4.Nf3 Nc6 5.d3 Nd4 6.Bg2 Bh3 7.Bxh3 Nxf3+ 8.Kf1 Nd2+ 9.Kg1 Nf3+ 10.Kf1
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k 0,00 1.e3 d5 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nf3 e6 4.b3 b6 5.c4 Bd6 6.Ba3 dxc4 7.Bxd6 cxd6 8.bxc4 Nc6 9.Be2 Qd7 10.0-0 0-0 11.Nfd2 Ba6 12.Nb3 Rab8 13.N1d2 Rfc8 14.h3 h6 15.Re1 Bb7 16.Qb1 Ne7 17.a4 a5 18.Rc1 Bc6 19.Qa2 Bb7 20.Qb1
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k 0,00 1.c3 Nf6 2.d4 d5 3.Bg5 c5 4.e3 e6 5.Nf3 Nbd7 6.Bf4 Nh5 7.Be5 Nhf6 8.Bf4
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k 0,00 1.h3 e5 2.e3 d5 3.d4 Nc6 4.dxe5 Nxe5 5.Nf3 Nxf3+ 6.Qxf3 Nf6 7.Bd3 c6 8.0-0 Bd6 9.Nc3 Bc7 10.Re1 Qd6 11.Qf4 Qe7 12.Qh4 Qd6 13.Qf4
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k 0,00 1.d3 d5 2.e4 dxe4 3.dxe4 Qxd1+ 4.Kxd1 e5 5.Nd2 f6 6.f3 Nh6 7.a4 Nf7 8.Nh3 Nd6 9.b3 Be6 10.Nf2 Nc6 11.c3 0-0-0 12.Kc2 Na5 13.Be2 h5 14.Nd3 b6 15.b4 Nc6 16.Rd1 a5 17.b5 Nb8 18.Nb2 Nd7 19.Ndc4 Nb7 20.Ne3 Nd6 21.Nec4
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k 0,00 1.a3 e5 2.c4 g6 3.b4 Nf6 4.e3 Bg7 5.Bb2 Qe7 6.Nc3 0-0 7.Be2 a5 8.b5 d6 9.Nf3 e4 10.Nd4 Nbd7 11.0-0 Nc5 12.Qc2 Bd7 13.a4 c6 14.Nb3 Bf5 15.Nd4 Bd7
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k 0,00 1.b4 e5 2.Bb2 Bxb4 3.Bxe5 Nf6 4.Nf3 0-0 5.e3 d5 6.c4 c5 7.cxd5 Nxd5 8.Qc2 Nc6 9.Bb2 g6 10.Be2 Bf5 11.Qb3 Be6 12.Qc2 Qe7 13.0-0 Rad8 14.a3 Bf5 15.Qb3 Ba5 16.Nc3 Nxc3 17.Bxc3 Be4 18.Bb2 Bd5 19.Qa4 Bc7 20.Rac1 Na5 21.Bc3 Nc6 22.Bb2
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k 0,00 1.f4 b6 2.b3 Nf6 3.Bb2 c5 4.g3 Bb7 5.Nf3 d5 6.Bg2 e6 7.e3 g6 8.0-0 Nc6 9.d3 Bg7 10.c4 Rc8 11.Qe2 0-0 12.Ne5 h5 13.Na3 Nxe5 14.Bxe5 Ne8 15.Bxg7 Kxg7 16.cxd5 Bxd5 17.e4 Bc6 18.Qb2+ Nf6 19.Nc4 h4 20.gxh4 Rh8 21.Ne5 Rxh4 22.f5 exf5 23.Nxc6 Rxc6 24.exf5 Rc7 25.fxg6 Qd4+ 26.Qxd4 Rxd4 27.gxf7 Rxf7 28.Rf2 Rxd3
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k -0,14 1.Nc3 d5 2.d4 Nf6 3.Bf4 a6 4.e3 e6 5.Nf3 b5 6.Be2 c5 7.0-0 Bb7 8.Nb1 Nbd7 9.c3 Nb6 10.Nbd2 c4 11.b3 Ba3 12.Qc2 0-0 13.Ne5 Rc8 14.Rfb1 Nfd7 15.Rd1 Nxe5 16.Bxe5 Be7 17.Rdc1 Bc6 18.Bg3 Qd7 19.h3 Rfd8 20.bxc4 dxc4 21.e4 Bd6 22.Bxd6 Qxd6 23.Re1 h6 24.e5 Qc7 25.Rab1 Qb7
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k -0,16 1.a4 Nf6 2.d4 e6 3.Nf3 c5 4.c3 Nc6 5.e3 Qc7 6.Nbd2 d5 7.Bb5 Be7 8.0-0 0-0 9.b3 b6 10.Ba3 Bb7 11.Qb1 a5 12.Bb2 Rad8 13.h3 Ne4 14.Qe1 f5 15.Qe2 Bd6 16.Rad1 Na7 17.Bd3 Qe7 18.Rfe1 Nc6 19.Bb5 Bc7 20.Kh1 Qf7 21.Kg1 Qg6 22.Nh4 Qh6 23.Nhf3 g5 24.Bxc6 Bxc6 25.Nxe4 dxe4 26.Ne5 Bd5
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k -0,19 1.h4 Nf6 2.Nf3 e6 3.g3 d5 4.Bg2 c5 5.0-0 Be7 6.b3 0-0 7.e3 Nc6 8.d4 cxd4 9.exd4 b5 10.Re1 Bb7 11.c3 b4 12.c4 dxc4 13.bxc4 Na5 14.c5 Bd5 15.Nbd2 Nc6 16.Bb2 a5 17.a3 Qc7 18.axb4 axb4 19.Bf1 Rxa1 20.Qxa1 Qb7 21.Qb1 Rb8 22.Bc4 Qd7 23.Qd3 Ra8 24.Qe2 h6 25.Ne5 Qb7 26.Nxf7 Bxc4 27.Qxc4 Kxf7
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k -0,35 1.Na3 e5 2.e3 d5 3.d4 Nd7 4.Nb1 c6 5.c4 Ngf6 6.cxd5 Nxd5 7.Ne2 exd4 8.Nxd4 N7f6 9.Be2 Bd6 10.Nc3 0-0 11.Nxd5 Nxd5 12.0-0 Bc7 13.Qc2 Qd6 14.g3 Bh3 15.Rd1 Bb6 16.e4 Nf6 17.Bf4 Qe7 18.Bf3 Rad8 19.Nf5 Qe6 20.Ne3 Bg4 21.Nxg4 Nxg4 22.Rf1 h6 23.Qb3 Qxb3 24.axb3 Nf6 25.Be5 Rd3 26.Kg2 Re8 27.Bxf6 gxf6
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k -0,36 1.Nh3 d5 2.d4 Nf6 3.Ng5 c5 4.e3 Nc6 5.Nf3 g6 6.Be2 Bg7 7.0-0 0-0 8.c3 b6 9.b3 Bb7 10.Nbd2 Qd6 11.Qc2 Rac8 12.Ba3 e5 13.dxe5 Nxe5 14.Nxe5 Qxe5 15.Bb2 Rfe8 16.Rfe1 Nd7 17.Rad1 Rcd8 18.h3 a6 19.Nf3 Qe7 20.c4 Bxb2 21.Qxb2 Qf6 22.Qc2 dxc4 23.bxc4 Bc6 24.Rd2 Ne5 25.Nxe5 Qxe5 26.Red1 Rxd2 27.Qxd2
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k -0,41 1.f3 e5 2.Nc3 Nf6 3.d4 exd4 4.Qxd4 Nc6 5.Qf2 d5 6.e4 Bb4 7.Bd2 Bxc3 8.Bxc3 dxe4 9.Qc5 Be6 10.Ne2 Qd5 11.Qxd5 Nxd5 12.Bxg7 Rg8 13.Bh6 0-0-0 14.0-0-0 Ncb4 15.Nc3 Rg6 16.Nxd5 Bxd5 17.Bd2 exf3 18.gxf3 Bxf3 19.Bh3+ Bg4 20.Bxb4 Bxh3 21.Rxd8+ Kxd8 22.Rd1+ Kc8 23.Rd2 Be6 24.b3 b6 25.Bc3 Kb7 26.Be5 Rh6 27.c4 Rh5 28.Bg3 Kc6
50/80 200:44:26 9.890.822.131k 18.586k -0,92 1.g4 d5 2.e3 e5 3.a3 Nc6 4.d3 g6 5.Nd2 Bg7 6.h4 h6 7.b4 d4 8.Ne4 dxe3 9.Bxe3 a5 10.bxa5 Rxa5 11.Bd2 Ra8 12.Bg2 Nge7 13.g5 h5 14.Ne2 0-0 15.Qb1 Nf5 16.N2g3 Nfd4 17.0-0 Bg4 18.f3 Be6 19.Rf2 b6 20.Qb2 Qe7 21.Qc1 Rfd8 22.Be3 Kh8 23.f4 Bg4 24.Nf6 Bxf6 25.Bxd4 Nxd4 26.Bxa8