Tactics trainer: Kindaaa dumb, do you agree?

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Testje

I think the goal of the tactic trainer is not only to improve your attacking play, but also to prevent you from falling to the same tactic. 

browni3141
RoseQueen1985 wrote:
^facepalm. If its between winning a queen and mate in 6,it's obvious the goal is to mate.

 Not really. If the mate is not obvious, and winning the queen is, and winning the queen leads to a definite win, then most GMs would probably choose the queen.

Loomis
RetGuvvie98 wrote:

there are only so many of us, and there are nearly 51,000 tactics available to sample.


Years ago when tactics trainer first debuted and I was active in the moderator group I encouraged producing quality rather than quantity. Well, Here we are.

RetGuvvie98

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Jordan_G

@browni3141 that isn't the point of tactics trainer however. The tactics trainer is trying to help you learn patterns that lead to the best result in any given position regardless of how likely or difficult it is to find the best solution. Mate is greater than winning a queen. It doesn't matter if the outcome of both choices would lead to the same end result as it isn't a chess game, it is a chess puzzle where you must find the best solution for it. This is also why I don't believe there should be "second best" solutions to any of the puzzles, because while chess games are ultimately about the end result, winning, solving puzzles are about finding the absolute best solutions.

easylimbo

its a tactics trainer. it's suppose to help you spot tactics and increase your short term calculation. its one way to study chess. it focuses on tactics. not time... not winning material... purely finding the best move.

Pokervane

I presume you are referring to this message that "disappeared"?

http://www.chess.com/forum/view/community/tactics-trainer---clear-rules

I don't know the answer to your question but I for one would not like to be surrounded by the paranoid.

Justified08

I saw one in TT, there were 2 solutions. I chose one, but it said it was wrong. There used to be a 'report problem' sign, but I couldn't find it. Yell.

 

It was like this:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                                       I did this:

 

 

 

 

 

                                                 WRONG!?

even though I'm 2100 on TT, I still have my complainsSurprised.
iFrancisco
RetGuvvie98 wrote:

tactics moderators are actively removing those tactics  that have multiple mates (we have been removing those since the beginning *), and we are actively removing any we spot that have - for instance - mate in 6  or second choice greater than 3 points for the attacker.

 

there are only so many of us, and there are nearly 51,000 tactics available to sample.

granted, your rating restricts (to some extent) the number of tactics available to you.

     regards,

moderator


Glad to see some of these are being looked into. As one of the higher TT users (2700+), there are a siginificant number of problems at this level which have secondary solutions that are a completely easy win (rook up, as an example) that other solutions aren't worth wasting time over; this is true in OTB games as well.

The OP is so completley correct. Often I spend a significant amount of extra time looking for a slightly better variation (+0.5 better, for example) even though I see one that nets me a rook. At a master level, I couldn't care less if there is a solution that mates in 11 when another solution nets me an easy queen plus an attack (which is a problem I had recently that was considered wrong by the TT).

Bubatz

Hmm, I think in principle it is not too bad to have problems with multiple solutions. This is what is quite normal OTB. "If you see a good move, look for a better one!", Lasker said. So the issue rather seems to be that some of those problems have multiple solutions where the difference in advantage between the best move and the second best is not really very striking - and then those just have to be taken down.  

RetGuvvie98
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JFK-Ramsey
echecs06 wrote:

Well said, Ret! Keep up the good work!


Agreed!

dec_lan
JFK-Ramsey wrote:

I've given up paying attention to my Tactical Trainer rating. I take my time in order to avoid jumping to a move to beat the clock. I found myself carrying over the "quick move" syndrome to my games. Now I give my TT puzzle moves the same discipline I use in a game. I figure that over time, I will still learn the tactical patterns, won't get frustrated with rating loses due to quick moves and will continue to  reinforce my actual game discipline.


I've gone through periods of thinking I'll do it like this too, but with many problems if you finish it even in 50% of the time remaining, you lose points or just get none. And difficulty of the puzzles you see are based on your rating, so if you do this, you'll never really see harder puzzles.

wormtownpaul

When all is said and done, it (and the videos) are still my favorite feature on chess.com.  So I don't know my "tactics rating" because I've turned off the timer.  Who cares?

dec_lan
wormtownpaul wrote:

When all is said and done, it (and the videos) are still my favorite feature on chess.com.  So I don't know my "tactics rating" because I've turned off the timer.  Who cares?


Like I said before, won't that mean you won't see harder problems because your rating won't go up? I don't care about the actual number, I just want problems that match my skill level.

Pokervane
dec_lan wrote:
wormtownpaul wrote:

When all is said and done, it (and the videos) are still my favorite feature on chess.com.  So I don't know my "tactics rating" because I've turned off the timer.  Who cares?


Like I said before, won't that mean you won't see harder problems because your rating won't go up? I don't care about the actual number, I just want problems that match my skill level.


If this is true it should be easy for them to allow a user to specify a preference for a ratings range for untimed/unrated puzzles.  Which would be a good idea in any case.

Pokervane

Doh...I should have checked BEFORE posting.  They DO allow this range setting once you set the preference for untimed.  Problem solved.

Bubatz
mark100net wrote:

Doh...I should have checked BEFORE posting.  They DO allow this range setting once you set the preference for untimed.  Problem solved.


They do? If I reach a plateau where I don't get any more interesting puzzles, I will switch to untimed then.

Musikamole
JFK-Ramsey wrote:

I've given up paying attention to my Tactical Trainer rating. I take my time in order to avoid jumping to a move to beat the clock. I found myself carrying over the "quick move" syndrome to my games. Now I give my TT puzzle moves the same discipline I use in a game. I figure that over time, I will still learn the tactical patterns, won't get frustrated with rating loses due to quick moves and will continue to  reinforce my actual game discipline.


Same here. I don't guess, nor do I worry about how much time I take. Even if I take a crazy amount of time on a problem, I still get a score of 20%, which is a small point deduction, and smaller than if I failed.

With this new approach of taking more time per problem, my TT score has gone up, and I believe it is for two reasons: 1. I am more relaxed, 2. the patterns are burning deeper into my brain, since I am staring at the problems that I don't know for a longer period of time.

Taking more time, when needed, is also increasing the percentage of problems in a training session that I am solving in under 5 seconds, scoring 100%. This tells me that I am building pattern recognition, which is the purpose of tactics training, whether from a book or a computer.

Last, to reduce test anxiety, for tactics trainer is a test, I will at times listen to jazz music, my favorite style. Jazz music also improves my performance during Live Chess sessions. Again, I'm more relaxed, and this creative style of music seems to get my chess ideas flowing. Even if it's all just mumbo jumbo, silly psychology, it's working.

RetGuvvie98
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