The "tactics trainer" is demoralizing :(

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funindsun

If I don't understand why my move was wrong, and I have the patient to do so (usually not wink.png I will go to self analysis, play MY wrong move, and see what happen next, usually it's a "OK, now i get it moment"

jmlefebvre

Wow! Lots of amazing and helpful responses.

I've decided to take it less seriously, for one. And two, I have also noticed a change in the way I play real games based on my focus and study with the tactics trainer. I'll re-read this thread and explore the other options you guys have suggested. Thanks again!

sameez1

Why are you worried about some numbers applied to your ability don't skip the ones you get wrong retry until you actually see it,would you really think you were better if those numbers got higher?You know how you are doing before you even click on the answer,don't you.

TC2304

From personal experience, the easiest way to climb up the tactics ladder is to try to answer puzzles quickly. If you get it wrong, then you can view the solution and remember the tactical pattern. You might even get the same puzzle again! (although that seems to happen more at higher ratings where there are less puzzles available). This approach also helps to maximise what you get from your study time - at 800 level I don't believe it is worth spending 10 minutes fully calculating out a tactics. By doing this I have steadily climbed from 1300 (3 years ago) to 2500 (just got it today).

ToddA10

I have had 8 problems today that froze after I got it right. It is the same 2 problems too. Do these puzzles have numbers? I can report them or something.

woton

TT is a training tool that places a premium on pattern recognition.  You recognize the pattern, and from experience know which tactic to use.  It's a useful skill to have when you are short of time (or to conserve time earlier in the game).  If you are consistently taking a long time to analyze the position, your TT rating will be low because you are not learning what the training is meant to teach you. 

I think that the best approach is to use Chess.com to develop pattern recognition skills and other sites  (where the problem aren't timed) to develop analytical skills.  Both skill sets are useful when playing chess.

Piperose

That was instructive, and useful. 

Cherub_Enjel

Lower rated tactics trainer problems (1200-1800) are a lot about pattern recognition, but also finding "common sense" moves that aren't really patterns, but are easy moves.

Then, from 1800-2200, it's a little more calculation involved, less common sense.

Then, from 2200-2500, the problems start to get tricky - you have to now carefully consider your opponent's responses, because there will be some hidden moves in lines that will refute seemingly good moves. Very often.

Then, 2500+ it's just similar, calculation is a bit tougher though, and you get more of those endgame studies which are pretty difficult imo. 

YorikOGwaun

ah yes, thanks for the reminder guys, near forgot to do my tictacs today :)

jmlefebvre

A lot of you mention ratings or difficulty levels of tactical puzzles; how do you even see this? Or should I assume that since I'm at 800 that my puzzles would be 800?

In any case, I'm no longer focusing on the number - but I was only musing that it was demoralizing; not that the site was doing anything wrong or that I didn't deserve the kick in the pants for missing obvious moves lol!

 

Anyone have good suggestions for iOS chess tactics apps? There's a ton; can't really tell what's best. Maybe just burn through them all happy.png

rlian3
jmlefebvre wrote:

A lot of you mention ratings or difficulty levels of tactical puzzles; how do you even see this? Or should I assume that since I'm at 800 that my puzzles would be 800?

In any case, I'm no longer focusing on the number - but I was only musing that it was demoralizing; not that the site was doing anything wrong or that I didn't deserve the kick in the pants for missing obvious moves lol!

 

Anyone have good suggestions for iOS chess tactics apps? There's a ton; can't really tell what's best. Maybe just burn through them all

Your rating determines what range of puzzles you should get, so since you have a tactics rating of about 800, you should get tactics puzzles around that rating. 

If the tactics puzzle stops (there is setting for tactics like "stop after each problem, stop only if wrong" or don't stop") after you attempt it, it will show the puzzle #, puzzle rating, pass % and average time of correct answers. 

Otherwise if you can check the rating of the tactic puzzles you have done by going to:

Profile >> Tactics Rating >> View Stats

Your one would be: https://www.chess.com/stats/tactics/jmlefebvre

and scroll down to the bottom of the page.

 I think based on your progress so far with the chess tactics that it may be better learning the tactical patterns from say a book or maybe online. Since the tactics trainer puts them in unfamiliar situations and randomizes which types of puzzles you get it would be better if you were able to memorize the common patterns it would help improve your tactical ability.

One of the tactics app I like using is the "Chess Tactics Pro" app. It is a free app that has not only 3 puzzle sets of easy, intermediate and hard puzzles, but also has 2 daily puzzles for each of those 3 levels that change every day.

ToddA10

My first problem today froze after I got it right. I give.

ToddA10

Happened twice now. Always freezes after a correct answer.

MickinMD

Here's my record for today - plus my last two yesterday. I began at 1488 and solved 12 out of 15. The first one I missed was on a second move where my move put me 1 minor piece ahead instead of the solutions 2, the second one I missed was on the third move where my solution was a mate-in-4 instead of the correct mate-in-3, and the third one was on the first move, where my zwischenzug was winning, but not as fast as the solution's zwischenzug.

The 12 I solved involved equally or more difficult problems and I got a point for them because, even after finding a winning move, you have to take time to see if there's a better one and you're penalized for it.

On the other hand, earlier yesterday I quickly solved a very simple Q & R mate in one in less time than avg. and got 4 or 5 points for it!

So now I have to solve several more consecutive problems just to get back to the 1490 at which I started today, even though I achieved the best solution in 10 out of 13 and winning positions in the other 3!php4Pykac.jpeg

TC2304
MegasAlexandros86 wrote:
MickinMD wrote:

Here's my record for today - plus my last two yesterday. I began at 1488 and solved 12 out of 15. The first one I missed was on a second move where my move put me 1 minor piece ahead instead of the solutions 2, the second one I missed was on the third move where my solution was a mate-in-4 instead of the correct mate-in-3, and the third one was on the first move, where my zwischenzug was winning, but not as fast as the solution's zwischenzug.

The 12 I solved involved equally or more difficult problems and I got a point for them because, even after finding a winning move, you have to take time to see if there's a better one and you're penalized for it.

On the other hand, earlier yesterday I quickly solved a very simple Q & R mate in one in less time than avg. and got 4 or 5 points for it!

So now I have to solve several more consecutive problems just to get back to the 1490 at which I started today, even though I achieved the best solution in 10 out of 13 and winning positions in the other 3!

 

 

+1 at a 1481 problem ??? At problems < 2000, you should solve them in < 10 seconds !!!!

 

Seriously... a 1481 is NOT a problem, it's a kid's game!!!

Bit rich coming from you, as you were only 1583 rated after 116 tactics (enough to get an accurate rating). Stop trying to show off. 

ManhattanJack
MickinMD wrote:

Here's my record for today - plus my last two yesterday. I began at 1488 and solved 12 out of 15. The first one I missed was on a second move where my move put me 1 minor piece ahead instead of the solutions 2, the second one I missed was on the third move where my solution was a mate-in-4 instead of the correct mate-in-3, and the third one was on the first move, where my zwischenzug was winning, but not as fast as the solution's zwischenzug.

The 12 I solved involved equally or more difficult problems and I got a point for them because, even after finding a winning move, you have to take time to see if there's a better one and you're penalized for it.

On the other hand, earlier yesterday I quickly solved a very simple Q & R mate in one in less time than avg. and got 4 or 5 points for it!

So now I have to solve several more consecutive problems just to get back to the 1490 at which I started today, even though I achieved the best solution in 10 out of 13 and winning positions in the other 3!

 

This tends to be my problem as well.  I simply can't seem to find (from the TT's scoring perspective) the proper balance between making the move I've found which puts me in an ultimately winning position or up material and "wasting" time looking for a better move.

 

Particularly maddening are the times when I find a guaranteed checkmate, but it's not the "fastest" mate, and so there go 10 points down the tube...

 

One other common thing I see are situations where you can be "tricked" into merely earning material such as a Queen and a Rook instead of, say, getting a mate-in-3.  Obviously, Mate-in-3 is better.  And yes, there's the chess adage:  "When you see a good move, look for a better one".  But if I see a way to pick up a ton of material in Blitz, I'm usually going to be abandoning my attempts to find a better move.  You have to pick and choose where to invest your analysis in Blitz.

 

A better adage for Blitz might be, "When you see a good move, spend an amount of time looking for a better one in inverse proportion to how good the move is".  Doesn't really roll off the tongue, though.

 

It would be really nice if, at a minimum, all forced Mates were considered equally good.  I'm guessing that's somewhat beyond the scope of the system though?  I assume tactics cannot be set up with more than one correct move?

 

ToddA10
TC2304 wrote:
MegasAlexandros86 wrote:
MickinMD wrote:

Here's my record for today - plus my last two yesterday. I began at 1488 and solved 12 out of 15. The first one I missed was on a second move where my move put me 1 minor piece ahead instead of the solutions 2, the second one I missed was on the third move where my solution was a mate-in-4 instead of the correct mate-in-3, and the third one was on the first move, where my zwischenzug was winning, but not as fast as the solution's zwischenzug.

The 12 I solved involved equally or more difficult problems and I got a point for them because, even after finding a winning move, you have to take time to see if there's a better one and you're penalized for it.

On the other hand, earlier yesterday I quickly solved a very simple Q & R mate in one in less time than avg. and got 4 or 5 points for it!

So now I have to solve several more consecutive problems just to get back to the 1490 at which I started today, even though I achieved the best solution in 10 out of 13 and winning positions in the other 3!

 

 

+1 at a 1481 problem ??? At problems < 2000, you should solve them in < 10 seconds !!!!

 

Seriously... a 1481 is NOT a problem, it's a kid's game!!!

Bit rich coming from you, as you were only 1583 rated after 116 tactics (enough to get an accurate rating). Stop trying to show off. 

A bit smug coming from him. I do wonder what 1480 problems would look like to me these days.

Cdr_Bond

I found the culprit is the android app itself.  I was playing tactics on my iphone and my score went up as high as 1500, but when I switched over to an android phone, I noticed I get a lot of +1 points only and when I made a mistake, the penalties were double digits.  My score when all the way down to almost 1000.   Also the android phone version is not very responsive.  After you make a move, the opponent(computer) would wait 1 second and make its move.  Whereas on the iphone version, the opponent would make a move immediately right after your move.  The 3rd thing I notice is that on the Android phone, it does not tell you whether you're playing white or black.  You have to pay attention which piece moved first, black or white, so that you know you're playing the opposite color.  So I must say the Android app is much inferior than the iphone version.  Hopefully some one can fix these problems.

Martin_Stahl
Cdr_Bond wrote:

... Also the android phone version is not very responsive.  After you make a move, the opponent(computer) would wait 1 second and make its move.  Whereas on the iphone version, the opponent would make a move immediately right after your move.  The 3rd thing I notice is that on the Android phone, it does not tell you whether you're playing white or black.  You have to pay attention which piece moved first, black or white, so that you know you're playing the opposite color.  So I must say the Android app is much inferior than the iphone version.  Hopefully some one can fix these problems.

 

I use the Android app and other than occasionally dropping the connection and going offline, things work smoothly and it is very obvious what color you are on a tactic.

Cdr_Bond
Martin_Stahl wrote:
Cdr_Bond wrote:

... Also the android phone version is not very responsive.  After you make a move, the opponent(computer) would wait 1 second and make its move.  Whereas on the iphone version, the opponent would make a move immediately right after your move.  The 3rd thing I notice is that on the Android phone, it does not tell you whether you're playing white or black.  You have to pay attention which piece moved first, black or white, so that you know you're playing the opposite color.  So I must say the Android app is much inferior than the iphone version.  Hopefully some one can fix these problems.

 

I use the Android app and other than occasionally dropping the connection and going offline, things work smoothly and it is very obvious what color you are on a tactic.

You don't know what "smooth" is until you try out the iPhone version of the chess app.