why wouldn't an amatuer add punctuation marks, if not to help express their train of thought, and get help to improve, or gain understanding to play a game they find enjoyable.
Worst first move for white?
Sort:
pavanmss wrote:
Thank you so much for that link. Good games from a very daring player. I wouldn't dare do some of those early king moves, but he obviously knows the system better than me.
Go ahead and vote 1. f3 as the worst. It may be the least productive move, and therefore the worst, but to classify it all by itself is not healthy for chess. I had a friend one time tell me never to play f3, although I began to find it in many of the Sicilians, KID, Caro-Kann, etc. It is the follow-up that matters. What if a Dutch player wants a Dutch when he is playing White? 1. f3 may help get the tempo adjustment he likes. Call it stupid (which I am sure some will), but there are other openings where these types of moves are applied. One example is the Sveshnikov. Black plays ...e6, then on the next move plays ...e5.
According to the way you view chess, 1. f3 = worst move. I think 1. a4 is far worse, as it threatens the queenside, which normally Black isn't thinking of going to at the beginning of the game. Nothing is developed at all, and White has not thought of his kingside at all, nor has he thought of the center. After 1. f3, White is beginning to control a piece of the center, and has the added possibility of entering into gambit lines sacking the e- and f-pawns.
this is why I like playing black :)
To ask a question about chess moves based on one move makes no sense, IMO. Does 1. f3 go against many classical themes? Certainly! And to judge it in those regards, then fine, it would be "worse" than 1. a4, for instance. But I think it would be better to show some follow-ups to this kid, rather than say, "Stay away from 1. f3". There are many main-lines that are advocated every day that I don't touch anymore - why? Hard to handle. Many of the Sicilian lines, for instance - the recommended lines! Recommended because the brilliant minds of the day know how to use them properly. I play lesser known lines and get better chances from them, because I play someone who has less theory. 1. f3 - the theory is definitely not much :-) but on principle, as stated before, White can soon prepare e3 and then play f4. Another opening is to play into 2. b3 and 3 Bb2 - there is much more to consider than just saying, "1. f3 is bad". I agree it goes against mainstream openings, but I think, for good reason, that 1. a4 is worse.
rdecredico wrote:
Conquistador wrote:
RealityMate wrote:
1. g4? is a strong candidate... I don't care what people say to support the "Grob" attack, it's trash. As long as black just plays solid and doesn't blunder/get greedy, white is far worse and has no play whatsoever for his bad position.
No way man! I am steadfast in my support of the Grob! I may not be able to say the same about the Borg, but I still play it in correspondance and win.
You must be playing some real boobs. It almost loses by force.
http://www.chess.com/echess/game.html?id=40134469
I played Warrier (1966) in correspondance 3 days per move as white and won.
rdecredico wrote:
RealityMate wrote:
The thing about the Grob is that the only reason people do well with it is due to greed from black. If black avoids the Bxg4? lines then he is absolutely far better.. White has to play h3 and then he's wasted two moves fruitlessly and has badly placed pawns, while black has ignored white's opening and built a solid and strong system with something like pawns on c6 d5 and e5, bishops on e6 and e7, etc. Basically, if black doesn't grab before thinking and if black doesn't play dxc4? after white plays c4 then black is far better. It's sort of a "gotcha" opening like the Blackburne gambit; white doesn't think what would happen if black just ignored his anti-positional and crippling moves instead of making a grave mistake.
Actualy, one can directly refute the Grob with Bxg4, too.
1. g4 d5 2. Bg2 Bxg4 3. c4 dxc4! 4. Bxb7 Nd7 5. Bxa8 Qxa8 and now 6.f3 is mandatory and Black is already better and will have all the fun beating up on the white squares.
The exchange sacrifice for Black is very powerful and the real kicker is that White thinks she has pulled off the main trick in this opening.
***************************
Back to the OP. f3 is clearly the weakest opening move.
No Bxg4? is just fine for white.
Here is my theory for the 1.g4 d5 2.Bg2 Bxg4 variation of the Grob Opening. This was a combination of southpawsam's and my theory.
1.g4 d5 2.Bg2 Bxg4 If 2...c6, refer to "Grob 1...e5/1...d5 Lines" 3.c4!! This move is great because it puts question to the d-pawn, which is pinned because of the weak b7. Black has many ways to counter, but not all of them work. 3...c6 [3...dxc4?! This is an interesting try for Black. He puts White on the defense but sacrifices material. 4.Bxb7 Nd7 5.Bxa8 Qxa8 6.f3 White has an extra pawn and the better pawn structure. He also has an open c-file that will put alot of pressure on Black's weak pawns. But Black has an annoying pin on the f3 pawn and also has the initiative. So if White can just neutralize Black's threats, he will have the better game. 6...e5 7.Nc3 Be7 8.d3 cxd3 9.Qxd3 And White is better. He will play e4, and will have an advantage. NOTE: If Black plays Bh4+, White replies with Kf1 and will eventually move the king to g2, with advantage.; 3...d4?! This is also like the move above, although a bit worse because Black doesn't take the extra pawn. 4.Bxb7 Nd7 5.Bxa8 Qxa8 6.f3 e5 7.d3 Be7 8.h4 Ngf6 9.Nh3 And White plans to play Nf2 next turn with advantage.; 3...e6 4.Qb3 Nf6 a) 4...dxc4?? 5.Qxb7 Nd7 6.Qxa8+-; b) 4...c6 5.Qxb7 Nd7 6.d4 Rb8 (6...Ne7 7.Nd2+/=; 6...Ngf6 7.Nc3+/=; 6...Bd6 7.Qxc6+/=) 7.Qxa7 Qc8 8.Bf4 Ra8 9.Qc7 Qxc7 10.Bxc7+/=; c) 4...Qc8 5.cxd5 c6 (5...exd5 6.Bxd5+-) 6.dxe6 If fxe6, White has the advantage due to his superior pawn structure. 6...Bxe6 7.Bh3!! Bxh3 (7...Bxb3?! Is very bad because of... 8.Bxc8 And Black has lost material and the initiative. 8...Bd5 9.Bxb7 Bxh1 10.Bxa8 Bd6 11.h3 Nf6 12.d4 Nbd7 13.Bb7 And the bishop will escape to d1 via a6.; 7...f5 8.Qe3 And White has a lot more comfortable of a game, as Black has ruined his pawn structure and evicted the knight of c6.) 8.Nxh3~~ Although White is doing very well. If... 8...Qxh3 then... 9.Qxb7!! seals the deal for Black.; 5.Qxb7 Nbd7 6.cxd5 exd5 (6...Rb8 7.Qxa7 exd5 8.Qe3+ Qe7 (8...Be7 9.Nc3+/=) 9.Qxe7+ Bxe7 10.d4+/=) 7.Qc6 Rb8 8.Nc3~~; 3...Nf6 4.Qb3 Bc8!! (4...c6 5.Qxb7 Nbd7 6.d4 e6 7.h3 Bf5 8.Nc3 Qc8 9.Qxc8+ Rxc8 10.cxd5 cxd5 11.f3~~; 4...e6 5.cxd5 exd5 6.Qxb7 Nbd7 7.Qc6 Rb8 8.Nc3 Rb6 9.Qa4 c6~~) 5.cxd5 And although Black is o.k., he has traded a center pawn for a g-pawn, so White is better.; 3...Be6 4.Qb3 Bc8 5.cxd5 And White has traded a g-pawn for a d-pawn, and stands better.; 3...e5 4.cxd5 White's center pawns and Black's weak b7 square give an advantage to White.] 4.Qb3 Qb6!! This move stops any plans White has against b7, but White has the brilliant... [4...Qc7 5.cxd5 cxd5?? a) 5...e6 6.dxc6 Nxc6 7.Nc3 Nf6 (7...Bd6?? 8.Nb5!!) 8.h3 Bf5 9.Nf3 e5 10.d3 And White has sound development. The better player will win this game.; b) 5...Nf6 6.Nc3 e6 (6...e5 7.h3 Bd7 8.d3 cxd5 9.Nxd5 Nxd5 10.Bxd5 Bc6 11.Bd2 Bxd5 12.Qxd5 And White is okay.) 7.h3 Bf5 8.e4 Bg6 9.dxe6 fxe6 10.Qxe6+ And White is by far better.; 6.Nc3 Nf6 (6...Nc6 7.Nxd5+/=; 6...e6?? 7.Qa4+!! And White wins the lonely bishop.) 7.Nxd5 Nxd5 8.Bxd5 And yet again, Black has too many threats to handle.; 4...Qc8 5.cxd5 e6 (5...cxd5 6.Nc3 Nf6 (6...e6 7.Qa4+) ) 6.dxe6 Bxe6 7.Bh3 This transposes to other lines.; 4...Qd7 5.cxd5 cxd5?? A HUGE error that costs Black. The alternatives are better. a) 5...e5 6.Nf3 Bd6 (6...f6 7.Nc3 Ne7 8.h3 Bh5 (8...Bxf3 9.Bxf3 cxd5 10.Nxd5+/=) 9.d4 Bxf3 10.Bxf3 exd4 11.dxc6 Nbxc6 12.Ne4 Ng6 13.Bd2 White has good open c and g-files) 7.Nc3 Nf6 8.Ng5 h6 (8...0-0 9.Nge4+/=) 9.Nge4+/=; b) 5...e6 6.f3 Bf5 (6...Bh5 7.dxe6 fxe6 8.Nh3+/=) 7.e4 Bg6 8.dxe6 fxe6+/= And White is in very good shape.; c) 5...Nf6 6.Nc3 Nxd5 7.Nxd5 Be6 (7...cxd5 8.Bxd5+/-) 8.e4 cxd5 9.exd5 Bf5 10.d4 g6 (10...a5 11.Nf3 a4 12.Qc4 Qd6 13.Ne5 Nd7 14.Bf4+/=) 11.Nf3 Bg7 12.Ne5+/-; 6.Bxd5+/- Now Black cannot defend both b7 and f7, and White will soon lead in material.] 5.Qxb6!! This is a never before seen move that puts a hold on Black's Qb6 idea. We immediately weaken Black's position, which can really hurt him in the endgame. 5...axb6 6.cxd5 cxd5 [6...Nf6 7.Nc3 e6 (7...cxd5 8.Nxd5 Nxd5 9.Bxd5 Nc6 10.a3+/=) 8.h3 Bf5 9.e4 Bg6 10.dxe6 fxe6 11.d4+/= And White is better.] 7.Bxd5 Nc6 8.d3 e6 [8...e5 9.h3 Bd7 10.Nf3 Nf6 11.Bb3 And White is doing fine.; 8...Nf6 9.Nc3 e6 (9...Nxd5 10.Nxd5 Rd8 11.Nxb6 e5~~) 10.Bc4 Bc5=] 9.Bb3 Nd4 [9...Nb4 10.Nc3 Nf6 11.h3 Bh5 12.Bg5 Be7 13.a3 Nc6+/=] 10.Bd1 Nf6 11.Nc3 Bb4 12.Bd2~~ *
tino1611 wrote:
You may laugh, but someone actually did this against me once although it went like this to be exact:
It may be.
I vote for 1. d4!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
1.b3
The Grob, or the St. George. Don't tell Michael Baseman that I said that.
i think the worst first move would be to resign. because you resigned before you made any moves.
the worst thing you can do is give up with out trying. one time i played a game and my opponent had a q and K and I only had a king. but i did not resign. my opponent ended up stalemating me.
His King was on d3. His Queen was on c3 and my king was on d1.
it was a stalemate and i got a draw.
it was because i didn't give up. nothing is easy in anything you do
there is so much competition and everyone wants to win or get their share of the pie.
there are times when the pie is fixed in size. ideally you should aim to make the pie bigger so that everyone is happy because their piece of the pie is larger.
but unfortunately in chess the size of the pie is fixed because it always starts with 34 pieces.
so you have to do your best to win or draw the game
Let me present: THE DERP OPENING!
Losing the exchange by moving the rook to a3/h3 isn't terribly uncommon among beginners. But the rest of the opening though...
1. a4 isn't terrible, all it does is switch the colours of the players. 1. h4 is weaker, as more people castle kingside. 1.f3, 1. a3, 1. h3, 1. Na3 and 1. Nh3 are worse than 1. a4
crohns
Im not laughing..