Shortest-proof-game challenge

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Avatar of n9531l1
Leither123 wrote:

This forum has been oddly silent for the past two days. Here's a fun little position I made; can you beat my solution? (#5889)

Does my solution at least tie with yours?

Avatar of Leither123
n9531l1 wrote:

Does my solution at least tie with yours?

It is actually the exact same as my solution. I was hoping to create a unique solution, but I'm not sure if there are any duals. Did you find any other 10 move solutions or perhaps a way to reacher the position in a shorter amount of moves?

Avatar of BishopTakesH7
Leither123 wrote:

Did you find any other 10 move solutions or perhaps a way to reach the position in a shorter amount of moves?

Jacobi found exactly two solutions, here's the other one:

Avatar of Leither123

Interesting, it appears both solutions have a unique sequence!

Avatar of Leither123

This position has four solutions of the same length that each have a unique sequence of moves (I hope). Is it possible to make a position with more?

Avatar of n9531l1
Leither123 wrote:

This position has four solutions of the same length that each have a unique sequence of moves (I hope). Is it possible to make a position with more?

Any particular solution has a unique sequence of moves, or it wouldn't be that solution. And there are many positions with more than four proof games of a given length.

Avatar of Leither123
n9531l1 wrote:

Any particular solution has a unique sequence of moves, or it wouldn't be that solution. And there are many positions with more than four proof games of a given length.

I see what you mean. When I said unique sequence, I was intending it to mean "unique order". In other words, if a position is reached using a certain combination of moves, there is only one way for that particular combination to be played in order to reach the position in the shortest amount of moves.

Avatar of n9531l1

I'm still not sure what you mean. What is a "certain combination of moves"? Any two consecutive moves by the same side would be a combination of moves.

I can only find two 9.5 move shortest proof games for #5895. Are you claiming there are four?

Avatar of Ilampozhil25

i think that if e4 xx Nf3 is in a solution for white to reach the position, then Nf3 xx e4 absolutely can not be

ie all the solutions have a different set of moves (piece moved, starting spot, ending spot, any capture, any promotion) but no permutations

Avatar of n9531l1

For the ending position of the game posted above (#5899), can you find the twelve solutions of "Proof Game in exactly 3.0"?

Avatar of tygxc

@5900

4 ways to lose a move for black: ...Qe7, ...Qf6, ...Qg5, ...e6
3 ways to lose a move for white: f3, g3, g4; g3, f3, g4; g3, g4, f3
4 * 3 = 12

Avatar of Leither123
n9531l1 wrote:

I'm still not sure what you mean. What is a "certain combination of moves"? Any two consecutive moves by the same side would be a combination of moves.

I can only find two 9.5 move shortest proof games for #5895. Are you claiming there are four?

9.5 is the shortest proof game, and technically speaking there are four different methods to get the position in 9.5 moves (they are basically the same).

The definition of words can be confusing! I remember there being an argument about the meaning of "deliver" in a recent forum. By "combination of moves", I meant the collection of moves used to reach the target position, where order isn't considered. I think it's best to give an example of what I meant:

In hindsight, I realize that it is remarkably easy to create positions of this nature, and that I sound very stupid.

Avatar of Leither123

What I tried to do with #5895 was to create a position where all shortest solutions had a unique order for the specific collection of moves of that solution.

Avatar of n9531l1
Leither123 wrote:

What I tried to do with #5895 was to create a position where all shortest solutions had a unique order for the specific collection of moves of that solution.

And you said you had done that for four such shortest solutions. I'm having trouble believing that. Could you post a game showing the four solutions?

Avatar of Leither123
n9531l1 wrote:

Could you post a game showing the four solutions?

They're almost exactly the same, but technically they each have a different collection of moves. These should be the only four solutions, and the collection of moves for each solution must be played in their specific orders.

Avatar of n9531l1
Leither123 wrote:
n9531l1 wrote:

Could you post a game showing the four solutions?

They're almost exactly the same, but technically they each have a different collection of moves. These should be the only four solutions, and the collection of moves for each solution must be played in their specific orders.

 

Thank you. That's a very impressive accomplishment.

Avatar of BishopTakesH7

Find a game that can end with forced mate in 1, 2, or 3. Move count ends at the position before mate.

Avatar of Leither123
BishopTakesH7 wrote:

Find a game that can end with forced mate in 1, 2, or 3. Move count ends at the position before mate.

Solution in four moves. Did I interpret your challenge correctly?

Avatar of BishopTakesH7
Leither123 wrote:
BishopTakesH7 wrote:

Find a game that can end with forced mate in 1, 2, or 3. Move count ends at the position before mate.

Solution in four moves. Did I interpret your challenge correctly?

Yes. EvinSung's three unique solutions are also nice.

Avatar of Leither123
BishopTakesH7 wrote:

Yes. EvinSung's three unique solutions are also nice.

Upon return, I find that the game has disappeared. It seems I will be unable to witness the three unique solutions.