Can we have game analysis back?

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Martin_Stahl

The feature has been in works for a while and has been tested in beta. It includes updates to the move classifications and accuracy algorithms, in addition to the the new move explanations. I've been using it for a while and don't think it's drastically different, other than the best move line not being automatically shown for non-diamond.

 

The site is actively working on fixing/modifying things based on feedback.  Whether or not that will satisfy the members upset over changes remains to be seen.

nTzT

I agree that the changes were annoying but I think people are acting too drastically. Give it some time, they have shown that they care and will be changing things according to the feedback provided.

Change can be annoying but it really can be a good thing. I prefer them trying to innovate than do nothing. 

Mariba66
Martin_Stahl skrev:

The feature has been in works for a while and has been tested in beta. It includes updates to the move classifications and accuracy algorithms, in addition to the the new move explanations. I've been using it for a while and don't think it's drastically different, other than the best move line not being automatically shown for non-diamond.

 

The site is actively working on fixing/modifying things based on feedback.  Whether or not that will satisfy the members upset over changes remains to be seen.

The best move-line for other than diamond users, like platinum, was one of the most important things with the analyse-section.
So the changes have been available in Beta, and they didn’t use this time to fix the problems they’ve created? Noone reported on bad functionality for touch screen-users? 
I myself, have complained about the worsened interface for touch-screen users and Ipad-users in particular since the last changes, but that obviously didn’t count as important enough, for nothing has been done with it. And now they have created new problems and childish layout, with no regards to what we are saying about it. 
I am not impressed. 
And that you keep saying that we just need to get used to it, doesn’t help, actually, because we started the payed membership with the old functions intact. 
Then I had

1 a board that filled the space available on the screen

2 Buttons inside the screen frame

3 move sound on every move

4 Best move lines on Analyse and a graphic rendering of the game on the same place as the analyse

5 Last or next move buttons instead of just |< <> >| cramped together, so far too easy to mis by touching

6 …

Martin_Stahl

I never said you just have to get used to it. I've said you can't go back, that the site is actively listening to feedback and working on updates/changes based on that feedback, and I've said that it's possible that some members that don't like the changes may not like any of the updates either.

 

The Show Line for diamond only feature didn't get released until late in the beta. I know that's something that I had made an assumption on that only hid the new move explanations, and didn't realize the actual line and eval was shown in Game Report when doing retries or clicking best. As soon as I realized that, I made sure to provide feedback about it, how it had changed from the Game Report, and likely what drove a lot of the negative feedback (though not all).

 

Regarding touch screen issues, I don't recall seeing anything major in those regards. I use a phone and mobile browser, and for the screen size, things seem to work as I would expect them to.

Mariba66

Thank you for the response, Martin_Stahl!
However I have reported several times on the board size, that is too small on my Ipad. I can zoom it up, but then all the buttons to touch get out of the screen, so you have to scroll or zoom back out again. This happens to Live Chess, Play Chess, all the types of puzzles and the lessons, so everywhere.
This occured during the last time they made major changes. Before that, the board filled its designated space to the left on the screen, and that was perfect.

And then the sizes of the buttons to move back and forward one move at a time: Please look at my photos I posted further up. Now the «buttons» are only symbols: |<<> >| Too close together to touch. My page is in Norwegian, but the buttons, size of the boards should clearly show. 

 

ch23233

I absolutely hate the new game review. The game report feature from before was great and really sold the deal for me between chess.com and lichess. At this point I am starting to consider switching sides. 

 

I think chess.com could keep the game review but also give us back game report. That would be great

nTzT
ch23233 wrote:

I absolutely hate the new game review. The game report feature from before was great and really sold the deal for me between chess.com and lichess. At this point I am starting to consider switching sides. 

 

I think chess.com could keep the game review but also give us back game report. That would be great

They aren't going back, having both would be redundant. They will adjust the current one according to feedback, hopefully then it's less frustrating to use.

Martin_Stahl

@Mariba66, I don't have access to an iPad or recent tablet for good testing, but that board location/sizing, especially if you're seeing it everywhere, isn't really an issue with the Game Review, but with the overall board code. If it used to be fine, I don't know if what your seeing is something device specific or specifically due to code changes.

 

Regarding the move buttons, what is on the Analysis tab does work better on my mobile, since it is bigger and will float below the board while scrolling. I can see why it isn't the same under Review, since the Analysis version takes up more space (larger buttons and two rows of options). In the Review tab, I believe the intent is to maximize the area for the review content.

thegrey2

I used to really enjoy analysing games with the previous review but now it's an absolute chore. They really need to have an opt-out for people to go back to the old system. 

I agree the constant plugging of Diamond memberships is quite distasteful. I already pay every month, I should be able to use the site without getting nagged about paying more money every time I want to review a game. 

Also, the process is now a lot slower and more cumbersome. All the unnecessary text plugs up my screen and I have to manually scroll down to get the basic review. Before you just clicked the arrow key and it showed you the information without having to scroll and scroll every time it highlights a move. 

Show line also slows things down. Having to click every time you want to see the line rather than just having it there in front of you like before is a big downgrade. I'm here for a good time not a long time. (Using on desktop BTW).

Mariba66
Martin_Stahl skrev:

@Mariba66, I don't have access to an iPad or recent tablet for good testing, but that board location/sizing, especially if you're seeing it everywhere, isn't really an issue with the Game Review, but with the overall board code. If it used to be fine, I don't know if what your seeing is something device specific or specifically due to code changes.

 

Regarding the move buttons, what is on the Analysis tab does work better on my mobile, since it is bigger and will float below the board while scrolling. I can see why it isn't the same under Review, since the Analysis version takes up more space (larger buttons and two rows of options). In the Review tab, I believe the intent is to maximize the area for the review content.

First part yes, but this comes on top of that, as changes that weren’t here when I signed up for a year. And tech should have the different types of devices available, to make sure they don’t exclude devices that used to work fine! 
Second part: Chess.com would have had better space, if they just used it better, and stopped rebuild everything and make it so much more cumbersome. 
If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it! 

thegrey2
Mariba66 wrote:

If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it! 

Very true. The old game analysis system was actually an excellent selling point for chess com. It drew me to become a paying member. They didn't realize what they had with it. If you're going to change a core feature that already works well, there has to be a very compelling reason, not just "we want a way to plug Diamond memberships to users after every game."

Phat-Chance

why should we pay 50 dollars more for something we already subscribed for??  Chess.com needs to pay us back or change it back..  

nTzT
thegrey2 wrote:
Mariba66 wrote:

If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it! 

Very true. The old game analysis system was actually an excellent selling point for chess com. It drew me to become a paying member. They didn't realize what they had with it. If you're going to change a core feature that already works well, there has to be a very compelling reason, not just "we want a way to plug Diamond memberships to users after every game."

I somewhat agree. The analysis and lessons drew me to become a playing member as well, I still think it's totally worth it and extremely good, but had this version been around when I initially joined I probably would not have subscribed. But I have faith in them, they care and I'll just use the analysis tab for now.

SeeSusi
Phat-Chance wrote:

why should we pay 50 dollars more for something we already subscribed for??  Chess.com needs to pay us back or change it back..  

I cancelled, and I strongly encourage you to do the same because your wallet is the only thing they will listen to.  You have to go to link below, and jump through a few hoops by giving them your e-mail and name as you provided when signing up.  I submitted the request about 24 hours ago and my account is no longer gold.  I did ask for a pro-rated refund (year membership) because they chose to no longer provide the service that I paid for, so it was their breach of contract. I haven't checked if I got that however, assuming I did though.

Sad thing is, now as a non-premium member it shows me the old report that I wanted back?! Navigation keys work, quick review of key moments, no inane coach AI, and just annoying ads to view. Dunno however if it will give one if i play a new game though, probably not. 

So incredibly disappointed in chess.com right now.  I have/had two paying accounts.  The other was a paying membership since April 2012.  Both are cancelled. I don't want to, but they clearly have drawn a line in the sand.  Feel like I'm going through a break-up.    

 

https://support.chess.com/article/346-contact-us

 

Martin_Stahl
SeeSusi wrote:

....

Sad thing is, now as a non-premium member it shows me the old report that I wanted back?! Navigation keys work, quick review of key moments, no inane coach AI, and just annoying ads to view. Dunno however if it will give one if i play a new game though, probably not. 

So incredibly disappointed in chess.com right now.  I have/had two paying accounts.  The other was a paying membership since April 2012.  Both are cancelled. I don't want to, but they clearly have drawn a line in the sand.  Feel like I'm going through a break-up.    

 

 

That will be changing soon. Basic members will get the same Game Review but they were making so decisions and coding for that still last I knew. It may not happen until the rest of the other new updates based on feedback make it through.

 

Not sure how you see they have drawn a line in the sand; they are actively soliciting feedback and responding to it. They have said that most of the feedback received they have agreed with and are making changes. It may take a little time to fully make the changes, test, and release, but it will happen. I think some may have already made it in based on some screenshots I've recently seen, but I'm not certain.

SeeSusi
Martin_Stahl wrote:

 

Not sure how you see they have drawn a line in the sand; they are actively soliciting feedback and responding to it. They have said that most of the feedback received they have agreed with and are making changes. It may take a little time to fully make the changes, test, and release, but it will happen. I think some may have already made it in based on some screenshots I've recently seen, but I'm not certain.

 

Because they are keeping the changes rather than doing the sensible thing of rolling back and putting it back into beta.    There is functionality that is missing, or rearranged to make it more difficult to use, and just outright bugs.  This was not ready for prime time.  

And quite honestly, that I have to explain this to you as a customer makes me very disappointed in your customer service.  I've been following your responses this past week and it's nothing but apologetics in favor of chess.com  Do something useful and be an advocate for the consumer.   At the very least let the users decide. 

Seems like more people dislike this than like it right now. 

https://old.reddit.com/r/chess/comments/qiggm4/chesscom_releases_new_game_review_feature/?sort=top

 

Martin_Stahl

I'm a moderator and not a staff member. I'm primarily answering posts as member, passing along information that I'm aware of, and reporting issues to staff when I see and verify them. I'm not part of the customer service/support group.

 

Regarding rolling back, that was done a couple of times during the beta and it caused some very weird disconnects when a game was analyzed under Review were revisited under report. I can see that reverting was not an ideal situation either.

 

Not sure how you can say the the majority dislike it based on a few hundred posts among millions of members, and though I don't know how many premium members there are, there have been a lot of posts in topics here that players like the new Review as well.

 

Things will change. Whether any particular member feels that is a sufficient fix or not is something that is a different story.

Boogalicious

Yeah the new game review is seriously bad. The last implementation was much better

nTzT
Martin_Stahl wrote:

Not sure how you can say the the majority dislike it based on a few hundred posts among millions of members, and though I don't know how many premium members there are, there have been a lot of posts in topics here that players like the new Review as well.

This doesn't make sense to say in my opinion. Most of the people I know don't like this change and you can't expect millions of people to all come comment on it. I am sure there are people that like it, but I think the majority don't and even if that wasn't the case people still paid for the previous iteration that was much less of a hassle to use.

Of course I have faith in them listening to the feedback and changing the Game Review accordingly so it should all be fine.

DeconanLeBarbaresque

 "you can't expect millions of people to all come comment on it"

Ok, I was only reading the (bad) reviews, but it seems it's actually necessary to post to be heard.

I understand the motivation behind the new system, the site has to be more "appealing", "modern", "AI-like"... Well, it's a chess site, not Facebook... 

The new system is slower, impractical and counter-intuitive.


Chess.com should have an option to opt-in/out of this new interface.
Then they can make some objective stats and see for themselves who really like the new stuff or not.