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I agree that the 1. Nf3 - f5 does not lead to a forced loss. However the resulting positions are unpleasant for black and he has to be very careful
White has a much better game after 1.Nf3 f5. Most of the tactics will favor him while black must play accurately to survive. The problem black faces is that just about every development plan he could adopt which is adequate against d3-e4 fails when white just plays d4.
White gets something to play against, black must play accuratly and fight to survive. It's about as much as you could ask for from an opening.
Probably at GM level you are right... but I do fine with it at my level so I don't see any real need to change it. After all, I somehow doubt it's the only thing preventing me from becoming a GM
Yeah, and honestly I've figured by all the shocked 'what do I do now' looks I get from my opponents after 1.Nf3 f5 2.d3 it's not common at all at club level.
i like to use the staton gambit because there is an interesting trap in it
Playing for traps is only a smart idea when if not falling for it by your opponent does not give allow black free play If he plays 4. ...c6 instead of the silly move 4. .. d5 the game should be about equal.
Not a great result for white equality after 4 moves.
I recommend 2.Nc3. Then you can put your Bishop on g5, and point all your pieces at black's kingside. If you're really feeling mighty, you can even castle queenside and just ram the -h and -g pawns into his castled king. I've had very good results with this.
lol of course c6 is mainline but capablanca played this so you can't say its bad
depends on move order.1.d4 f5 2.Bg5!!! is great.But people may enter through an e6 move order.
@jempty: e6 looks weak to me. White wont ofcourse play e4 but c4 transforming into a rather favorable variation of the english as black will be forced to play e6-e5 later on.
Nc6 looks like a good try indeed. Perhaps also than c4 transforming to the f5/e5 english that is known to favor white lightly but is certainly playable
The Dutch often leads to a messy game where tactics triumph.
It isn't easy to find a quiet position with small but peristent advantage for White - which is what a lot of c4 or d4 players are looking for of course.
That said there are a lot of choices for white before Black even gets to pick his favorite version - at least if he plays 1..f5 - the anti-Dutch systems include 2. g4, 2. e4 and 2. Bg5. Also you can defer Bg5 until after 2. Nc3.
All of these avoid the main Leningrad/Stonewall and Classical lines for Black. And whilst none are going to be a bust of the Dutch vs an engine, in over the table play where you know your preferred variation better than he does, Black is going to have a tough time. The 2.e4 and 2.or 3. Bg5 lines are probably good for equality even with perfect play by Black. The 2.g4 line is a little more suspect.
In terms of setting nasty traps the 2.Bg5 line is probably the hardest for Black to meet if he isn't very ready for it.
why would you think black has reached equality in 4 moves?
White can reach a fairly safe and persistant advantage against both the classical and leningrad dutch with the 1 off main line 6.b3. The quick reinforcement of the e5 square (after 7.Bb2) holds black up and allows white to fully develop before black suicidally opens the center and exposes his king. I've always found this to be much safer for white then the d5 push, and without a pawn on d5 the early c4 doesn't make complete sense otherwise.
There are always going to be tactics in chess, d4 players just want to have superior minor pieces and a few looming motif's when the carnage starts.
the dutch defense never gave me a good feeling on the board playing with the black pieces.
Pawn on b2 beats a Queen and Rook!!!
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