The Deleted Forum Post Part 3
The Deleted Forum Post Part 3
This is my reply to Bob; post #18
Bob, it is not Steph and Paul against the group, it is never going to be such as that. The truth of it is, it is what is spoken against GOD, and those who stand on GOD’S Word and those who will fight against HIM. …But I say, walk By The SPIRIT, and you will not carry out the desire of the flesh. For the flesh sets its desires against The SPIRIT, and The SPIRIT Against the flesh; for these are in opposition to one another, so that you may not do the things that you please… Galatians 5:16-17.
To what you have added here. No one can see The Gospel Of JESUS CHRIST through a telescope; no one can see The Kingdom Of GOD through a telescope.
Now there was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews; this man came to HIM by night, and said to HIM, “RABBI, we know that YOU have Come From GOD, A Teacher; for no one can do these Signs that YOU Do unless GOD Is With him.” JESUS Answered and Said To him, “Truly, truly, I Say To you, unless one is born again, he cannot see The Kingdom Of GOD.” Nicodemus said to HIM, “How can a man be born when he is old? He cannot enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born, can he?” JESUS Answered, “Truly, truly, I Say To you, unless one is born of water and The SPIRIT, he cannot enter into The Kingdom Of GOD. “That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born Of The SPIRIT Is Spirit. “Do not marvel that I Said To you, ‘You must be born again.’ “The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but you do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born Of The SPIRIT.”
Nicodemus answered and said to HIM, “How can these things be?” JESUS Answered and Said To him, “Are you the teacher of Israel, and do not understand these things? “Truly, truly, I Say To you, we speak that which we know, and bear witness of that which we have seen; and you do not receive our witness. “If I Told you earthly things and you do not believe, how shall you believe if I Tell you Heavenly Things?... John 3:1-12.
John 3:3, The LORD Says, “Truly, truly, I Say To you, unless one is born again, he cannot see The Kingdom Of GOD.” What The LORD Is Saying here is that unless one is born again, they cannot perceive with the eyes, cannot perceive with any of the senses, to have knowledge, to mentally apprehend in any way The Kingdom Of GOD.
What means to be born again? It means to be born Of The FATHER Anew, From Above.
John 3:5, Now I say this, Brethren, that flesh and blood cannot Inherit The Kingdom Of GOD; nor does the perishable Inherit The Imperishable. 1 Corinthians 15:50.
We seem not to recognise that it is Spiritual with Spiritual, and it cannot ever be fleshly with Spiritual nor Spiritual with fleshly, yet here we seem to have lost sight of the fact that a natural man does not accept The Things Of The SPIRIT Of GOD ( 1 Corinthians 2:12-14 ). It is impossible for him to do so!
This, as The LORD JESUS HIMSELF continues to Speak To Nicodemus, ‘we speak that which we know, and bear witness of that which we have seen.’ A man cannot speak of what he does not know just as he cannot testify of what he has not witnessed. By looking at the stars any may testify that they are there, but still, they cannot see The Kingdom Of GOD, they cannot see to hear The Gospel Of JESUS CHRIST by testifying that the stars are there. That is why we are told, And HE Said To them, “Go into all the world and preach The Gospel to all Creation. “He who has believed and has been Baptized shall be Saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned…” Mark 16:15-16.
Yet, even in all of this this every soul of man is without excuse;
For The Wrath Of GOD Is Revealed From Heaven against all ungodliness ( impiety, defiance towards GOD’S Person ) and unrighteousness ( iniquity ) of men, who suppress The Truth in unrighteousness ( hold back The Truth in iniquity ), because that which is known about GOD is evident within them; for GOD Made It Evident To them. For since The Creation Of the world HIS Invisible Attributes, HIS Eternal Power And Divine Nature, have clearly been seen, being understood through what has been Made, so that they are without excuse… Romans 1:18-20.
Clearly then, GOD Has Made Known, because here we are told, it takes wilful ignorance on the part of everyone to deny GOD, to refuse GOD. Why is it we do not hear what GOD Is Telling us here, and believe, in our own wisdom, that we can convince man otherwise by science and the such like? What then is our faith in GOD? This shows apologetics as here defined obsolete, even, of no benefit to any and always been so, does it not?
And why are we refusing to hear what GOD Says in another place? Where is the wise man? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not GOD Made foolish the wisdom of the world? For since in The Wisdom Of GOD the world through its wisdom did not know GOD, GOD Was Well-Pleased through the foolishness of The Message preached to Save those who believe. 1 Corinthians 1:20-21
To know GOD, as The Holy Scriptures, The GOD Breathed Word here states, means to know absolutely, to perceive. And this is Eternal Life;
“And This Is Eternal Life, that they may know THEE, The Only True GOD, And JESUS CHRIST WHOM THOU Hast Sent…” John 17:3.
Grace through faith. This is why we preach The Gospel; This is why we are to preach JESUS CHRIST and HIM crucified. This is defending The Gospel; supporting, maintaining by Scriptual evidence The Gospel Of JESUS CHRIST.
…And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, HE Explained To them The Things Concerning HIMSELF in all the Scriptures… Luke 24:27.
View Psalm 19 in this Light; The Light Of GOD’S Truth.
David saw what we saw, he had no telescope. The Book of Job has many, many statements within its pages that man and his science did not discover until thousands of years later. But how did these men Of GOD know? The HOLY SPIRIT. Just as it is to be with us also; By Grace through faith.
“Things which eye has not seen and ear has not heard, And have not entered the heart of man, All That GOD Has Prepared For those who love HIM.” 1 Corinthians 2:9.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is Bob’s reply; post#19
Your words Paul----->"Bob, it is not Steph and Paul against the group, it is never going to be such as that. The truth of it is, it is what is spoken against GOD, and those who stand on GOD’S Word and those who will fight against HIM" This implies that those who disagree with you are fighting against God. That is nothing short of arrogant, prideful and divisive.
I stand on God's command---->But sanctify the Lord Godin your hearts, and always be ready to give a defensea)pologi/aapologiato everyone who asks you a reason for the hope that is in you, with meekness and fear -1Peter 3:15
I have no more to add.......you come against chidren of God who make apologetics their life's work in The Name of The Lord. I Pray you will come to understanding in Jesus' Holy Name
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is my reply to Bob; post#20
No Bob,
Scripture makes Clear in all matters.
It is not arrogant nor prideful nor divisive to show and to answer everything from The Word Of GOD Alone. It is what we are, as GOD'S children, to do. All must be brought to The Light that it may be shown whether or not it is Wrought In GOD ( John 3:19-21 ).
It is those who refute Scripture that contend with The ALMIGHTY, not mere man. I have already stated, many times, and will always do so, that i am nothing, a nobody. Only GOD Is True and man a liar. And GOD Knows my heart.
And as i stated to you in a message, and so that those who read this may know, 1 Peter 3:15, this word you quote here as 'defend' means 'answer'. It is saying be always ready to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give an account for The Hope that is in you. And for clarity, see Colossians 1:27, CHRIST in you, The Hope Of Glory.
"Your words have been arrogant against ME," Says The LORD. "Yet you say, 'What have we spoken against THEE?' "You have said, 'It is vain to serve GOD; and what profit is it that we have kept HIS Charge, and that we have walked in mourning before The LORD Of Hosts? 'So now we call the arrogant blessed; not only are the doers of wickedness built up, but they also test GOD and escape.' "
Then those who feared The LORD spoke to one another, and The LORD Gave Attention and Heard, and A Book of Rememberance was Written before HIM For those who fear The LORD and who esteem HIS Name. "And they shall be MINE," Says The LORD Of Hosts, "on The Day that I Prepare MY Own Possession, and I Will Spare them as a man spares his own son who serves him." So you will again distinguish between the Righteous and the wicked, between one who serves GOD and one who does not serve HIM.
"For behold, The Day Is Coming, Burning like a furnace; and all the arrogant and every evil doer will be chaff; and The Day That Is Coming Will Set them Ablaze," Says The LORD Of Hosts, "so that it will leave them neither root nor branch." But for you who fear MY Name The Sun Of Righteousness Will Rise With Healing In Its Wings; and you will go forth and skip about like calves from the stall. "And you will tread down the wicked, for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet on The Day That I Am Preparing," Says The LORD Of Hosts.
"Remember The Law of Moses MY servant, Statutes and Ordinances Which I Commanded him in Horeb for all Israel. "Behold, I Am going to Send you Elijah the Prophet before The Coming Of The Great And Terrible Day Of The LORD. "And he will restore the hearts of the fathers to children, and the hearts of the children to their fathers, lest I Come And Smite the land with a curse." Malachi 3:13 - 4:6.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
This was Bob’s reply; post#21
Brother Paul----> Quoting massive amounts of Scripture,while beautiful Words of God, does not prove any point if not relevant to the discussion. Further, I do not object to your disagreeing, only in the way it is being done.
I know many apologists. These are dedicated men and women of God, Spirit filled, operating in the gifts of the Spirit who have dedicated their entire lives to the defense of God's Word based on the passage in Peter and elsewhere as described in the original posting by ***.
Coming against these children of God is tantamount to calling God's work through them evil and I take strong objection to that and always will.
As you and I discussed many times concerning the Greek language of the New Testament, some words need depth of study to pull out their true meaning. Linquists who Love Jesus best translate the word as "defense" in 1 Peter 3:15. {If you want the complete liquistical study from several lexicons I will be glad to forward them via email, however *** already addressed the definition in a posting above}
I really have nothing further to contribute to these postings.....I think the issue was discussed in depth. I would suggest, with God's Church being persecuted as it is, we turn our attention elsewhere where there will be a positive outcome in sharing God's Love.
I would suggest that this forum remain for say, a week, so all who wish to may have an opportunity to read it. Then with **** permission let it be deleted as a source of discord in Elijah's Prayer group, which is really God's Church.
God Bless you my Brother and all who are reading this.
Praying for Elijah's Prayer and all God's Church, In Jesus' Name.
In Jesus' Love~~~ bob
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is my reply to Bob, and my last post, which minutes after posting was deleted with the whole of the forum and postings to it. These last two postings being the what I used to show the error of hearts in the preceding post, ‘Titus 1:15-16 And A Deleted Forum Post’; post #22
Bob, and any who will read here, all the Scripture which I have used in reply to the argument for apologetics as here laid out is indeed relevant. If one cannot hear that does not mean it is irrelevant. Any who wish to ask for clarity or to question any word I have posted here I will most gladly expand or explain wherever I can, whether publicly or privately via a message. There could have been more used to further emphasize the point on behalf of GOD’S Truth but what was included I see as plenty clear enough.
And I say this to all, if any man, whoever he is, whatever he may claim to be, stands before others of GOD’S Church and speaks, it does not mean that what he says and his stand point and interpretation of Scripture is sound; being of The Truth. It is GOD WHO Will Show all for what it is.
Both publicly and privately has been given nothing more than a personal view in judgement as to what I have posted within this forum and with it also the condition of my heart. This is accusation in judgement, and only GOD May Do this. They have stated this as me being, arrogant, prideful, divisive, critical, disruptive, accusing, and self-righteous. All because my understanding of what is and what is not acceptable in GOD’S Church differs with theirs, and my making the points I have made from Scripture. To which then is added that the massive amounts of Scripture included are not relevant. Yet no one has shown any supposed error on my part from The GOD Breathed Word. Yet this is what we all must do, and how I wish that they would. ‘Massive amounts of Scripture’ and yet still it is not heard by some! It is one thing to argue a point from Scripture, this is acceptable before GOD. It is something else altogether to quarrel from fleshly motives, and this is not acceptable before GOD.
He who gives attention to The Word shall find good, And Blessed is he who trusts in The LORD. Proverbs 16:20.
There is no wisdom and no understanding and no counsel against The LORD. Proverbs 21:30.
My belief is there are none here within this group and indeed within The Church who hold authority as is authority as believed by some. All Authority Belongs To The LORD JESUS CHRIST; The WORD Of GOD, and we are all, without exception, to willingly place ourselves under HIS Authority. Yes, we all make mistakes, and as I have said before, I have made plenty. But we are to show one another our errors, each one looking to themselves lest they too be tempted ( Galatians 6:1-5 ). And the way in which we are to show one another our error is according to Scripture, and never from our own fleshly perspective of what is and what is not acceptable, of what is and what is not Of GOD. Just as it is to be that when we are shown error, we are not to refuse correction. We are instructed to reprove, rebuke, exhort, with great patience and instruction ( 2 Timothy 4:1-4 ). For me, my patience here has been tried to the limit, and I am found wanting. Though I am zealous for GOD, still my patience is found wanting. When such men as the Apostle Paul spoke of their authority they never spoke in a sense that the authority was theirs, but that it was the Authority Given To them, in Paul’s case as an Apostle Of JESUS CHRIST By The Will Of GOD, which with it comes great responsibility, and they always, always kept themselves under GOD’S Authority. Today many step outside of GOD’S Authority and fail to recognise that they do.
As a professing Christian, what we are in private is to be what we are publicly, and in all things it is GOD’S Will that we are Conformed to The Image Of HIS SON. This requires true faith so that GOD May Work. GOD Sees All and we shall all stand before The Judgement Seat Of CHRIST ( 2 Corinthians 5:9-10 ). What we will speak to one privately is how we are to then speak with them publicly. If this differs then this shows a fleshly motive in our heart. It is sin. It is not of The faith. We are most certainly in need of repentance. One cannot address another publicly as he would for the purpose of attempting to be seen by others to be saying the right thing in full view of others, and then privately speak to that same one in a different manner. This is hypocrisy; acting. This is not Of CHRIST.
We are not to agree to disagree and to not object to one who has a differing opinion in matters Pertaining To GOD shows error. How can this be in GOD’S Church? How can any accept that in The Body when there are disagreements between its members that this is acceptable to be allowed and passed over unchecked? Surely in the hearts of HIS children there must be desire to understand GOD in everything? Being diligent to preserve The Unity Of The SPIRIT In The Bond Of Peace. This too is Scriptual ( Ephesians 4 ). The Bond is a joint tie, and for us it means being always united in GOD’S Principle. This Brings and Is Peace. By all that is evident here it is why there is no Peace, and yet one stands in accusation of another that they are the sole cause, because what they state from Scripture does not agree with what they believe. I would define this as arrogant, or high mindedness. …Be of the same mind toward one another; do not be haughty in mind, but associate with the lowly ( humble ). Do not be wise in your own estimation. Romans 12:16.
As for this term, ‘Apologists’, I do not see this anywhere in Scripture named as a Gift. I see Apostle, Prophet, Evangelist, Pastor, Teacher, Miracles, Healing, Tongues, Interpretation of Tongues… Now there are varieties of Gifts, but The Same SPIRIT. And there are varieties of Ministries, and The Same LORD. And there are varieties of Effects, but The Same GOD WHO Works All Things in all. But To each one is Given The Manifestation Of The SPIRIT for the common good. For To one is Given the word of Wisdom Through The SPIRIT, and To another the word of Knowledge According To The Same SPIRIT; To another faith By The Same SPIRIT, and To another Gifts of Healing By The ONE SPIRIT, and To another the Effecting of Miracles, and To another Prophecy, and To another the Distinguishing of spirits, To another kinds of Tongues, and To another the Interpretation of Tongues. But ONE And The Same SPIRIT Works All These Things, Distributing To each one individually just as HE Wills… 1 Corinthians 12:4-11.
You see, ONE SPIRIT. GOD Is ONE, and we are to be One in One Body, One faith, One heart and soul ( Acts 4:32 ), and all is distributed just as GOD Wills. …that their hearts may be encouraged, having been knit together In Love ( Agape ), and to all The Wealth that Come From The Full Assurance of Understanding in a True Knowledge Of GOD’S Mystery, CHRIST, In WHOM Are Hidden All The Treasures Of Wisdom And Knowledge. I say this that no one delude you with persuasive argument. Colossians 2:2-4.
This then onto a statement of knowing ‘many apologists’. This does not in any way confirm apologist as being a title, a position, a Gift, Ordained and Given By GOD. This would have been strange to the ears of men such as the Apostles we read of in Scripture, and came about after their time in this world. Just as would be strange to them that these claim to be as such by the Scripture of 1 Peter 3:15. This Scripture is to everyone, there is not one soul who claims to be a follower of CHRIST this Scripture is not to apply to. The fact that some will claim it as justification of a title means absolutely nothing. Before GOD it counts for nought. And yet offence is taken because one happens to know some who do this, and he himself bears witness that they are ‘SPIRIT filled operating in The Gifts Of The SPIRIT who have dedicated their whole lives to the defence of GOD’S Word based on the passage in Peter and elsewhere as described in the original passage by ***.’
Where then is boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? Of works? No, but by a Law Of faith. Romans 3:27.
Those who walk By The SPIRIT will be able to discern Truth and error because their sole literature they rely on is The GOD Breathed Word. Even if they read anything else they will always align what they will accept given by another when being in accordance with The GOD Breathed Word. Faith in GOD.
Peter writes this to The Church, to every believer, to be ready to give an answer to everyone who asks them to give an account of The Hope that is in them. Not a select few who in turn believe it then makes them an ‘apologist’ when The Word Of GOD says nothing of the kind. And as for the interpretation of the word ‘defend’ or ‘answer’ in 1 Peter 3:15. I use W. E. Vine’s expository dictionary of Old and New Testament words, a man recognised as having expert mastery of New Testament Greek, and I think that I also have The SPIRIT Of GOD.
Yes, as we have discussed before that the Greek language of The New Testament has much more depth of meaning compared with, say, English, and only a fool would strive on his own to understand it and apart from great learning in it to the point that Greek would be to him as familiar as his own language. And I often struggle with English! Forty Seven years an Englishman born and bred and not the sharpest tool in the box, not the brightest button, and I also think that I have The SPIRIT Of GOD.
…For consider your Calling, Brethren, that there were not many wise according to the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble; but GOD Has Chosen the foolish things of the world to shame the wise, and GOD Has Chosen the weak things of the world to shame the things which are strong, and the base things of the world and the despised, GOD Has Chosen, the things that are not, that HE might Nullify the things that are, that no man should boast before GOD. But By HIS Doing you are In CHRIST JESUS, WHO Became To us Wisdom From GOD, And Righteousness And Sanctification, And Redemption, that, just as It Is Written, “Let him who boasts, boast in The LORD.” 1 Corinthians 1:26-31.
Then to another accusation, this time that ‘Coming against these children of GOD is tantamount to calling GOD’S work through them evil and I take strong objection to that and always will.’
This straight away put me in mind of medieval England and the absurd and groundless accusations suffered by many at the hands of ‘the church’, who were then tried and condemned to death with no hope of any justice and truth on the part of their accusers. Where is your evidence for this accusation? My defence is The Pure Logic Of The Word, which I long for.
You state that you believe that this issue was discussed in depth ( you use past tense? ) ‘and would suggest, with GOD’S Church being persecuted as it is, we turn our attention elsewhere where there will be a positive outcome in sharing GOD’S Love.’
I can agree that this is going on far too long, and in true humility and by The Word Of GOD it would have concluded long before now. But to leave a mess behind to turn our attention to something else elsewhere is somewhat staggering to hear a professing Christian want to do. Rather, be reconciled to GOD. Honour GOD and do not make a mockery of the Christian Way. How is it at all possible to leave such as this unresolved and believe we can then go on to do something else and hope that the next thing will have a positive outcome, and even be truly sharing GOD’S Love! There is much accusation of hypocrisy and disobedience to The Word just waiting to be levelled at us in doing such as this. More than this, it dishonours The LORD GOD. And to believe that in doing this we are continuing in GOD’S Love?! What do you make The Love Of GOD to be?
This is a lesson, that strange and varied teaching only produce quarrels and conflict, and with those who stubbornly hold on to what they want to hold on to rather than adhering to The Word Of GOD; Sound Doctrine, it will always be the case. Apart from repentance, which requires humility, it will always be the case.
If anyone advocates a different doctrine, and does not agree with Sound Words, Those Of our LORD JESUS CHRIST, and with The Doctrine Conforming to godliness, he is conceited and understands nothing; but he has a morbid interest in controversial questions and disputes about words, out of which arise envy, strife, abusive language, evil suspicions, and constant friction between men of depraved mind and deprived of The Truth, who suppose that godliness is a means of gain. 1 Timothy 6:3-5.
I believe that now it is here that this whole forum would be better to be left, and not deleted, so that any who will come across such as this again may be able to read to discern Truth and error. Though of course my desire is that it would never have arisen in the first place, and so be in line with the statement of the group; and the teaching of the Apostles ( Acts 2:42 ).
Our sin causes GOD not to hear our prayers ( Isaiah 59:1-2, Lamentations 3:39-44, 1 Peter 3:7, 1 Peter 3:12 )
In the days of HIS Flesh, HE Offered Up both Prayers and Supplications with loud crying and tears To The ONE Able To Save HIM from death, and HE Was Heard because of HIS Piety ( HE feared ;kjv). Hebrews 5:7. It is no different for us also.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
All here, apart from the omissions stated at the beginning of this post and the reasons why, is word for word what was posted and no other alterations included.
Let my cry come before THEE, O LORD; Give me Understanding According To THY Word. Let my supplication come before THEE; Deliver me According To THY Word. Let my lips utter praise, For THOU Dost Teach me THY Statutes. Let my tongue sing of THY Word, For All THY Commandments Are Righteousness. Let THY Hand Be Ready To Help me, For I have chosen THY Precepts. I long for THY Salvation, O LORD, And THY Law is my delight. Let my soul live that it may praise THEE, And let THINE Ordinances Help me. I have gone astray like a lost sheep; Seek THY servant, For I do not forget THY Commandments. Psalm 119:169-176.
