DGT Bluetooth E-Board - Proper Non-Tournament Usage

Hi all,

  (Re-posting this from the main chess.com forum as I was told I might have better luck here.)

  Apologies in advance for this long-winded email, but I want to get the most out of my DGT e-board (which I love) and need to troubleshoot/learn.

  I use this board solely for online play or playing OTB with a friend. There's no tournament usage for this board, and part of my confusion comes from the fact that the LiveChess manual almost exclusively focuses on multi-board, tournament usage.

  Anyway, connecting to my e-board is no problem, and I can see a bunch of previous games I've played through the LiveChess software. Awesome. However, I played a bunch of games with a friend of mine and connected a DGT 3000 clock. I connected and checked the first game after we finished, and noticed that it appeared in the history (after moving the pieces back to the starting position), which was cool, so I then put the computer away, played a bunch more, but none of the other games showed up in LiveChess after at all. A couple games probably had a takeback or an accidental illegal starting position, but we played like 12-13 games and only the first appeared in the history.

  So, my questions about playing OTB, non-tournament, with the e-board include the following:

1. With (and without) the clock, what is the proper way (or proper ways) to start AND stop/end the game on the board so that LiveChess recognizes the end result and so it is properly recorded in the board's history? This can include, checkmate, resignation, time running out, draw, etc.

2. What can prevent the board from recording any parts of the game? I would understand that if on, say, move 15 (or whatever) someone made a takeback or an illegal move the board might stop recording the rest of the game, but would it invalidate the entire game and cause it not to persist even the first part of the game?

  I've verified today that the board still works by resetting the starting position (without a clock), making a few moves, and resetting the positions again; LiveChess recorded that "game" perfectly fine.

  I'm totally willing to accept that I screwed something up and made some incorrect assumptions, but the LiveChess/DGT manuals don't exactly help with troubleshooting these situations (never mind in a non-tournament setting).

  Thanks in advance for anyone who might be able to help answer these questions and/or point me in the direction of some helpful material (just to be clear, yes, I've read both the DGT e-board manual and the latest LiveChess manual).

Have you corresponded with the DGT Company concerning your issues?

I figured given the length and types of issues I was having that it might yield better results by asking on here first to see if anyone else had experienced such things.

But I will reach out to DGT directly per your suggestion.

Anyone have any LiveChess experience?

I heard back from DGT and they say I should be using their "Rabbit" software (as LiveChess is just meant for tournament use), which is only available for Windows (which is a huge shame since my laptop is a Mac and my unmovable desktop is a Windows PC).

Anyway, I installed it, and had to move the board insanely close for it to connect. The connection was stable, until it wasn't, and when it came back, the Rabbit software gave me this:

I guess I should've just bought the USB-only version and could've saved some money.

I know Apple has some hoops you have to jump through to develop drivers for their OS, but surely they could've made some inroads by now with respect to that? The Windows Bluetooth driver/RabbitConnect seem to be pretty unreliable, at least so far for me. I'm hoping there's a solution to this (I've followed up with this same information with DGT as well).

@DaysOfBlunder I have come to the same conclusion: USB is the only reliable way to go unfortunately

That's unfortunate. It wouldn't be so bad for me if LiveChess was an option, but given how unforgiving it is (tournament rules and all, I get it), I guess I'm left with using a USB cable somehow. (Although given that LiveChess works on Mac just fine via Bluetooth, it would seem that it IS rather possible.)

I don't know whether it's the Windows Bluetooth driver or if it's DGT's software/own driver or something else.

If I find out anything else, I'll be sure to post it here.

daysofblunder I have posted that I owned 2 dgt boards. A serial connection in 2000 and a usb model with clock to show moves in 2004. I suffered thru the same firmware issues which never were addressed by DGT. Today in 2022 the firmware unreliability has not been solved.

That must be infuriating. It's a shame there's no recourse other than to vent on forums or harass DGT via email.

Correct DaysOfBlunder. Extremely upsetting to spend a lot of money for a poor experience and the company honestly does not care. I have an Australian friend who also has a DGT board with the same connection problems.

Unfortunately I believe CRC checking is absent from the DGT interface amateur programming. This cannot be corrected without an EPROM burn with better programming. I doubt very much that DGT can afford a recall on the various e-boards.  So, the best we can hope for is a good connection without dropouts or bit loss.

I've never had any issues when using LiveChess on my Mac; that is, the connection has been pretty solid, so that would suggest that it's the Windows-based software and/or driver that are the issue. It would also suggest that the Rabbit software could be ported to Mac, if DGT really wanted.

Well from personal experience, Windows is a very poor platform for any kind of machine control.

I've had worse experience from LiveChess on Mac than on PC. And on Lichess via Android was even worse, so I don't think the serving platforms per se is the problem, but rather poor core implementation as @frhunter13 mentioned. Seems the exterior conditions - electromagnetic interference etc - plays a larger role.

But that, said - USB has worked better than Bluetooth. Someone recommended a shielded cable - I will try that!

Pretty unimpressive for such an otherwise impressive product :/

It could just be I've been "lucky" and the amount of usage on each platform may not be enough to gather useful data, so it just boils down to my experience to date.

I agree re Windows, etc. I may just have to get a crappy old Windows laptop so I can keep it by the DGT board so I don't have to haul it into the room with my tower.

Appreciate the USB suggestion. Still sucks after having spent that much money. Maybe one day DGT will correct this issue, but based on what I'm reading, I won't hold my breath.

Yeah :/ I dug up my daughter's old PC school laptop and use it with USB och chess.com: that has had the best success rate. Lichess was even worse, even with PC & USB

I'll admit that Lichess has actually worked flawlessly for me with my Mac and my DGT board. I wonder if the difference boils down to driver/firmware differences.

I am impressed that your experience DaysOfBlunder has been that clean and consistent with your Mac. I know with certainty that the firmware is the problem when connection and playing is not stable. 

I have no problems believing that. With my Mac, when I use it, it's sitting less than a foot away from the board, and while Lichess seems to provide the better integration, it still slows down once in awhile.

Funny story: After struggling with connection problems and move registerering with my DGT e-board, with chess.com and lichess using Mac and PC, iOS and Andriod, LiveChess and DGT Test program, bluetooth and USB, I had a revelation today trying out White Pawn playing on Lichess. 

It. Actually. Worked. I had a nice experience for once. Playing blitz no less.

Tbh, some moves didn't register and I had to play them on screen eventually, losing a lot of time, but even so - it was an enjoyable experience. For once.

The only conclusion I can make is that Mr Khadim Fall has made an excellent work interfacing with this archaic piece of (beautiful) technology, better than anyone else, including DGT themselves.

Please - let him rewrite the firmware of the board as well  (and an iOS version of the app wouldn't hurt either )

Edit: WP on Android ofc, albeit on an old phone. I have now ordered an Android tablet