Are we doing enough to stop cheating?

Novel idea:

People who cheat do so to obtain high ratings artificially. The problem with, say, a two-year ban, is that when they are allowed back after the ban, they come back with the high rating which was obtained by cheating. Ok, you could deduct the points they gained from the game they were caught in, but they could've been doing it for years and gained hundreds of points.

Possible solution: Instead of a ban, make the punishment a 1000-point rating deduction! I'm convinced this would be more of a deterrant than a ban, because these narcissistic sorts of people are obsessed with ratings.

They say -whoever "they" is-that everyone deserves a second chance, so perhasps a suspension is in order upon a first infringement. Not being able to play and/or earn money may hurt some people enough to make them think about what they have done and give them a final chance to set themselves in the right direction.

If that person were to do it again, they have obviously learned nothing and show great disrespect to the title as well as to other players and the game in general, in which case they should be stripped of any title and be banned from competing (perhaps permanently).

There you go, my two cents worth.

I think it is like doping in other sports. If you let people keep getting away with it, they will keep doing it. I say ban them for life.

Penalties for OTB cheating in professional play should definitely be severe... These guys are fighting for money and titles and reputation and it should be taken seriously...

However, I wonder just how severe such a punishment should be, especially since these allegations can also be falsly presented.. and just :who: should be the person that makes the final judgement? Maybe the head of the federation is friends with the person making the accusations? There is a lot of politics in these things.

I mean, everything is clear if the cheating in question can be proven 100% beyond any doubt and/or the guy who did it admits to his wrongdoings.. If not, there is a problem. It is a similar dilemma to the one of allowing or not allowing death penalty for criminals. It is not only an ethical question regarding whether it should be allowed in some cases, but also the fact that the verdicts can be wrong and innocent people also wind up in jail, hence innocent people could be executed. That is, of course, a separate topic. What I am trying to say is that it is probably impossible to enforce very severe punishments.

What the organizer should do is: make sure that everyone was screened prior to the games to minimize the chances of anything weird taking place... monitor the arena, take note of anything out of the ordinary... and prevent cheating without detection physically, instead of worring "what if" it happens.

Also, I do agree that there is a gray area... in that example where the chess coach abused his access to the playing grounds to signal the pupil - it is obviously cheating, since he is signalling the kid in a previously agreed upon protocol... but also, it is probably his idea and he may have talked the kid into it. Apart from that, my concern is what if a really strict rules are set (losing the titles, tournament bans) - and then someone intentionally approaches you and shows you a move (someone cheering for the other guy) - so that you lose and get disqualified? So, obviously, allowing other people to move between the boards introduces a lot of space for mischief.

woodshover, there is an investigation but even the officials did not notice it.  The thing is Lafuente was a visiting GM.  He approached the organisers to gain access to the playing area under false pretenses.  Although there were strict rules about coaches or anyone else besides officials being allowed on the playing area, he chose not to disclose that he was an active coach.  It's obvious that he had every intention of cheat as he started out by breaking the tournament rules just by gaining entry.  Of course, his 'employers' let the cat out of the bag by bragging that they had GM Pablo Lafuente staying at their home for six months training their kids.  The officials did not notice that he only stayed in an area where his student could see him even when all other players in that area had completed their games.  One would surely expect a dignitary to walk around the entire playing area. As soon as his kid finished he would promptly leave.  Of course once word broke of his cheating GM Pablo Lafuente promptly disappeared and did not return to the tournament not even to defend his 'honour'.  Crazy what people will do for a few pieces of silver.

 Truly asinine.

I encounter so many cheaters i can't even count how many cheaters I had 

I've encountered 568 cheaters.

Since I have been here, I have played only about 7 live games. I have won them all but two. I got steam rolled by someone who was rated below four of the others I have beaten. I suppose it is possible I could have made a key move or two that was a bit substandard and he could have been having a great game, better than maybe any he ever had, but it sure felt like when I try a grandmaster or chess engine in a game. I guess 1 out of 7 isn't bad. I would rather however, be 6-1 with about 100+ points on my rating that I forfeited in disgust.

geez

I am curious as to how you assertain that there have been so many. I am sure you have from time to time, but can you describe the evidence that would be obvious to me that you were cheated so much. I want this not so much as to doubt your claim, but I would like to know if you have a specific way you can tell that I am not privy to. Also I am interested to know how often I might be cheated,  if I stay.

  I used to feel like I got cheated on yahoo a lot and I have gotten much better since then. I used to think I was better than I was. However, I used a program in digust to play someone, only to find after 45 minutes of a stalemate, he must be too. I quit using it in the end game thinking I could calculate it well enough to make a game of it , even if against a computer. He beat me 2 minutes later and when I told him how good I thought he must be unless he cheated, he coyly replied," my chess program must be better than yours".

i think oinq makes the best point. 

I've never went to a live tournament. I have watched some on television. How, do you cheat at a tourney with everyone watching and recording move data. It doesn't even seem possible to me. Please enlighten me.

By going to the restroom excessively.

I realize that the O.P. dictates the purpose of the post. I didn't realize it was for chess games played in person. I am curious though, if anyone either thinks they have a way to stop people from cheating others they play on the net or if they could point me to a forum that has that discussion? I don't play much chess in person, so that type of cheating doesn't normally affect me. However, short of implanted computer chips or false hearing aids, two guys locked in a room to record their own moves with a camera overhead recording everything should pretty much completely nullify anyway a guy could cheat.

who gonna pay for all that gear ?

Cheating is obviouly alive and doing well in the chess kingdom...and at one level we should expect people to cheat...after all, greed and selfishness is the accepted norm in our societies. The problem I am seeing at live tournaments is that not enough is being done to prevent the possibility of cheating in the first place...and even GMs are cheating now...how disappointing.

The other problem is how do you implement your sanctions once cheaters are caught? A recent GM was caught cheating...his team mates confessed, and discribed how it was being done. Yet, he is still playing in tournaments? Why? Because the laws in France does not permit his cellphone data to be used as evidence (or something of that nature)...we all know him...Sabastien Feller.

So, even when one is caught cheating...they can still get away with it. Clearly, there is need to tackle this problem at multiple levels...all of which will need to be gelled with the law of the land. This problem needs to be seriously addressed both at the social and political levels.

One other point I want to contribute, and that is that personally I don't believe that the governing chess body is serious about this issue...based on the number of loopholes open, and the lack of any serious action taken against cheats.

My opponents sometimes play the Najdorf against me. Is that considered cheating?

hope that's a joke ?