Software overload

After playing chess off and on for the past 40 years, I recently played in my second OTB tournament.  I did much better than in my first a couple of months earlier, but I know I still made plenty of mistakes.  I decided it would be wise to get some software so that I could get my games analyzed in the same way that I get my chess.com games are analyzed by the chess.com computer.

Now, having looked at a few sites that sell chess software, I'm completely confused about what to buy.  I see Rybka 4, ChessBase 11, ChessMaster, Fritz...  And a whole bunch of stuff that looks like add-on software:  the price of ChessBase is already pretty steep, am I really supposed to buy 10 more things to plug into it at $$$ a pop?

Can anyone with experience with these packages shed some light on the major differences?  I haven't found any good explanations/comparisons of these products.

Thanks,

Rich

I won a number of the programs you mentioned............but like you said...........$$$$$$$. Personally, I like Chessbase products.

You might want to check out some of the free options those. You can get some great software for free. Engines like Houdini, Ivanhoe, Critter, etc. For an interface try Arena. Free database programs out there too.

You only need to get two softwares. A database, and an engine. About the database, there is no question, you have to buy Chessbase 11. It will help you so much, believe me, its worth the money. I would suggest you buy the starter package or mega package, depends on how much money you wanna spend, but i think the mega package is worth the extra money, but starter is okay to.

When it comes to the engine its a little harder. I dont know much about the free engines, but i know that you will do very good with either Rybka 4 or Fritz 12 (Rybka 4 is best). You can get some free ones out there, i downloaded Gull 1,1 Houdini 1,5, RobboLito 0,09, Stockfish 2.0.1, but i dont know how good they are, perhaps someone else can answer that?

Good luck!

Houdini just won the TCEC, so........that engine is pretty good. ;) It plays Rybka4 ( finished 1 point behind ) in the final. All the engines you mentioned are very strong and as good or better than some commercials.

I agree, CB is the way to go for databases. 

Maby your right about Houdini, fact is its a strong playing engine, but does it also mean that its good for human use? I saw here at the forums Natalia Pogonina suggest to use Houdini and Rybka 4 at the same time. Rybka and Fritz must have something for human use, that Houdini doesnt have.

Thanks, that's a great start in my decision-making process.  A couple of questions:

Database:  Given the price tag, I have to guess that the major ones (e.g., ChessBase) are more than just a database of games.  But what exactly does a chess database do for you, other than let you play through games that have already been played?

Engine:  Is this the piece that I can use to analyze games that I've played?  If Houdini is, in fact, anywhere close to the ones that cost money, it's probably fine for me, as my rating is still pretty low.

I'm not really interested in playing against a computer, so that's not a primary concern.

Thanks a lot,

Rich 

About the database question, here is what I use chessbase 11 for:

• Analyze my own games
• Watch the GM's games
• Study opening theory in my reference database with 9 mil games (you get 4,5 mil games with the starting package)
•  Build up my opening repertoire (impossible without chessbase)

• Watch annotated games
• Study endgame studies  

 About the engine, maby Houdini is good enough, but if I was you, i would buy either Fritz 12 or Rybka 4 (probably Rybka 4), to be on the safe side, and to be sure to not miss anything. You will use it when you become better to, you dont need to upgrade to Rybka 5 when it comes, there is not a big difference if your not really good.

Another solution would be to purchase an old chessbase engine (old Fritz or old Shredder) for a few bucks on ebay and get used with the various engines and database features. This way you will appreciate what paying packages have to offer and decide if it's better than free software.

That was actually one of the things I was considering.  But the way that you worded your comment confuses me:  a chessbase engine?  So ChessBase is a database and an engine?  I thought I needed two different things.  SimonSeirup noted above that he uses ChessBase to analyze his games; if that's the case, what's the purpose of a separate engine?

Based on the comments above, I've downloaded Arena and Houdini.  They're free, so I can get familiar with the concept of a chess engine with only a time investment.  I may eventually want to go with one of the products that costs money, but since I'm still not sure what exactly the point is of having a database and an engine, the "free" thing really appeals to me.  :)

Thanks,

Rich

Well Chessbase is both the name of the company that sells the engines and of the main database product, hence the confusion.

It's ok to start with the free softwares - they're pretty good anyway

If you buy ChessBase, you really should by one of the engines they sell to use with it. ChessBase does not have it's own interface to analyze the games or interface with an engine, you need to buy Fritz 12, Rybka 4 (from ChessBase), or Shredder 12 (from ChessBase) so you can get the Fritz gui which interfaces directly with ChessBase. From there you can install Houdini, HIARCS, whatever you want. I recomend getting the ChessBase starter package and Deep Fritz 12.  You can then install Houdini or Crafty or whatever you want pretty easily. Also, by buying an engine from ChessBase, you also get 1 year as a premium playchess member.  Though I prefer ICC, Playchess is also a great place to play games and get live GM commentary on current tournaments.

I can understand Rich's confusion, as coming to it new i imagine it can be quite bewildering.

Here's my take:

Fritz, Hiracs, Shredder, Junior, Rybka (all published by Chessbase) gives you an oppponent to play against or who can analyse your game for you, access to their Playchess site, tactics training, opening training, and a small database.

For most people i imagine this is the first step into software (and for most i supect this is sufficient).

Chessbase also have a produce called 'Chessbase'.  Or rather it is a product with two elements.  A database application, and the database itself. The major reason for requiring the application is that the likes of Fritz aren't so good as running queries on the database.  

From Chessbase, you have two options on the database itself, Megabase or BigBase.  Megabase has lots of annotated games in it, BigBase is has not got so many annotated games.

You do have an alternative to Chessbase - that being Chess Assistant.  This is cheaper that Chessbase, and is stronger in some areas and weaker than others.  It seems that the West seems to prefer Chessbase and the East Chess Assistant.  This product is a mix of engines, database and application.

You should be aware that there are some free database applications out there - SCID being a notable one

As for other types of software:

CT-ART - highly recommended for tactics training

Chess Position Trainer - a means of building, maintaining and testing your knowledge of your opening repertoire

Until the chess software is not able to explain why my move is wrong I will not buy a engine.

Free engines like Crafty/Stockfish/Robolito are enough for my level. 

Fritz 13, 14 and 15 with maybe 3300 Elo will not help me.

Only Chessmaster "Analyse" tries to explain, but I'm absolut not satisfied with that. (but Chessmaster is ok)

If you like Chessbase DVDs you sometimes need "Fritz", but you need "Fritz 9" or higher, some DVDs are not working with 7 and 8 version.

Regards 

I agree with Dadam - i think only one engine package is enough, this will give you a good programme with which to play chess.  The engine you get largely doesn't matter as the engines out there that are free are so strong.

Try Arena GUI + chessDB database software + Fire engine (from chesslogik) + stockfish engine, which are all free. If you're not satisfied with these, you can move on to chessbase products. 

Arena? I like open source, but Arena is 

Is ChessDB database not a (very bad) fork of Scid?

Scid is pretty good and for free, but not "intuitiv", that means you need to spend some hours until you can  use it.

Thats live. 

As a Mac user contemplating buying Shredder (to go with Exachess as a database programme), I am often struck by how few people mention this. Is there a reason for that?

Relatedly, is Shredder a good companion to Exachess?

And (one more), what are good sources to get collections of games to include with my Exachess database? (Such as pgnmentor.)

I would advise to totally avoid Fritz Grandmaster Challenge 3.  I'm sure other Fritz chess products are fine, but this particular version is very buggy.  The chess course doesn't work at all, and there are a couple of boards which give you error messages when you try to select them.

On the other hand, I recently bought Chessmaster Grandmaster edition, a.k.a Chessmaster 11, and it works quite well.  I really enjoy using it to learn strategy or just playing a game against one of the many personalities.

@MartinBrookes - I currently own Shredder and a similar free database program (SCID) on my mac. I'm not too tech savvy, but I've been unable to integrate Shredder with the program. Just giving you a heads up to do some research and make sure you can load it on exachess before you spend your money. And if you find a way, let me know!