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chess_windows
Jul 11, 2012
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#41
[COMMENT DELETED]
You don't always get what you want. Even the closed lines are much better for White. 3. c3 gives White the advantage 3. d4 gives White the advantage
Heck even 3. a3 retains some White advantage! Not hard to play against 2. ... Bd6 
alexlaw wrote:
lets keep it this way: no arguments, just lines
be6 rb1 rb8
suggestions for white?
strateg wrote:
from now on i dont even want to talk about c3 and d5 lines,cause they are not problematic for this opening,once u ve close the center black is fine.
Could you show how Black can equalise after 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Bd6 3.d4 Nc6 4.d5 ? Emtpy claim about this move being bad is not enough.
alex I am not clear where your line with nd4 ne5 starts?
alexlaw wrote:
ok nd4 ne5 f4 nxd3 cxd3 bd7 rb1 c5 nf3 or wherever you want to go with your knight bc6
no clear advantage. white has normal opening advantage and kramnik can draw this as black with his eyes closed.
Another optioon is 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Bd6 3.d4 exd4 4.Bc4 with idea of 0-0 and pawn push on e5.
alexlaw wrote:
black can play bc6 a6 rb8 with b5 in your final diagram
eh the position is clearly a normal one, not clear advantage to white.
it's not like white has a clear blowing up plan of black either with none of his pieces aimed towards the white king and his king castled on the q side.
black's position is quite solid, and will be hard to break down. seems like a spanish torture to me as black has nothing clear to do while white's plan is very obvious.
i'm very sure the top players in the world wouldn't mind holding this position. gives a high chance for a draw. after all, the analysis here is useless, since we are not using machines to analyse our moves and there are probably loads of inaccuracies.
Your statements "the position is clearly a normal one, not clear advantage to white." and " seems like a spanish torture to me as black has nothing clear to do while white's plan is very obvious." are contradictious.
And I know that no strong player would be happy to defend such a position. That`s the reason why do they play more solid openings instead of crappy ones you`ve advocated in this forum.
The idea of 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Bd6 has been thought of before--thousands of times. So it is not new but any such move as 2. ..Bd6 violates chess theory and also common sense.
Maybe Kramik could defend some positions against most players but he could not defend against players his equal. [not that he would ever play 2. ... Bd6 OR try to defend one of its millions of variations.]
There has already been shown more than one way to obtain an advantage against this new move 2. ...Bd6; The only question in my mind is does White get enough to win with perfect play? And my personal chess knowledge says "very probably yes"
strateg wrote:
after d5 both Nb8 and Ne7 are fine and no problem with tempo down in closed position
Which position excatly do you mean?
strateg wrote:
1e4 e5 2Nf3 Bd6 3d4 Nc6 4d5
Your bishop on d6 is a strategic problem.
strateg wrote:
Pacifique your analyse make me laugh:how u can from a good for black position in 1e4 e5 2Nf3 Bd6 3d4 ed4 4Nd4 Nc6 5Nc3 Be5 6Nf3 Bc3 7bc3 turn so bad for black? I put this on computer and give a small edge for black and indicate 7...0-0 , but i play d5 and black is surely better also computer agree.
Your blind trust to your engine and inability to use your own brains is laughable.
After 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Bd6 3. d4 exd4 4. Nxd4 Nc6 5. Nc3 Be5 6. Nf3 Bxc3+ 7. bxc3
7...d5?? would be obviously stupid move. So probably you talk about position after 7...Nf6 8.Bd3 d5. Here are some engine-asissted analysis to illustrate problems Black can face in this line.