I play the Torre Attack some times its not theoretical the best but if your opponent plays slow you can play e4 and get to attack. If they play c5 then you have to play a Colle type thing with e3,d4,c3.
This is not the best time to play e4 but its kind of the idea.
Some days, I don't feel like seeing the KID when I play 1. d4. Ideas for openings? I was thinking of playing some Trompowsky, looks like you sometimes get some Benoni-type structures, which I'm totally cool with. Maybe I should look into Colle stuff as well? Or does someone have any ideas on what to do with 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 Bg7 to avoid the "counterattack on both wings" typical KID games? 4. e3, maybe?
Colle is not the answer at all there.
Here are a few possibilities:
The first is play your normal 2.c4, but after 2...g6, play 3.h4, which is interesting against the KID and basically makes the Grunfeld almost unplayable. Nick Pert's 3-disc d4 video gives this line and Carsten Hansen has a book coming out on this.
Otherwise, if you are going to play QP openings, you need to understand when they are playable and when they are not.
2.Bg5 (Trompowsky) - This is playable against 1...Nf6 or 1...f5. A book on the Tromp from 2014 shows the downfall to 1.d4 d5 2.Bg5?! Via 2...f6! However, it does not lead to benoni structures. Only the 2...c5 and 2...Ne4/3...c5 lines do. You often can get French structures in the 2...e6 lines. Static lines in the 2...d5 lines, etc.
London System - ok against anything EXCEPT the Modern Defense. 1.d4 g6 2.Bf4?! Bg7 3.e3 d6 4.Nf3 and now both 4...Nc6 and 4...Nd7 followed by 5...e5 give Black a slight edge. If you play the former, you have to be willing to let White trade Queens on d8.
Torre Attack - Works against 1...Nf6/2...e6 or 1...Nf6/2...g6. It is no good against early ...d5 lines. 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 d5 3.Bg5?! Ne4! The reason this is dubious, compared to the Trompowsky with 2...Ne4, is that Nf3 is already played, removing f3 ideas to kick the Knight.
Colle System - Must be willing to play a Slav as this only works when Black closes in his LSB. 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 d5 (After 2...e6, the Colle is fine. 3.e3 d5 transposes to the main line and 3...b6 leads to QID structures, but the important thing is the Bishop cannot come out to f5 or g4) 3.e3 and now 3...e6 leads to the Colle with 4.Bd3. However, there is what is specifically called the Anti-Colle, which is 3...Bf5 or 3...Bg4, after which the ONLY good move is 4.c4.
Veresov - 2.Nc3 Intending 3.e4 and so best is 2...d5 and now 3.Bg5 is the Veresov. You do have to be willing to transpose into certain KP openings. Like after 2...g6, 3.e4 is best here, and after 3...d6, you have a Pirc, for example.
Jobava Attack - Similar to the Veresov with KP transposition possibilities, but 3.Bg4 instead of 3.Bg5 and White's ideas are vastly different from the veresov.
You need to study up on this if this is what you intend to do as clearly you do not understand the ideas if you think the Colle is a solution against the Kings Indian. That is when the Colle is at its absolute worst, when Black fianchettos and his LSB can still come out.
jdwills29 - thanks! I'll take a look at some games.
ThrillerFan - thanks also! Thanks for the explanation on when Torre Attack works, when London works. I do intend to study at least whatever I'm trying to play... the whole point of me making this post was that I know next to nothing about any of these openings, so it's nice to get a brief overview of the land before I start to dive in. So, thanks for the overview.
How about KID Exchange Variation? Afaik most KID players don't like it.
Or some Reti stuff. 1.Nf3 Nf6 2. c4 (allows a symmetrical English) g6 3.b4 followed by Bb2 and g3/Bg2.
newbie4711 - I played some Exchange stuff last year, and it did seem to lead to fewer kingside attacks, true. I got tired of it after a while, but maybe I should revisit it, see what other people play in those lines.
Reti stuff I'll learn eventually, that's another idea. Will think about that, too. Thanks!
Anti-Kids?
Kind of hard to avoid the KID as a 1.d4 player tbh since Black plays those same moves and White cannot really stop it (more common are anti-Grunfelds).
I think best would be for you to simply learn a way of playing against the KID, like the Averbakh (RIP chess legend), 5.h3 6.Be3, main line 5.Nf3 6.Be2, etc.
lurking here so I can see lines people will use against me 👀
I play the Torre Attack some times its not theoretical the best but if your opponent plays slow you can play e4 and get to attack. If they play c5 then you have to play a Colle type thing with e3,d4,c3.
This is not the best time to play e4 but its kind of the idea.
What about the whole d6 e5 thing?
I play the Torre Attack some times its not theoretical the best but if your opponent plays slow you can play e4 and get to attack. If they play c5 then you have to play a Colle type thing with e3,d4,c3.
This is not the best time to play e4 but its kind of the idea.
What about the whole d6 e5 thing?
I like to develop the kingside in Semi-Classical fashion (Nf3+d4+e3+Be2+0-0).
Delaying c4 allows white to see what black wants to do with his d/c pawns. (d6? d5? c6? c5?)
Then white can develop the queenside afterward, usually with a queenside fianchetto.
Something like this.
White can play d4-d5 at some point, to open the diagonal for his queen bishop.
And pawn to b4 is a useful move, as it allows the b3 square to be used as a maneuvering point for the d2 knight to enter the fight (Nb3-Nd4).
Here's Grischuk playing this approach (transposed) against Caruana:
As a KID player I hate the east london system
What on earth is the "East" London System. Never heard of an east or west version. Just the plain old London System.
And against the KID, the London is a joke.
1.d4 Nf6 2.Bf4 g6 3 e3 Bg7 4.Nf3 d6 5.Be2 O-O 6.O-O Nbd7 and now it depends.
Against 7.Nbd2, you play 7...Qe8 intending 8...e5 and 9...Qe7.
Against weaker moves like 7.h3, you can accelerate it. 7...Ne4! 8.Nbd2 Nxd2 9.Qxd2 e5 and now 10...Qe7 in 1 go.
As a KID player I hate the east london system
What on earth is the "East" London System. Never heard of an east or west version. Just the plain old London System.
And against the KID, the London is a joke.
1.d4 Nf6 2.Bf4 g6 3 e3 Bg7 4.Nf3 d6 5.Be2 O-O 6.O-O Nbd7 and now it depends.
Against 7.Nbd2, you play 7...Qe8 intending 8...e5 and 9...Qe7.
Against weaker moves like 7.h3, you can accelerate it. 7...Ne4! 8.Nbd2 Nxd2 9.Qxd2 e5 and now 10...Qe7 in 1 go.
I think he means East Indian, London System Variation
Which is just a London, but with extra words lmao.
Awesome. Thanks for the input, everyone. Definitely going to try some of these ideas out in the near future. I did play a Trompowsky last night, and I got a winning position, but mangled it. Excited to try out new stuff against 1... Nf6.
The KID are like pirc it has pirc ish plays it is weak its completely irrelevant why bother?
The KID and the Pirc are nothing alike.
The location of White's c-pawn makes all the difference in the world.
In the Pirc, Black is looking to attack e4 by deflecting the knight away with ...b7-b5-b4.
The King's Indian sees d4 as White's weak point because both e4 and c4 have been played.
The KID are like pirc it has pirc ish plays it is weak its completely irrelevant why bother?
troll much lmao
Some days, I don't feel like seeing the KID when I play 1. d4. Ideas for openings? I was thinking of playing some Trompowsky, looks like you sometimes get some Benoni-type structures, which I'm totally cool with. Maybe I should look into Colle stuff as well? Or does someone have any ideas on what to do with 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 Bg7 to avoid the "counterattack on both wings" typical KID games? 4. e3, maybe?