Best openings for Black against whites's e4

Sort:
Avatar of Error_1256
hello chess masters this question is raised for you..Can you suggest me best chess openings for black for equalising the chess board against the White's move with e4... -Golden questions-
Avatar of tygxc

Tier 1 defences are 1...e5 and 1...c5, tier 2 are 1...e6 and 1...c6.

Avatar of ThrillerFan
tygxc wrote:

Tier 1 defences are 1...e5 and 1...c5, tier 2 are 1...e6 and 1...c6.

 

There is no way that you can say that they are "Tier 1" and "Tier 2".

Long story short, Tier 1 is those 4 responses.  1...e5, 1...e6, 1...c5, and 1...c6.

Those four moves are far and away better than the other 16 legal moves by Black.  The point is that immediate pressure is put on either the d4-point OR the e4-point, within the first 2 moves.

 

All other moves have a major flaw to them.  Either:

 

A) The impose no threat to White's center and White can maintain the big center free of charge, leading to a major advantage in space and control of all squares in the center.  For example, the Modern Defense.  1.e4 g6 2.d4 Bg7 and 3...d6 against all White responses, like 3.Nf3 or 3.c4.  White has a big center, more space, and White's center is strong, unlike say, in the French Defense, where after 1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5, IMMEDIATELY imposing issues with the e4-pawn, whether White trades on d5, advances with e5, or protects with the Knight, where Black will apply more pressure to try to force e5 or exd5, if White cannot hold his pawns on both d4 and e4, something will weaken.  With the e-pawn exchanged, White loses all control of the light squares in the center, and limits his own control of the dark squares.  By advancing e5, White has a central dominance of the dark squared, but has no control of the light squares (e4, c4, d5, etc).  By contesting d4, via 1...e5 or 1...c5, if White ever plays d4, a trade on d4 will usually lead to White's lack of control of the dark squares in the center.  By removing White's control of a color complex in the center, Black is closer to equalizing.

 

tygxc's assessment that 1...e6 and 1...c6 are a lower tier compared to 1...e5 and 1...c5 is complete hogwash.  The difference is that 1...e5 and 1...c5 counter the central dark squares before White can get a grip on them.  1...e6 and 1...c6, assuming both will be followed by 2...d5, are to counter the central light squares away from White.  All 4 are equally legitimate.

 

While some openings, like the Modern Defense or Owen's Defense, do nothing to counter White's center, others may counter White's center, but in a poor manor in that they do not actually control the center, and instead see their own pieces get tossed around the board.  Case in point, Alekhine's Defense.  Yes, 1...Nf6 immediately counters e4, but after 2.e5, the Knight must move, and when it goes to d5, it no longer controls any light squares.  Now White may not "occupy" e4, but with the pawn on e5, White has the space, and it will be easier for him to control e4, like with a Rook on e1.  So openings like the Alekhine do not solve the problem.  With the 4 main moves, Black keeps control of what he fights for in the center.  Like in the French Defense, Black not only attacks e4, but wrestles for complete control of e4!

 

The other thing to keep in mind is that e4 is an unprotected square for White at the start of the game.  d4 is protected when advanced, by the White Queen.  This is why you see openings like 1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 and not 1.e4 d6 2.d4 e5 or 1.d4 d6 2.e4 e5 (1.d4 d6 2.c4 e5 is a different story, and has to do with the c-pawn being in the way of the Bishop on f1 more than anything else).  But back to the topic, because e4 is not guarded by anything, Black can legitimately attack e4 with the d-pawn in openings like the French or Caro-Kann because White must do something about it.  For the d4-square, Black must cover it before it become occupied by a White pawn because otherwise, White can just ignore it as d4 is already protected, and so he has time to do whatever he wants.  The e4-pawn is not the same case.  That is why you see e6 and d5 or c6 and d5, but not d6 and e5 at the master level.  After 1.e4 c6 2.d4 d5, White must IMMEDIATELY do something about e4.  Fewer options for White that way.

 

This is why those 4 moves are superior.  They are the only ones that fight for d4 before d4 is occupied, or fight for e4, a pawn that is loose and hanging in the first place, and at the same time, cannot be easily forced to move away.  A pawn on c5 fighting for control of d4 is more stable than a Knight on c6 fighting for control of d4.

 

That brings up another point.  You see 1.d4 Nf6 a lot more than 1.e4 Nc6 at the GM level.  That is because 1.d4 Nf6 actually stops 2.e4, but 1.e4 Nc6 does not stop 2.d4 becuase the Queen protects the d4 pawn.  The King DOES NOT protect the e4 pawn.

 

Because of this, responses to 1.e4 and responses to 1.d4 are NOT symmetrically equivalent, just like how taking 2 moves to fight for a loose e4-pawn is not the same as taking 2 moves to fight an already protected d4-pawn.

 

So therefore, against 1.e4, there are FOUR, NOT TWO, strong replies.  1...e5, 1...c5, 1...e6, and 1...c6, PROVIDED that the last 2 are immediately followed up with 2...d5!

Avatar of Error_1256
tygxc wrote:

Tier 1 defences are 1...e5 and 1...c5, tier 2 are 1...e6 and 1...c6.

Thank you 

Avatar of NikkiLikeChikki

Statistically, at YOUR rating (I took the liberty of running some numbers), the Alekhine has the highest win percentage for black. Black wins 48% of the time, White wins 47% of the time, and the rest are draws (feel free to confirm on that other web site's database).

For comparison, the Nimzovitch (Nc6) wins 48% for black (decimal points difference), the Caro Kann and Modern win 47%, the French, Sicilian, and Scandinavian win 46%, and openings following e5 win 45% of the time. Obviously I didn't subdivide because that would take forever, but generally win% ranges from 45-47%.

Now, this is just a breakdown of win%. I can already hear everyone coming in and talking about how unsound it is or how it's easily countered, or how you'd have to be crazy to play the Alekhine, but the numbers are the numbers. I didn't make them up and I personally don't think it makes much of a difference what you play as long as it doesn't have any conclusive refutation.

I think the biggest takeaway is that there really isn't a best opening that will signicantly affect your win% so you're best just going with whatever it is you like best.

Avatar of null_day

1...e5 or 1...c5. But the best doesn't mean it's easy and recommended for any level. If you ask such questions consider something easier like 1...c6 (personal recommendation) or 1...e6

Avatar of SERGio80-80

:)

Avatar of SERGio80-80

Интересно

Avatar of tygxc

#3
"The French Defence. In my younger years I used to consider it at best a second-rate opening, and I once even lost a bet with one of my friends, and as a result had to play 1... e6 in all my games with Black in a Super-GM tournament. Fortunately my friend was greedy, and took money instead. I believe that both 1...c5 and 1...e5! are better choices" - Carlsen

Avatar of EKAFC

The French is a good one. Sure it was destroyed by Alpha Zero but it doesn't mean it's a bad opening. It isn't the most theoretical which is why something like a Ruy Lopez or Open Sicilian are harder to refute. 

Avatar of pfren

The Russian Game, AKA the Petroff.

Simple to learn, and practically uncrackable.

Disadvantage: Hard to play for a win, but this is pretty irrelevant at class level.

Avatar of GM_BishopPairSnatcher

Caro-Kann

Avatar of EKAFC
pfren wrote:

The Russian Game, AKA the Petroff.

Simple to learn, and practically uncrackable.

Disadvantage: Hard to play for a win, but this is pretty irrelevant at class level.

Assuming you don't play a Stafford Gambit. I personally don't find it good to play when you just play Nf3, h3, and d3. It's almost fool proof

Avatar of Solmyr1234
NikkiLikeChikki wrote:

 

I think the biggest takeaway is that there really isn't a best opening that will signicantly affect your win% so you're best just going with whatever it is you like best.

 

I beg to differ. I started playing the French Defense, and I'm CRUSHING people with it. - People are confused by this opening, they can't "anti-" it - it's too solid, and my rating is up at least 100 points in chess.com and 150 at lichess.org. As I say - It's easy for Black, and hard for White.

Sorry. Godspeed

Avatar of ThrillerFan
Solmyr1234 wrote:
NikkiLikeChikki wrote:

 

I think the biggest takeaway is that there really isn't a best opening that will signicantly affect your win% so you're best just going with whatever it is you like best.

 

I beg to differ. I started playing the French Defense, and I'm CRUSHING people with it. - People are confused by this opening, they can't "anti-" it - it's too solid, and my rating is up at least 100 points in chess.com and 150 at lichess.org. As I say - It's easy for Black, and hard for White.

Sorry. Godspeed

 

You are just as wrong as he is.

 

Just because your personal results are heavily in Black's favor does not mean anything.  It means the players playing White were idiots.

 

1...e5, 1...c5, 1...e6, and 1...c6 are EQUALLY SOUND!  What determines the results is how well you understand each of them.

 

Over the board, I play 1.e4 as White, and 1...e6 against 1.e4 as Black.

 

I get excellent results against players of the same rating (2000ish) playing the Black side of the French Defense.

 

As White, when facing one of the "Big 4" defenses (I score fairly high against the inferior defenses), guess which I score best against?  THE FRENCH!  It is because I UNDERSTAND it better than the other 3.  My next best score is beating the Sicilian, mainly because of its many similarities to the French.  My scores are lower against 1...e5 and 1...c6.  It is not because they are stronger than 1...e6 or 1...c5, it is because, as an amateur (2000 and 2800 are NOT the same), I have a far greater understanding of the French and Sicilian than I do the Caro or 1...e5.

That will hold true for just about any 2000 player.  The difference between a 1200 and a 2000 is a huge difference in understanding patterns, attack, Defense, opening concepts, etc.  The difference between a 2000 and a 2800 is that a 2000 usually has a narrow comfort zone.  They often have one opening, be it the Najdorf Sicilian, Sveshnikov Sicilian, French, Petroff, Caro-Kann, whatever it is (French in my case), that they specialize in, and will often get better results from BOTH sides than they do with any other opening.  The 2800 has that ability with not just 1 opening, but with ALL openings.  The 2000 player has that one pattern that they know really well, like say, the blocked center in the Advance French, and what both sides need to do.  That 2000 player gets that position and they probably perform at a 2200 to 2400 level.  For the Accel Dragon player, it might be a Maroczy Bind structure where their skill goes WAY UP!  For the Berlin player, it may be those stagnant positions with focus on control of a single square that is their strength, like the g4-square in the Berlin.  Either way, they tend to be specialists in ONE area, whereas the GM is a specialist in EVERY aspect of the game!

 

So to counter your false assessment of the French being better than the rest, YOU may do better with the French because YOU specialize in it and understand it better than the Sicilian, Caro-Kann, or 1...e5, but just because YOU get better results with it DOES NOT make it stronger as a whole.

 

And I speak of this as a French specialist myself, with a slightly inferior understanding of the Sicilian and greater level of inferiority of understanding the Caro or 1...e5.  All of this DOES NOT make 1...e6 better than 1...c5 or 1...c6 or 1...e5.  It makes MY PERSONAL RESULTS better with 1...e6 as Black, and same thing goes for YOU.  YOUR RESULTS DO NOT VALIDATE GENERALIZED CONCLUSIONS!

Avatar of rychessmaster1

 

1...e5, 1...c5, 1...e6, and 1...c6 are EQUALLY SOUND!  What determines the results is how well you understand each of them.

 

This basically 

Avatar of rychessmaster1
EKAFC wrote:
pfren wrote:

The Russian Game, AKA the Petroff.

Simple to learn, and practically uncrackable.

Disadvantage: Hard to play for a win, but this is pretty irrelevant at class level.

Assuming you don't play a Stafford Gambit. I personally don't find it good to play when you just play Nf3, h3, and d3. It's almost fool proof

If pfren plays the stafford I’m eating my hat 

Avatar of keep1teasy
Solmyr1234 wrote:
NikkiLikeChikki wrote:

 

I think the biggest takeaway is that there really isn't a best opening that will signicantly affect your win% so you're best just going with whatever it is you like best.

 

I beg to differ. I started playing the French Defense, and I'm CRUSHING people with it. - People are confused by this opening, they can't "anti-" it - it's too solid, and my rating is up at least 100 points in chess.com and 150 at lichess.org. As I say - It's easy for Black, and hard for White.

Sorry. Godspeed

Yes, you can definitely "anti" the french defense.

1.e4 e6 2.Qe2!?

1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.e5 c5 4.Qg4!? (my personal choice, but I can't say that it's a great option)

Avatar of JZanturo94

A pretty uncommon one, 1. Nc6.

It's worked for me wonderfully compared to other openings I've tried.

Avatar of keep1teasy
Christianf859 wrote:

A pretty uncommon one, 1. Nc6.

It's worked for me wonderfully compared to other openings I've tried.

I play Nc6, and score not bad with it (otb too). But objectively, it's not so good.