chess opening tierlist

the italian gives white a slow manuvering game where he just holds on to a tiny advantage the whole game

the ¨fried liver¨ gives black equality

the ¨classical variation¨ with c3-d4 gives black a better position with an easy d5

then look at the grünfeld. its an aggressive, hypermodern opening where white gets a large center and black picks at it with c5-Bg4-Qa5-Nc6,Na5 etc..

just look at common positions from each opening

Okay, I'm looking at the positions, and I prefer white in both.

In the Gruenfeld position, it looks to me like white has what he wants. He controls the center more and his rooks look like they have better chances for activity quickly. I would rather be playing white.

White's main plan in that position for the Italian is d4, giving him a better center and, in my opinion, a better position. I don't know about you, but I would certainly prefer white over black after d4.

I like the Gruenfeld too; that's why I put it in unbreakable. But I just prefer the Italian.

The Italian also doesn't have to be played like that. You can go for something immediately aggressive, like the Evans Gambit (if 3...Bc5 is played):

Those are some of the best ways for black to play against it. At the lower level, a lot of people could mess up quickly against it.

Also, I apologize about the way I came across in my first post to you about the Italian. I'm sure there was a better way to say I disagree.

What is this for? I never said anything about playing 5.d4 there.

You played specific moves that don't have to be played to get to that position. Why? And again, what is this for?

showing that the italian isint very good for winning

Not a good picture, but it still shows what I wanted it to.

This is my winrate with the Italian. Works for me. For many other people too, in fact.

And, you purposely picked a different and worse line of the Italian. You're proving nothing.

the quiet line (main line) just gives white a small advantage the whole game, nothing more, nothing less.

the grünfeld goes for active counterplay and for the win

theres a difference

You're right, man. All the people that play the main line Italian always go for draws. Aronian, Steinitz, Anand (that's how he became World Champion, by always going for draws, of course!), etc. etc.

Yeah, for sure.

Fr lmao

This isn't Gotham and Hikaru's list, as already stated. Gotham and Hikaru put Najdorf in Legendary when they were doing their list.

fr fr fr

youre making stuff up now, how about you go clear your head and re-read what i said

I reread it, and I'll stick to what I said. I'll quote what you said exactly:

"the quiet line (main line) just gives white a small advantage the whole game, nothing more, nothing less."

A small advantage isn't enough to win. You wrote a small advantage is all white has the whole game, leading me to think you're trying to say it just draws all the time. I responded with sarcasm.

its a draw with best play

and the quiet main line is not as testing as the ruy or the grünfeld. Thats just pure fact.

sure you can win in the italian but im just saying

All chess is a draw with best play.

but in the quiet italian its easier

Alapin sicilian is mid

It's difficult to say,

The Grünfeld is a defence for black against d4.

The Italian is an e4 opening for white.

In terms of character, I would say the Italian is more quiet in the main line, although it has some more dynamic but risky lines.

The Grünfeld is generally more open and dynamic,. It's not quite as aggressive as the King's Indian, but it's a lot more sound technically.