Chess openings for beginners/ kids

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X_PLAYER_J_X

@Ezamit

Don't listen to these people!

You are better off getting a coach or coming up with a plan yourself.

It is completely obvious people on this forum have no clue what they are even talking about.

They are trying to agrue in good conscience that the Kings Indian Attack & Kings Indian Defense are considered positional?????

Never in a million years has it been recongized as a Positional opening.

It has always been considered a Tactical/Dynamic Opening.

All openings in chess have both positional and tactical elements.

However, one element often dwarfs the other.

The KIA & KID are more recongized as tactical elements than positional ones.

It is completely obvious all they feel like doing is giving false information.

Jengaias even went as far as to say Garry Kasparov has wonderful positional skills.

Yes, Garry Kasparov played the Kings Indian Defense to positionally squeeze his opponent into submission!

What a moron!

What ever you do don't listen to them!

You are better off going to a professional.


SmyslovFan

There was absolutely nothing wrong with teaching the Vienna to kids. It's a good, classical line. As some others mentioned, it's a gambit line, which is important for kids to learn. Gambits teach kids not to be too materialistic and to value development. Of course, there are more main stream openings that kids can learn, but that doesn't mean the Vienna was a bad choice. 

This is a real problem with seeking advice from the internet. The best answer you will get will usually be the staid, safe answer, wrapped up as the only possible response. 

Chess teaches us to think independently. Trust yourself. 

X_PLAYER_J_X
pfren wrote:

Teaching openings to a kid is the best way to make him/her hate chess.

@Ezamit

WIM P-Fran above quote is all you need to know about him!

He summed up his knowledge in a single sentence!

WIM P-Fran is very lucky!

Lucky that FIDE doesn't require you to maintain your ranking.

Lord only knows if FIDE required WIM P-Fran to maintain his title ranking he would of lost his title years ago!

Yes!

Lets not teach kids any opening!

Lets all start off in Thematic positions!

HOOOOOOORRRRAAYYYYY!

u0110001101101000
SmyslovFan wrote:

This is a real problem with seeking advice from the internet. The best answer you will get will usually be the staid, safe answer.

Interesting choice...

I would have gone with the problem is answers from X_Player_JX Tongue Out

u0110001101101000
X_PLAYER_J_X wrote:

Jengaias even went as far as to say Garry Kasparov has wonderful positional skills.

Wow, he went that far did he?

X_PLAYER_J_X
jengaias wrote:

Do you know what IM is?

He would slaughter you half drunk , with fever , his eyes closed and 2 rooks down.

Yes I know what IM is.

Back in 1976 when WIM P-Fran got his IM title.

I absolutely 100% agree with you.

He probably slaugthered a lot of people.

However, in todays world 2016 I have no doubt that the OP who is around a Class D rated play can take him!

It is amazing what age can do to a chess players mind.

Crying shame really!

I would love to see that chess match

Ezamit   vs   WIM P-Fran

Final score prediction

Ezamit wins 4 to 3

Diakonia
ezamit wrote:

My son is rated around 750 and I have taught him Vienna opening for white. After reviewing few of his games, I feel it might not be a good opening for beginners. Any recommendations for a good fundamentally sound opening for white.

Some advice:

1. Stop teaching him openings at that level.  Teach him Opening Principles:

Control the center

Develop minor pieces toward the center

Castle

Connect your rooks

2. Tactics...tactics..tactics...

3. Basic Mates - KQ vs. K, KR vs. K, KRR vs. K

4. Basic Endings - KP vs K, opposition

X_PLAYER_J_X

BWWWAHAHAHHAHAAHH

I can't believe it!

This guy right here >>>  Jengaias

Says I don't understand chess.

His blitz ranking is 1,100.

An he has the nerve to tell me I don't understand chess!

I can't believe it!

This guy right here >>>  Jengaias

Says Tal was a positional player!

Says The Kings Indian Defense is a positional line!

I can't believe it!

He said all of this!

This guy right here >>>  Jengaias

 

I can't believe he said it!

He had the nerve to say it!

This guy right here >>>  Jengaias

It's fine!

If you wish to believe your own made up lies than go ahead!

Yes! Tal was such an amazing positional player! The way he won every game by slowly squeezing his opponents to death like a python is unparallel!

Tal's positional exchange sacrifices are legend!

This guy right here >>>  Jengaias believes this!

 

I can't believe he said it!

Diakonia
X_PLAYER_J_X wrote:

BWWWAHAHAHHAHAAHH

I can't believe it!

This guy right here >>>  Jengaias

Says I don't understand chess.

His blitz ranking is 1,100.

An he has the nerve to tell me I don't understand chess!

I can't believe it!

This guy right here >>>  Jengaias

Says Tal was a positional player!

Says The Kings Indian Defense is a positional line!

I can't believe it!

He said all of this!

This guy right here >>>  Jengaias

 

 

I can't believe he said it!

He had the nerve to say it!

This guy right here >>>  Jengaias

It's fine!

If you wish to believe your own made up lies than go ahead!

Yes! Tal was such an amazing positional player! The way he won every game by slowly squeezing his opponents to death like a python is unparallel!

Tal's positional exchange sacrifices are legend!

This guy right here >>>  Jengaias believes this!

 

I can't believe he said it!

Tal was an incredibly gifted positional player.  Petrosian, was a very well known positional player that could bust out some incredible tactics.  

Any experienced chess player knows this...maybe...just maybe jengaias is correct.

JamesAgadir

Ponziani read my blog

Diakonia
jengaias wrote:
Diakonia wrote:
X_PLAYER_J_X wrote:

BWWWAHAHAHHAHAAHH

I can't believe it!

This guy right here >>>  Jengaias

Says I don't understand chess.

His blitz ranking is 1,100.

An he has the nerve to tell me I don't understand chess!

I can't believe it!

This guy right here >>>  Jengaias

Says Tal was a positional player!

Says The Kings Indian Defense is a positional line!

I can't believe it!

He said all of this!

This guy right here >>>  Jengaias

 

 

I can't believe he said it!

He had the nerve to say it!

This guy right here >>>  Jengaias

It's fine!

If you wish to believe your own made up lies than go ahead!

Yes! Tal was such an amazing positional player! The way he won every game by slowly squeezing his opponents to death like a python is unparallel!

Tal's positional exchange sacrifices are legend!

This guy right here >>>  Jengaias believes this!

 

I can't believe he said it!

Tal was an incredibly gifted positional player.  Petrosian, was a very well known positional player that could bust out some incredible tactics.  

Any experienced chess player knows this...maybe...just maybe jengaias is correct.

No , it doesn't have to do with experience.It has to do with serious non-superficial study.Something he has never done.

He is from the guys that run a game and once they reach the sacrifice  they say "wow!!!! what a great tactical player" and they kneel and praise  God.They can't understand even one move before the sacrifice , and they don't even try.

For all those Karpov was positional and Kasparov was tactical.The truth is that both were equally good positional and tactical players.But how can you make them understand that?

Or how can you make them understand that King's Indian defense is equally positionaly complex with Nimzo Indian(if not more)?

You have been here long enough to know that people here love to label everything.  

"Im a tactical player"

"Im a positional player"

"I know <insert opening here> 20 moves deep"

"Im an agressive player"

And on and on...

If you dont know what youre talking about, label it!

Diakonia
jengaias wrote:

I want to say one last thing to Ezamit.

Teach your son endgames.

While the value of openings for beginners and kids is highly doubtful(many claim they do more harm than good) the value of endgames is not doubted by any serious trainer and will serve him well from now till he becomes grandmaster(if he ever does).They will help him understand the properties of the pieces and they will help him develop a thinking process.

Understanding in chess begins with the endgame. 

Excellent advice that is often ignored.  I can understand the fascination with openings for beginners.  We are taught early on how to win with fools mate, scholars mate, etc.  We fall in love with them and think we are invincible.  This carries over into the "I know<insert openinig here> 20-30 moves deep" mentality.  And these same players will post asking why they are not improving when they know openings 20 moves deep, and still drop pieces, miss simple tactics, and cant mate.  

I start all my students at the end.  

Basic mates

Opposition

Key squares

King on the 6th

The foundation of chess.  It does no good to put a roof on the house, when the foundation is weak. 

Ziryab
jengaias wrote:

I want to say one last thing to Ezamit.

Teach your son endgames.

While the value of openings for beginners and kids is highly doubtful(many claim they do more harm than good) the value of endgames is not doubted by any serious trainer and will serve him well from now till he becomes grandmaster(if he ever does).They will help him understand the properties of the pieces and they will help him develop a thinking process.

Understanding in chess begins with the endgame. 

 

In the first two sentences of Chess Fundamentals, Jose Capablanca states that a beginner must first learn the relative values of the pieces. He suggests that learning the basic checkmates--rook and king, queen and king, two bishops and king. Later in the book, he teaches checkmates that do not require coordination with the King.

 

Another World Champion, Vasily Smyslov notes in his book Endgame Virtuouso that the true power of each piece is most clearly perceived in the endgame.

Ziryab
jengaias wrote:

 

The main problem with endgames is that you don't see immediate improvement.

 

A big problem with teaching children is that the fastest results come if you teach them to deliver scholar's mate. But, when children start outplaying higher rated adults in endgames, heads turn.

Two of my students have done that recently. They since have moved beyond me and now take their lessons from a local FIDE Master.

X_PLAYER_J_X
Diakonia wrote:

Tal was an incredibly gifted positional player.  Petrosian, was a very well known positional player that could bust out some incredible tactics.  

Any experienced chess player knows this...maybe...just maybe jengaias is correct.

 

Tal was a Grand Master.

You don't become a Grand Master with out having positional and tactical understanding.

When people call Tal a tactical player.

They are not labeling him.

They are simply describing the legacy he left on the game.

He use to love to do attacks.

He is remembered for his attacking style.

Thus, that is why they call him a tactical player.

When Jengaias comes along and says Tal was a positional player?

Than the picture is clear!

Jengaias is an idiot who is incorrect because that is not what Tal is remembered for.

He is remembered for his attacking | aggressive | tactical style.

Which is why people considered him a tactical attacking player.

 


 

Now if by chance Jengaias was simply trying to point out that Tal did have great positional play.

Than the question which arises is:

Why even mention it?

It has nothing to do with my agruement!

It is as if Jengaias is coming out of left field with a novice response.

Tal was a great positional player!

Tal knew how to mate with 2 bishops!

So what?

He is a Grand Master obviously he knows positional play and how to mate with 2 bishops!

What the h*ll does that have to do with me saying he is a tactical player?

 


 

Diakonia if you can explain it than by all means go ahead!

Jengaias seems nothing more than an idiot or an irrelevant noob.

coolchesssets

Here's a website with 10 openings that are good for beginners to start out with and learn well. http://coolchesssets.net/2016/02/20/10-of-the-best-chess-openings-you-need-know/. It's a pretty informative list that explains why each opening is effective in their own ways; feel free to check it out.

YankeWang

QGD

Diakonia
BettorOffSingle wrote:
Diakonia wrote:
jengaias wrote:

I want to say one last thing to Ezamit.

Teach your son endgames.

While the value of openings for beginners and kids is highly doubtful(many claim they do more harm than good) the value of endgames is not doubted by any serious trainer and will serve him well from now till he becomes grandmaster(if he ever does).They will help him understand the properties of the pieces and they will help him develop a thinking process.

Understanding in chess begins with the endgame. 

Excellent advice that is often ignored.  I can understand the fascination with openings for beginners.  We are taught early on how to win with fools mate, scholars mate, etc.  We fall in love with them and think we are invincible.  This carries over into the "I know<insert openinig here> 20-30 moves deep" mentality.  And these same players will post asking why they are not improving when they know openings 20 moves deep, and still drop pieces, miss simple tactics, and cant mate.  

I start all my students at the end.  

Basic mates

Opposition

Key squares

King on the 6th

The foundation of chess.  It does no good to put a roof on the house, when the foundation is weak. 

To LEARN the endgame it helps to REACH the endgame.

I prefer long term success over short term gains.

Pimapom

Firstly explain the three rules of opening; control the centre, activate your pieces and castle. Beyond that openings I recommend for kids are based on being fun, surprising your opponents and leading to tactical games (which kids usually like).

 

As white play e4 hope they play e5 then play the Danish Gambit. It is fun and not overly theoretical.

If you are black and your opponent plays e4 then play d5 then after exd5 play Nf6 - the Icelandic Gambit

Diakonia
Thetrouncer wrote:

Firstly explain the three rules of opening; control the centre, activate your pieces and castle. Beyond that openings I recommend for kids are based on being fun, surprising your opponents and leading to tactical games (which kids usually like).

 

As white play e4 hope they play e5 then play the Danish Gambit. It is fun and not overly theoretical.

If you are black and your opponent plays e4 then play d5 then after exd5 play Nf6 - the Icelandic Gambit

What youre describing is the Scandinavian Defense: Modern Variation. If white plays 3.c4 then you can have an Icelandic Gambit.