From Pirc to KID?

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Greenatic

Hello all,

I currently play the Pirc as Black against 1. e4 and have been told that as a result, I should look at the King's Indian Defense as a potential response to 1. d4.  I don't know very much about the KID, other than the fact that it looks very similar to the Pirc, but I have heard a lot of people say that these openings are quite different despite the similarities in Black's structure.  (One point of emphasis I have heard is that in the Pirc White plays Nc3 early, with his c-pawn stuck behind it.  In the KID, White's pawn comes to c4 early.  I assume this means White will look for more queenside play, though I could be wrong.)

My questions are:

  • What differences are there between the Pirc and the KID, in terms of the plans of both White and Black?  What are the similarities?
  • To what extent will my Pirc knowledge be relevant in the KID?  Are there any lines in the KID I need to focus on especially?
  • How do I know if the KID is a good fit for me personally?

I know this is a lot to ask, so I would like to thank everyone who responds in advance for the help.  Thank you!  Smile

Greenatic
Olympian256 wrote:

Pirc and KID are actually very different despite both being king's fianketo defenses with very similar pawn formations for black.The presence of the pawn on c4 in KID creates a lot of very important differences.

Your Pirc knowledge is totally irrelevant for KID.Don't expect to be easier for you to learn KID.In fact be prepared for a totally different opening.

You can't know if KID is good to you until you try it. 

Thanks for your help, Olympian256.  I really appreciate it.  Smile

Could you elaborate on the "very important differences", please?

On that last point, I am hoping to try it soon.  I can tell already from looking at some of the positions I rather like them.  To me, the KID seems to yield closed positions while being a bit more sound than the Czech Benoni, an opening I tried in some unrated OTB games with surprisingly strong results against superior opposition, but am still a bit nervous about using.

 In the Pirc, a common plan of White's is Be3, Qd2, and Bh6, destroying Black's fianchetto.  I've been doing a lot of digging in the Game Explorer, but I don't seem to find this plan occurring very often in the KID.  Why?

pfren
Greenatic wrote:
 In the Pirc, a common plan of White's is Be3, Qd2, and Bh6, destroying Black's fianchetto.  I've been doing a lot of digging in the Game Explorer, but I don't seem to find this plan occurring very often in the KID.  Why?

Because you haven't seen many King's Indian's yet.

It may well happen in many instances, but certainly not when Black has played ...e5 and the center is blocked: Noone wants to exchange that fat piece of wood on g7, most of the times Black tries some time consuming manouvres in order to exchange it.

Greenatic

Thanks to both IM pfren and XPLAYERJX for taking the time to help.  I truly appreciate it!

Clearly I need to spend a bit more time on theory.  That Saemisch Variation looks a bit intimidating--somewhat reminiscent of the 150 Attack, indeed--but I think after studying some theory I should be able to handle it.

Right now I'm looking at the Orthodox Variation (it seems to be the mainline) and the Saemisch Variation.  Are there any other lines I need to focus on as I begin to study this defense?  Also, on a bit of a tangent, how dangerous is the Bayonet Attack?  (It looks quite perilous for Black.)

pfren

I never bothered to learn the KID as Black: Way too much reading.

Anyway, I suggest the Byrne (...a6 and ...c6, without castling) against the Saemisch, and the ...Na6 and ...e5 variation against the Classical. GM Perelsteyn has made some videos on them for chess.com

TheGreatOogieBoogie

What about this novelty in the Pirc?