How to learn Sicilian Rossolimo sidelines?

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Amazing_Player

Hey guys I'm an e4 player but I do not like to play "mainline sicilian" I feel as though playing the mainline variations I am giving into Black's plan of cxd early on and I think that as white it can't possibly make sense to give Black exactly what he wants in the opening - on top of which I never actually feel comfortable playing the main lines. 

Yesterday I experienced an enlightening moment when presented with 1. e4 c5 2. nf3 nc6 and just thought "hey! why don't I just play bb5 here?" so this has become my new pet versus the Sicilian which I am now trying desperately to learn.

Today I downloaded the volume 14 revised MCO ebook (the first opening book I've ever had) so I looked for this position and it was indeed there however it only gives lines for 3. e6, g6 and nf6.

I have setup this diagram below to show 8 different moves which Black can play - some objectively better than others however if I am to mainly use this opening versus the Sicilian surely I must know lines versus all 8 as not to be taken out of my comfort zone from move 3!

 

What can you guys recommend me to do to find out how to play versus these moves?
RexRacer

Have you considered a book?

adamWheatley

Play 1 d4 which avoids the sicilian alltogether.

If you must play 1. e4 (which I do and love Sicilian as white) then you can play

1. e4 c5 2. c3

This is an anti Sicilian line called the Alapin variation. It will take the sicilian players comfort zone right out of black. You master this for white and it's very likely the Sicilian players wont know this line as well as you.   

r3dg1ant
Good look you just fixed my repitiore.
KahunaNui

I hate to receive the Alapin and I fear the Morra gambit (1e4 c5 2d4 cxd 3c3 I believe). Other lines can be  2Nc3 or something in the Closed Sicilian (not trading the pawns you don't want to trade). But I wouldn't say that the open sicilian is giving black what he wants, since in all open sicilians white is ahead in development and has great chances to attack.

There's a fritztrainer with Shirov's best games in the Rossolimo, you might wanna check it out.

Arctor

Why are you people suggesting other "anti-Sicilians" when he's already found what's probably the best of them (Bb5) ? Laughing

Learn the Rossolimo the same way you would any other opening...play and analyse a lot of games. If you meet a move you're not familar with, look it up in a book or database after the game and see what is commonly played against (and most importantly..strive to understand why)

mattattack99

To be honest, as  Sicilian player the Rossolimo (also called the Moscow variation) irritates me more than the Aplain, mainly because I know less about it.

benonidoni

People that play asAmazing_Player does  has caused me so much frustration in the najdorf and sveshnikov that I was forced to purchase the anti sicilian book (quality chess). At least I now have a heads up on  the BB5 move as the pros suggest a more uncommon move of D6.

More work for us Sicilian fans but he does mention that BB5 gives black the edge. But don't all the writers?

Arctor
benonidoni wrote:

People that play asAmazing_Player does  has caused me so much frustration in the najdorf and sveshnikov that I was forced to purchase the anti sicilian book (quality chess). At least I now have a heads up on  the BB5 move as the pros suggest a more uncommon move of D6.

More work for us Sicilian fans but he does mention that BB5 gives black the edge. But don't all the writers?


 Really? That's interesting. I would agree that White is naive to think he can get much more than equality if Black knows what he's doing, but certainly wouldn't think Bb5 gives Black an advantage (but then again, I'm a nobody). However, other writers don't agree...Evgeny Sveshnikov for example thinks that 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 e6 (or d6) represents perfect play from both sides Surprised

And spare a thought for the work us poor souls who have to face 1...c5 have to do. We have to know what to do against the Najdorf, Scheveningen, Dragon, Accelerated Dragon, Sveshnikov, Kalashnikov and everything in between

benonidoni
brilliantboy wrote:
benonidoni wrote:

People that play asAmazing_Player does  has caused me so much frustration in the najdorf and sveshnikov that I was forced to purchase the anti sicilian book (quality chess). At least I now have a heads up on  the BB5 move as the pros suggest a more uncommon move of D6.

More work for us Sicilian fans but he does mention that BB5 gives black the edge. But don't all the writers?


 Really? That's interesting. I would agree that White is naive to think he can get much more than equality if Black knows what he's doing, but certainly wouldn't think Bb5 gives Black an advantage (but then again, I'm a nobody). However, other writers don't agree...Evgeny Sveshnikov for example thinks that 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 e6 (or d6) represents perfect play from both sides

And spare a thought for the work us poor souls who have to face 1...c5 have to do. We have to know what to do against the Najdorf, Scheveningen, Dragon, Accelerated Dragon, Sveshnikov, Kalashnikov and everything in between


 I think whites play in the sicilian is very difficult except he has the white pieces. One reason I tend to like the D4 opening as white. I used to play a  lot of E4 and when c5 was chosen I immediately went into the closed. I thus had to only memorize one line of the sicilian.

benonidoni

Amazing Player why not try the closed sicilian to eliminate massive lines. ONly a couple to know. BE3 and F4?

Amazing_Player
ajedrecito wrote:

3...a6 is met by 4.Bxc6 because Black's doubled c-pawns in conjunction with already-weak dark squares on the queen side constitutes an advantage.

3...Na5 makes little sense and you'll probably never see it. If you do. I would play 4.c3.

3...Qb6 is a move to consider though. After 4.Nc3 White should keep an advantage but this is very playable, I'm a bit surprised you didn't mention it.

3...e5 is too commital and after 4.O-O White has a small advantage.

3...Nd4 4.Nxd4 cxd4 5.O-O has long been known to favor White.

3...d6 4.O-O Bd7 5.Re1 and just play chess.

Your book should give you the other lines.


Thank you for your reply!

 

Yes I missed 3.Qb6 and also 3.Qc7 which are other moves which could be played (I've even seen a few play out in this way).

 

And to answer why I don't play c3 that is because I simply like the move Bb5. When faced with 1. e4 e5 2. nf3 nc6 I play 3. Bb5 and go into the Ruy. I quite like the idea of playing Bb5 versus Sicilian however it does not give me the option to play ...3 a6 4. Ba4 b5 5. Bb3 because of c4. I also am not interested in a closed Sicilian because the reason why I play 1. e4 and not 1. d4 is because I look forward to more open, tactical positions.

 

 

One thing I would like advice on is this position: 

So what to do versus 3.e6 when they have the option to play Nge7 and even maybe in some lines 3.Nce7.

 

 

Is 5. e5!? a good move in this position? It really seems to hinder Black's development. Is this maybe why 3. e6 is not a recommended move? ...4. dcx4 keeps the queenside pawns together however there would be no d pawn for a potentially liberating d5 push in the future. 4. bxc4 captures towards the centre, opens up the b file for rook pressure and allows a supported d5 push in the future allows the light squared bishop to develop onto b7 (which may not be the best square for it to develop to as it would immediately be looking at its own pawn on c6 and also block any potential b file pressure) but comes at the cost of an isolated a pawn.

I suppose that in the Rossolimo White's main idea is probably to trade off bishop for knight where Black's queenside pawns would become weak if 4. dxc6 and if 4. bxc6 there would be doubled b pawns and an isolated a pawn which will become targets in the middlegame and a potential advantage in an endgame? 

The knight on c6 is also contributing to d4 control which was also the main idea behind ...1. c5.

The Rossolimo may well not be White's "best" reply to 1. e4 c5 2. nf3 nc6 but it's certainly playable and I think has a good idea behind it!

quadrewple

3.e5 seems viable as well

kwaloffer
Amazing_Player wrote:
I also am not interested in a closed Sicilian because the reason why I play 1. e4 and not 1. d4 is because I look forward to more open, tactical positions.

I don't think you really do. The Open Sicilian (3.d4) is much more open and tactical than the Rossolimo (or the Ruy Lopez), but you avoid it.

Texesa

learn from a sicilian called Rossolimo. problem solved! Next

yusuf_prasojo

Open Sicilian is the best. If you don't like it, it is probably because of the many possible complexities of the variations. The Rossolimo exchanges one piece (which is an attacking asset in the open line), making the game simpler and less risky. If it is so, then why not play the Grand Prix Attack?