Is the Wilkes-Barre/Traxler Busted? Probably

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sloughterchess
chessowns wrote:

 6.Nxf7 Kxf7 7.dxc6ch+-


sloughterchess

Good news for Wilkes-Barre/Traxler fans! I think I cooked my own innovation. This is somewhat surprising because it was analyzed and approved by Fritz 8, the critical variation analyzed by Senior Life Master Andrew Karklins was cooked and the thread has had numerous attempts to demonstrate equality but never succeeded. The solution to the cook of 8.Nf3 is simple---attack!

Conquistador

I would be interested in your continued contributions to the Traxler Analysis Group Gonnosuke, especially with the real problem line being 6.Bb3, with a couple nasty side lines for black.

sloughterchess

4.Ng5 Bc5 5.Bxf7ch Ke7 6.Bd5 d6 7.Bxc6 bxc6 8.Nf3 Bg4 9.d3 Rf8 10.Be3 Bxe3 11.Bxe3 Qe8 13.Nbd2/Qe2/O-O-O or O-O +/-

Conquistador
sloughterchess wrote:

4.Ng5 Bc5 5.Bxf7ch Ke7 6.Bd5 d6 7.Bxc6 bxc6 8.Nf3 Bg4 9.d3 Rf8 10.Be3 Bxe3 11.Bxe3 Qe8 13.Nbd2/Qe2/O-O-O or O-O +/-


I smell a rat.  Where did the extra dark square bishop for white come from?

ozzie_c_cobblepot

A thematic tournament among trained centaurs would be revealing. A thematic tournament with just random dudes and dudettes would not.

sloughterchess

try 11.fxe3 :)

Conquistador

Okay, I think I have found a way for black against 8.Nf3.

1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.Ng5 Bc5 5.Bxf7+ Ke7 6.Bd5 Rf8 7.Bxc6 dxc6 8.Nf3 Nxe4!

I think this move is critical otherwise black is losing a lot of time playing a move like 8...Kf7.

9.Qe2 Nxf2 10.Rf1 Qd6! this is the only move that holds.  Two tries by white.

11.d3 Ng4?

This move comes very close to working.  Unfortunately it is refuted by:

12.Nc3! Be6 13.Ne4 Qd5 14.Bd2 b5 15.0-0-0 Bd6 16.Nc3 Qc5 17.h3 Nf6 18.Be3 Qb4 19.a3 Qa5 20.Bd4!! b4 21.Nxe5 Qa6 22.axb4 and black is in trouble.

A better try is

11...Bg4 12.Bg5+ Kd7! and black is all right.

13.Rxf2 Bxf2+ 14.Qxf2 Bxf3 15.gxf3 Rf5 16.Be3 Qb4+ 17.c3 Qb5 18.c4 Qa5+ 19.Qd2 Qxd2+ 20.Nxd2 Rh5 21.Bg1 Rd8 22.Ne4 b6 and I think the position is equal as white has adequate compensation for black's extra pawn.

White tried to improve with 11.Nc3

11.Nc3 Bg4 12.Rxf2 Bxf2+ 13.Qxf2 Bxf3 14.gxf3 Qf6 15.b3 Kd7 16.Ba3 Rf7 17.0-0-0 Qxf3 18.Qh4 h6 and black is looking good in the endgame.

This is certainly a rough variation for black if he is not prepared.  There are probably improvements available, but black should only put hope in 8...Nxe4 unless 8...Kf7 is shown to be good.  I think with best play black can hold.

I will check out 6.Bd5 d6 for black's resources.

Conquistador

Here is a link to Sloughter's book "Magic".  Some of the annotations are pretty hilarious, especially when he says that the philidor is refuted after 3.d4! +-

A bit much I have to say.

http://www.correspondencechess.com/moody.html

sloughterchess

The Traxler/Wilkes-Barre is probably the one variation of the Two Knights' Defense that leads to equality with best play by both sides. This is based on my "gut" reaction that any player who can make as aggressive an attacking move as 4...Bc5 and only lose one pawn in the best variation is much closer to equal than any real advantage for White. Whenever a variation like 8.Nf3 winds up with a big advantage, you know there is something terribly wrong with Black's play. My "cook" of my own variation gives just the "right" amount of advantage i.e. winnable at the class level by either side who don't know how to play Rook endgames, but all but unwinnable at GM level. However, someone needing the full point at the end of a tournament would clearly play a long time trying to conjure up a win from an ending a competent player should hold pretty easily with the Black pieces.

Conquistador

In your "cook" of your innovation, I believe that white has a stronger plan.

1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.Ng5 Bc5 5.Bxf7+ Ke7 6.Bd5 Rf8 7.Bxc6 dxc6 8.Nf3 Bg4 9.d3 Qe8 10.Be3 Bxe3 11.fxe3 Qh5 12.Nbd2 Nd7 13.Qe2!? with the idea of h3 Bxf3 Nxf3 followed by Kd2! or 0-0-0.

8...Bg4 9.d3 Qe8 seems to be a nice resource for black though.

sloughterchess

I kind of wondered about that at the time. It seemed that maybe Fritz could try to double its Rooks on the f-file, Queen on e2 and maybe be able to play something like Nh2? It doesn't seem that Black can increase the pressure more except by somehow bringing the Knight on d7 into play before White can break the bind. Maybe Kd2 is okay---haven't worked out the tactics.

My main point was that White has "too" much advantage after 8.Nf3 Nxe4 (Clearly it is better at a practical level to play 8...Nxe4 than give White a protected passed as Fritz did.) In the "internal harmony" of chess Black must have missed something. By about move 20, White, in my opinion, shouldn't be getting an advantage more than about +/=. If he is, I suspect you'll find that Black is missing some resource.

Conquistador

Maybe, but I think that with the above line, black is a sitting duck.  White really does not have any weaknesses to target, while white can simply build up the pressure until black cracks.  The center is very strong for white which is why I suggest Kd2 so that white can contest the queenside as well.  It seems that black is simply reacting to white's play with a lack of a plan.  In addition, black is fairly awkward with his pieces, he is in no position to begin a attack.  This is why Nxe4 appeals to me much more as I see that black gets more active counterplay and white has less advantage than the above line.  Black retains winning chances.

sloughterchess

Here is the first game I ever played against Fritz 10; it cooks one of the subvariations of the WBT. Black has no play in those lines where it plays Kf7, but Fritz 10 varied from Fritz 8.

Conquistador

Again I think that 6...Qe8 is the crucial move here instead of 6..Rf8.

sloughterchess

The trouble with 6.Bd5 Qe8, is again, 7.Bxc6 bxc6 (dxc6+/-) 8.Qe2 Qg6 10.Rf1 Rf8 9.d3 h6 10.Nf3 d6 11.Nc3 Kf7 12.Nh4 +/=)

Conquistador

I would be happy to play some games with 6...Qe8.

5.Bxf7+ Ke7 6.Bd5 Qe8 7.Bxc6 bxc6 and I have a position ready to attack.  Black will get damage the white kingside at some point or win a pawn back.

sloughterchess

     GM Alburt looked at the line played by Fritz 10 and concluded that White is much better after 8.Ne4 Kf7 9.d3 Kg8 10.Be3 Bd6 & here Lev said that either 11.Nbd2 Bg4 12.h3 Bh5 13.g4 Nxg4 14.hxg4 Bxg4 15.Rg1 +/- or Bxg4 14.hxg4 Nxg4 is +/- or just 11.h3 is +/- (Actually Fritz 10 says it is +- after either 13.Nxg4 or Bxg4, but to retreat is hopeless, too, when Fritz claims that 14...Bf7 15.Ng5 is "only" +/- at first, but after 15.Nxf7 Qxf7 16.c3 Nd7 17.Qb3 Nc5 18.Qxf7ch Kxf7 19.Ke2 +-)

     My point is that it took me about 50 moves to get a slightly favorable position against Fritz 10---it took a GM only a handful of moves to get to close to a winning position; this just underscores why Black, to achieve any practical chances, has to play 8...Bg4 or 8...Nxe4. The former leads to a positional struggle where only White has winning chances. The latter offers some practical chances to equalize simply because there are more ways for White to go wrong.

     In the other two lines I looked at with Lev, 8...Bg4, he felt that in the game I played against Fritz 10 that the position is probably +/= i.e. 8.Nf3 Bg4 9.d3 Qe8 10.Be3 Bxe3 11.fxe3 Rf6 12.h3 Qh5 13.Rf1 Bxf3 14.Nxf3 R8f8 Now, according to Lev, White is slightly better are either 15.Qd2 or 15.Qe2. "with some, but not full compensation, for the pawn" This is what I concluded independently as well.

Conquistador

Again as we have already concluded, 8.Nf3 Nxe4 was critical.

sloughterchess

     As I indicated 8...Nxe4 offers practical chances. I think if you plug it into a strong computer, it will be +/- in all variations by move 25.