KID or Dutch?

i'm having some issues trying to decide on a response for 1. d4 as black.

i used to play the slav (1. d4 d5 2. c4 c6) with generally good results, but i really didn't like the type of middle games it would lead to.

i have been giving the benoni/benko (1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 c5 (3. d5 b5)) a try, but so far it's not working out very well.

now i'm giving the king's indian defense (1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6) a whirl to see how i like it. i'm also considering trying out the dutch (stonewall variation) (1. d4 f5 2. c4 (e6 3. Nf3 Nf6 4. g3 c6 5. Bg2 d5 6. O-O Bd6)).

between the king's indian defense and the dutch, which one do you prefer and why? it'd be appreciated if you could supply some games as well.

How many world champions played the dutch regularly and how many the KID ? 

is this a rhetorical question?

i don't know the answer (although i'm assuming it's KID). nor am i terribly concerned with the answer because i'm not, nor will i ever be even close to world champion levels. at my level, i'm pretty sure i can play either one with good results.

Plenty of world champions played the Dutch when they were less experienced.  But it is an important consideration.  OP: do you intend to contend for the world championship with this repertoire choice?

Never mind, I see you've answered.

I was perusing your forums this morning, and there's an almost identical question on page three of this forum.  Let me see if this works to put up a link.

http://www.chess.com/forum/view/chess-openings/kid-vs-dutch

thanks for that BlackJon.

Well, the answer might help him decide between the two . I prefer the KID myself as when I played the dutch ( very briefly ) I lost badly too often and this isnt the case with the KID.

thanks for the advice Reb. always good to hear a master's opinion obviously.

I would also recommend the King's Indian, but of course the decision is for you to make. Which opening fits in well with your existing repertoire? What are the kinds of middlegame positions you like to play? These are important considerations to make.

Uhm, if the slav defense gave you good results why are you even considering changing? Obviously you are good at playing the middlegame eventhough you for some reason don't like slav middlegames.

Also consider this. There are alot of anti-dutch lines you have to learn and which take you to positions that are nothing like dutch positions. Good thing about the slav is that there is no real anti slav line but more the other way around. Slav is anti many crap openings.

Stick with the slav and win if you ask me. If you have to choose though I'd say go for the KID but be aware there is alot of theory to know to not get squished by various bayonet attacks cramping your whole position.

i prefer open, tactical games. therefore, i probably would lean towards the dutch in that case.

however, i am pretty comfortable in closed positions as well (since sometimes i really don't have the option to open the game if white doesn't let me). also, i began playing chess as a 1. d4 player (but i've changed to 1. e4) and therefore i do have a decent understanding of closed positions (even though i don't really desire them).

i really could go either way when i'm playing as black.

You should try the Budapest Gambit.  It matches up with the kind of games you like to play, is much easier to "force" than other gambits like the Benko, and is pretty easy to learn.  

The problem for budapest players is  2 Nf3   .....  then what ?

i was probably around 50% with the slav. i really stopped using it because i hated the middle game positions i'd reach. with the pawns all in the middle it makes it difficult to open the position up i'd find.

i feel like the dutch can be much more open and tactical, and i feel like the KID (even though it can be fairly closed position) has more possibilities of opening up later on since i can push some pawns later and try to take advantage of white's "weak" central pawns. at least that is my perception as of now. i just started playing the KID.

switch to pseudo king's indian?

Then I try to transpose to KID.  ;)

OP:  I believe the Dutch and KID share many similarities, i.e. locked central pawn structure with a kingside pawn storm and attack.  If you want an open position, these aren't for you (although obviously they are highly tactical.)

Good choice ! 

yeah but the problem is there aren't many lines for black that can force an open game against 1. d4. suggestions i've had in the past are QGA, grunfeld, or semi-slav.

i'd rather avoid the QG and slav, and i haven't tried the grunfeld, so that is an option as well i guess.

thanks for that filbranden. that is an option as well that i should consider.