Need Help Identifying Chess Opening

Hi everyone,

I could use some help identifying a chess opening.  This is an opening that was taught to me by a childhood friend a long, long time ago.  He learned it from his father (who was apparently a top Israeli player at the time), who told my friend that it was a great opening for kids to play.  The problem is that I only remember the position for one side, and I can't remember if the opening is played by white, black, or could be played by either side.  I do know that it starts with e4 e5.  The key feature was dual knights on the kingside, protecting the castled king.  Since I have a vague recollection of playing it as White, I'll give the position from white's perspective.

White has:

Pawns on e4, f2, g2, h3; Knights on f3 and g3; kingside castling.  The queen, if I remember, stayed on d1 until the opening was completed.  I can't remember where the bishops went, but they are both out.

Obviously, if this was peformed by black, black would have the mirror version:  pawns on e5, f7, g7, h6; knights on f6 and g6, and of course the king castled behind the pawns and knights.

Does this ring a bell to anyone?

The king is tucked away safely, and the two adjacent knights are primed for a kingside attack when the time is right.

I haven't played that opening for probably 30 years, and have been unable to find it anywhere.  I remember that it worked very well for me, though, and with my children now learning how to play, I've been thinking about it.  I'm pretty sure that it is a very minor, lightly played line in one of the major king pawn openings . . . but any info about it would really be appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

Warren

What you have described is rather not enough to identify the opening, and I know chess openings not enough to give the exact answer. Still, I explored some placements of pieces and bishops by ChessAssistant software that uses a very large game database, and found that if the position that you are seeking to identify is completely symmetric, such one can occur in the Italian Game, and in particular in its variation called Giuoco Pianissimo (4. d3). Giuoco Pianissimo means very quiet game.

For example, take a look at the position after nine moves made:

I found in the base other two games with the same position occured, they were not classified as being played by the Italian game, but they contained the same moves made in different orders.

Still, I don't know why I found only three games played in such a way over more than 4 millions. Perhaps because this is an opening to play exactly by kids?

It seems that black can always play in the other way and to avoid this line, but I cannot be exact here. In the example that I've posted here, white have finally won.

Wow--Thanks Paul.  Your post got me off on a related tangent . . . it might actually be the Maroczy system of the four knights, symmetrical version.  I just found this game:

(39) Schlechter - Napier, Four Knights Game [C49]
1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Bb5 Bb4 5.0-0 0-0 6.d3 d6 7.Ne2 Bg4 8.c3 Ba5 9.Ng3 Bb6 10.h3 Nh5 11.hxg4 Nxg3 12.Re1 h5 13.Ng5 d5 14.Qf3 h4 15.Kh2 Qf6 16.Qxf6 gxf6 17.Nh3 Nxe4 18.dxe4 d4 19.g5 fxg5 20.Bxg5 dxc3 21.bxc3 1-0

I think that is pretty much it . . . assuming that it was white that placed his knights on those two adjacent squares, and not black.

Are there more games in your database under c49 that feature a knight to g3?

Perhaps it is good for kids because their games gravitate towards four knights openings, and this gives white a safe plan that black can't interfere with or really prevent.  White then is in a good position to pounce on black's blunders.  White accomplishes everything that children are told to strive for in the opening:  knights are out before bishops, king is castled and safe, there's a pawn center, and the queen can get out easily (maybe after c3).

It seems as though this opening isn't played on the professional level because it is dull and drawable, but kids' games are very, very different.

I found a collection of about 40 games of this opening from a long time ago:

http://www.redhotpawn.com/chess/grandmaster-games/index.php?&openingid=1187&masterplayerid=0&searchmasterplayername=&searchmastergameyear=0&page=1

I think I had not enough competency to meddle, though two other games of three ones that i've found seem to show the possible power of two white knights.

About your question about games with white knights on g3 and f3 played under C49: I explored games having been played under C49 (but over a base of 1500000 games) with moves Nc3-e2-g3 and Nc6-e7-g6 ever played (not always with pawns on e4 and e5), and i found more than 80 such games.

I can recommend you to see the game of Janowsky vs. Schlechter (seeming to be played in the same tournament in Colorado Springs, 1904, as Schlechter vs. Napier) or especially Teichmann vs. Von Bardeleben, Vienna, 1908. It came to the symmetrical position that can be closer to the one that you are seeking for. Both games have been won by white.

Sounds a bit like a Ruy Lopez.

This is the Ruy Lopez Steinitz Defence deferred.

Thanks.  I think that variation of the Ruy Lopez takes too many moves; I remember that the goal was to complete the set up within the first eight or ten moves or so.  I guess you could end up with some sort of hybrid of the two openings--that is, after black threatens the bishop on b5 with  . . . a6, follow up with Ba4, Nc3, d3, Ne2, Ng3, 0-0.  Although, as I look at it, you may have to get an early h3 in there, too, and maybe there just isn't enough time before black attacks.  That's the sort of variation I've been unsucessfully searching for--I don't think that really exists (which suggests that there is something materially wrong with it, of course).

hmmm... Teichmann vs. Bardeleben:

Perhaps this one? It seems that four knights staying on these fields really occur in C49 as i already said.

Thanks Paul.  I think that's got to be it, although I'm surprised that the position seems to mostly occur symmetrically in published games . . . . At least when playing against another kid, it's pretty unlikely to happen. 

The only real difference between these games and Pavlovic-Mihalic (C50) that you posted above seems to be whether you post the bishops on the b file or the c file.  But there were only two games with the bishops on c4/c5; and a lot more with the bishops on b5/b4.

Is there a chess program that will identify openings based on your moves in real time?  So your playing the game and move 15 your not sure what opening your in or what opening your opponent just did?