Nh5 vs Ne8 in the KID, what do you preffer?

Right now Im taking a look at minor lines like 9.Bd2 and 9.Nd2 (Nd2 is way more common than Bd2 and perhaps better).

As usual Black should play f5, so he should unblock his f-pawn, there are different ways to do so and these ways lead to different games.

With 9...Nh5 you will usually have to take on f5 with the e7  knight as if you take with the pawn your knight on h5 will be hanging and tricks with Nxe5 will appear on the board.

With 9...Ne8 you can now take on f5 with a pawn but this choice is less active than Nh5 as from h5 your knight could, in some cases jump to f4.

Here is a diagram to illustrate your minds.

An interesting part in the development of this variation was the Fischer vs Taimanov match, because I dont have acess to a good database this are the oldest games I know with this variation. (The are probably older games which I would like to see)

Taimanov's idea was to play Ng5-Ne6, sacing a pawn, it is rare that my MCO version gives that line as equal and is the one suggested, one would think improvements would have been found on all these years.

This is the main line as far as I recall, also known as Mar del Plata, introduced by Korchnoi, in the 1970s.

True, 9.Ne1-Nd3 was played back then, for the most part, but I like 9.a4!. Obviously.

Neither Nh5 nor Ne8.  Give me 9...Nd7 if you play 9.Bd2.

Against 9.Nd2, I don't move the Knight at all because it's not good.  Black should play 9...a5 or 9...c5.

The Mainline right now, well I dont know.

It can be the Taimanov Kozul Gambit lines or the Bayonet Attack which I think is losing ground.

Nd7 blocks the bishop from looking at e6 in this line which is not a good thing, that is why I didnt mention it. 

9...Ne8  gives the extra option for Black to keep the knight at e8 and kick the knight from g5 with h6 to later continue like a Bayonet Attack with c6, trying to play d5 undermining White's center.

Altough both usually transpose, as there are not many ways to take advantage of the move order.

Yeah, it goes like it, in most variations where Nh5 is allowed the mainline is usually considered Nh5 but I wanted to hear opinions, I would personally play Ne8 just to get to capture with the g-pawn altough I am not sure it is the best theoritical line.

I havent studied those lines (next one I will take a look after Bd2 ) but I know that Bologan recommends 9...a5 and the somewhat rare 9...c6 (one idea being to play b5) too.

Seems like a move like 9...Ne8 runs into b4 when White gets c5 too quickly and Black can't get so greedy as e4 is correclty defended (if compared with the 9.Ne1 lines)

Op doesn't know his a$$ from a hole in the ground, just sayin.

Seems like Erik1985 has created a new account with the sole purpose of offending me, pretty interesting.

Get a life please. You would do us a favour.

Yes Morphy, I have studied master games and I still think that 9...Ne8 is better than 9...Nd7 in this position.

And no, what I said is not bulshevick.

9...Ne8 is probably slightly better, it keeps options open for Black.

After 9...Nd7 10.Rc1 f5 11.Ng5 you are forced to move the knight.

After 9...Ne8 10.Rc1 f5 11.Ng5 you are not forced to move the knight.

Again, both moves usually transpose (you will play Nf6 most of the time) but in my opinion is better to keep options open.

You should also take in consideration that from e8 the knight may in some day go to g7 and e6 or to c7 and to e6, so again, I think 9...Ne8 is probably better than Nd7 in this position (I agree with you that in other lines Nd7 is thematic and the main move, for example in the Taimanov lines where the knight does good on covering c5.)

Lol, just ignore that troll, he has already made 2 accounts in the same day posting the same things on my profile.

You know guys, Im starting to look faith in this line, results are demoralizing for White, Black gets a perfect game, specially on the lines with Nxf5 which I am starting to like more. Seems like Ng5-Ne6 is not good enough.

However, Taimanov's improvement for the second game with the Qb3 idea still caughts my attention. Seems like the following line hasnt been investigated that much and it offers some room for creativity.

I have been taught that when White takes on f5 with exf5, Black should generally take back with the g-pawn in order no to get a slight positional disadvantage.

That's why I play Nh5 in the bayonet variation only, because White's b-pawn being in b4, the Knight in c3 would be hanging if White plays 9.b4 Nh5 10.Re1 f5 11.exf5 gxf5 12.Nxe5? Bxe5 13.Bxh5 Bxc3 which is not the case in the 9.Bd2 variation where I play the old fashioned ...Nd7 instead of ...Ne8 transposing in the classical variation (I guess, memories...).

PS: +1 regarding ThrillerFan's # 8

The slight positional disadvantage sounds like a nice story Merovwig, but there is no way to take advantage of it.

Or is it? Can you prove white can make use of the e4 square and get an advantage? 

And even then, Ne8 would be better as I said in other posts, so I disagree with ThrillerFan and your +1.

I find that usually the knight on f5 and a knight comming to f4 give Black enough activity to compensate for the slight weakening of e4.

For example, look at the mainlien given by the MCO which I dont think is the mainline or was the mainline as it seems dangerous for White:

In many (most?) lines of the King's Indian Nf6-d7 is stronger than either Nh5 or Ne8.