Ruy lopez middlegame plans.

@1

In the closed Ruy Lopez the main plan is to prepare d4.
After that white usually gets a violent attack with his light square bishop at b3 or c2 and with the knight re-routed Nb1-d2-f1-g3/e3-f5/h5.
In the exchange variation the plan is to neutralise black's bishop's pair and win the endgame with the king's side pawn majority.
It depends of course on what black plays: you often have to shift plans.
Here is a Fischer win in the closed variation:
https://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1008423 
And here is a Fischer win in the exchange variation:
https://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1044389 
Here is a Nepomniachtchi win with the closed variation:
https://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=2476852 
And here is a Giri win with the delayed exchange variation:
https://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=2041840 

White's queen knight typically goes from b1 to g3, it doesn't get "rerouted". Nc3 is actually a great square for the knight in the ruy lopez if the c3 square isn't taken by the pawn.

You can try playing the d3 variation. It has 3 clear plans - 1. Push the a flank pawn to create a weakness or, 2. Open the centre with d4 later or 3. Launch a kingside attack.

My Gosh - Your asking a very broad question for 1 of the most theoretical lines in chess.

What are some middle game plans in Ruy Lopez? Is a very vague and loaded question.

I think it would be better if you showed a position for example.

#4 will definitely look into it. Thanks

@Post #6

The d3 variation isn’t the greatest Ruy Lopez line.

The mainline is 100% better in almost every situation except like 2.

- I would play d3 if my opponent is playing Berlin Defense because if I was to play the mainline. We would end up in the Berlin Wall Endgame position which is a Queenless position.

‘Some people love playing it, but I don’t really like it.
- I would play d3 if my opponent is playing Arc Angel Defense because the line Black is playing is trying to bring intense pressure on to the e4 pawn. If I play mainline with d2 to d4, the e4 pawn might fall due to how black is playing which is why d3 supporting the e4 pawn with a pawn is a better way of playing the position.

————————

@Post #4

He basically said for white to play on Queenside, Center, & Kingside.

He is basically saying to play everywhere on the board.

The truth is white can play anywhere on the board, BUT what black plays matters!

Depending on what your opponent does it can affect what side of the board white plays on.

——————————

For the above reasons, I asked on post #5 if their was a position the OP was talking about.

If your opponent is playing a very specific variation, it could be better to show it.

What you do against that line could be different vs. another line so yeah.

Buy a book on it and play over GM games (especially the ones that White wins).

I wholeheartedly disagree. 4. d3 against the Berlin is every bit as good as actually playing the Berlin, 5. d3 (Anderssen) with the possibility of 6. c4 (Duras Anderssen) forces Black to both completely adapt his entire structure–without sacrificing any theoretical strength–and abandon plans of playing sidelines defenses such as the Open or Neo-Arkhangelsk, 6. d3 (Martinez) is every bit as solid as the mainline 6. Re1 and can transpose back into mainlines or continue along independent theoretical lines as long as White wasn't planning 7. c3 and allowing the Marshall Attack, 7. d3 is a stable way to enter the Pilnik Closed Morphy or Anti-Marshall while disallowing the Marshall Attack, and 7. h3 is a fantastic waiting move that allows White to transpose back into the Closed Morphy with 7... d6 8. c3 while simultaneously giving White the opportunity to meet Black's waiting 7... Bb7 with 8. d3 which solidifies the e4 pawn against both the LSB on the long diagonal and the d5 push Black has prepared.

These are all equally strong (by engine and human standards) options to the Marshall and Anti-Marshall mainlines which are so common these days and require a much higher emphasis on intuitive positional play and tactical awareness as opposed to theory-dense engine line preparation.

@Post #9

I don’t think you understood what I said.

I said the mainline Ruy Lopez is better vs. majority of lines black can play except 2.

Than I gave the 2 excepts:

- Berlin Defense

- Arch Angel Defense lines

You quoted me!

Than you said you disagree with me because the d3 line is great vs. Berlin & Arch Angel lines.

It seems to me like several of your statements are agreeing with me not disagreeing.

My apologies. Allow me to be a bit more clear.

We agree that the d3 lines are strong against the Berlin and Arkhangelsk defenses.

However, I disagree with you that the Mainlines of the Ruy Lopez (8. c3 allowing the Marshall and 8. a4 for the Anti-Marshall) is stronger than the sidelines (deviating from mainline to play the Anderssen with 5. c3 or the Martinez with 6. d3 or playing a more modern Closed Morphy with 8. d3 or 8. h3), as it is my view that at best 8. c3 is slightly worse/equal to all the lines listed above while 8. a4 is equal to them, while at worst both are noticeably worse in practice if not in theory.

My issue with playing the Mainlines (especially with 8. c3) is that that is keystone prep for a Black player. If you play 8. c3, your Spanish repertoire must consist of the: Berlin, Jaenisch, Open, Neo-Arkhangelsk, Moller, Arkhangelsk, Marshall Attack, and the four main Closed Morphy variations. All of those tend to be incredibly deep, high-maintenance lines with modern GM analysis readily available. The same is true to a lesser extent of the Anti-Marshall, as you may occasionally face 7... d6 entering the Closed Morphy early where 8. a4 is still playable against 7... d6 to exit well-tread paths both solidly and early.

Meanwhile, if you play 5. c3, the only 3 lines you have to worry about are: 4. d3 Berlin, 4. d3 Jaenisch, and 5. d3 Anderssen lines.
If you play 6. d3 you have Berlin, Jaenisch, Neo-Arkhangelsk, Open, and Martinez.
If you play 8. d3 or 8. h3 you at least avoid the Closed Morphy variations and the Marshall/Anti-Marshall.
All of these lines are rock-solid while also being relative unknowns, with few sample games and more positional and less forcing middlegames making them harder to prep against.

The move 8.h3 isn’t a sideline.

It is a high class waiting move with a transpositional idea behind it.

It is played to discourage the Marshall.

I would classify 8.h3 as the Modern Mainline.

I would classify 8.c3 as the Old Mainline.

Look at the above diagram and compare it to below one:

It is the same position.

The main plan is actually the same as in the Italian: To gain central control via c2-c3 and d2/d4. But there are countles devialtions from that router, according to Black's approach.

If you can find an older book named "Mastering the Spanish" by GM Danny King and Pietro Ponzetto, get it. It does a fine job explaining the positional/strategic elements of this opening.

After looking closely at database lines, statistics and computer analysis, I've come to believe that unless black plays the two knights or white plays the Evan's Gambit or something the Italian is really just a worse Ruy Lopez. Even at the highest level where you assume players know what they're doing (so they might try to surprise with the Italian instead of the typical Ruy Lopez) - they still statistically do better playing the Ruy Lopez. It's too bad for the history of openings and all, but it would mean the Italian just shouldn't be played.

@Post #14

From a Strong player perspective what you said about the Ruy Lopez is mostly true.

From a Beginner player perspective the Italian Game is still considered better.

Its better because it’s less complicated and easier for beginners to play.

While I agree that 8. h3 is essentially the Modern Mainline, 8... d6 isn't common.

The best move is 8... Bb7, responding to the waiting response with yet another waiting move, where 9. d3 is overwhelmingly most common. From here, Black can play 9... d6 and have a closed structure (though not a Closed Morphy) or 9... d5 and have an open structure (though not a Marshall), and in either case White retains a very minor advantage.

@15

"From a Beginner player perspective the Italian Game is still considered better.
Its better because it’s less complicated and easier for beginners to play."
++ Disagree. Italian is more complicated and harder for beginners to play.
3 Bb5 is straightforward: deny Nc6 control over d4 and e5.
For beginners I would recommend the exchange variation 4 Bxc6 or the delayed exchange variation 6 Bxc6. Those are most clear: better pawn structure versus bishop's pair.
3 Bc4 with 4 d3 and 5 c3 leads to slow maneuvering games,
where a beginner is lost and has no clue what to do.

#17 I feel lost in ruy lopez more often compared to italian.

@Post #16

After 8.h3, The move 8…d6 is fine move transposing the lines back into the main closed Ruy López lines.

After 8.h3, if Black decides to play 8…Bb7, Black position is transforming into an Arch Angel Defense with the moves Be7 & h3 inserted into the line.

Here is the position on a diagram

I will do same position with the normal Arch Angel move order

In the above position, If white plays h3 and black castles, we reach same position.

The difference is most people don’t play h3 on move 8 vs. the normal move order line.

They play different move Nc3, a4, Be3, Bg5, or c3.

—————————

Keep in mind, their are also 2 ways of playing the Arch Angel Defense.

1 line is with Bishop on c5

2 line is with Bishop on e7

Each line has pros and cons, but yeah the move 8…Bb7 isn’t really a waiting move.

Its trying to transpose the line into an Arch Angel line.

If you listen to Black side players, they will say it’s an improved version of Arch Angel line.

That is what they are arguing.

If you listen to White side players, they will say the move h3 is fine because they will have needed to make loft move for their king anyway.

That is what they are arguing.

If Black plays 9…d5 (Be7 line), the position has 82% draw rate so it seems to me like neither side are really losing in that spot.

————————

Even if we was to believe that Black position is better, it still doesn’t seem good enough to win.

White position is very solid.

I would argue the regular Arch Angel move order gives Black better winning chances.

————————

Anyway, That is why they are playing 9.d3.

The Arch Angel no matter the version attacks e4.

You combine the Bishop on b7 with Knight on f6 + Rook on e8 + Queen on e7.

It causes to much pressure on e4 pawn.

More attacking pieces vs. defending pieces will cause e4 pawn to fall so they have to play d3.

@Post #17

The Ruy López is more complicated vs. Italian Game.

It might not seem like it is on the surface, but it actually is very complex.

Far more complex vs. Italian Game which is why they tell betters to start with Italian Game and eventually work their way up to Ruy Lopez.