Sokolsky Anyone?

I guess this would have to be answered by someone who plays this opening a lot...

If Black doesn't block with a6 or c6 AFTER white has played 2.Bb2, should white push the b pawn?   At what point should white push this pawn to b5? 

(I've ordered Play 1b5!  Shock Opponent but will have to wait on the USPS) 

Could be that no one plays this, so I'll have to wait for the book.  The MAN, Bobby Fischer, played it on occasion; well once anyway.  ;-)

Will take a shot at my own question. . . usually white shouldn't push that b pawn if and until black bring his N out, to Nc6, THEN push it to run off or soon capture the N.  Let the b pawn be a ticking time bomb that holds that N in place. 

Not some urgent kind of question, since in the most testing line for white the b-pawn goes south: 1.b4 e5 2.Bb2 Bxb4 3.Bxe5 Nf6. White alternatives are not appetizing.

Thanks Pfren.  You're right, often 2...Bxb4    But in the games I play with it, Black is suspicious of that move and sees that white will probably take as you said with

3.Bxe5, so Black does something to protect that first, like f6, d6 or even Qf6.  Then I think, should I push to b5 right there? to block his N coming out?  or 3.a3 to protect my b pawn?    Great to see a 2300+ player pipe in, thanks again.  Have you ever tried the Sokolsky?  Your thoughts on it?   It's sure fun for my level and gets them off the beaten track. 

I spent some time looking at 1b4 and  1d4 b5 a while back

The question you ask is a good one. The conclusion I came to was in general in agreement with the old rule about capturing towards the centre with bc and when the b pawn was stabbed by a4 (a5) to bypass it with b4 for black and b5 for white

As one that has played the Sokolsky a good 100 to 200 times as White in Over the Board competition, here's how to look at the b-pawn:

1) Against 1...e5, don't protect it.  Attack the e-pawn.  After 1.b4 e5 2.Bb2 Bxb4 (Black's best try at equalizing) 3.Bxe5 Nf6 4.c4 (the other option is 4.e3/5.Nf3 going for fast development but completely relinquishing the center to Black), White gave up a wing pawn for a center pawn with an open diagonal for his Bishop.  If Black plays 2...d6 instead of 2...Bxb4, then 3.c4 with Nf3, e3, d4, etc with similar play to what White does in a King's Indian.  If Black plays 2...f6, the gambit is all fun and games for White, and a massive headache for Black.  Not a refutation, but Black will be on defense for ever after 1.b4 e5 2.Bb2 f6 3.e4! Bxb4 4.Bc4 Ne7 and now 5.f4 or 5.Qh5+.

2) If Black plays a more closed setup without c6, then advance b5 when you have to an not before that!  For example, 1.b4 e6 2.Bb2 (no need to advance now, if Black takes on b4, then 3.Bxg7 wins the Rook) Nf6 3.b5 (only now was 3...Bxb4 a threat, and remember, when given the choice to advance or protect, 99% of the time the correct answer is advance when it comes to that b-pawn). 

3) When you play b5, consider b5 your strongpoint and don't volintarily trade it on c6 or a6.  Reload with a4 or c4, and make Black take you.  Make his Queenside Development be as difficult as physically possible!  That's where your advantage is, on the Queenside!

Hope this helps.

f7f6 by black can blunt the b2 bishop in the soklosky

nice to see 2 f6 by black in the first two games

2...f6 also weakens Black's King!  If White isn't a pansy and avoids 3.a3 (even 3.b5 is better, though not best) and plays the strong 3.e4!, gambitting the pawn, Black has to defend very accurately just to survive.  This is probably not the best line to play in correspondence, but in over the board play, it works - trust me!

Even Tartakower has two famous wins with this line, one against Reti and one against Colle (both are available at 365chess.com).  They played different 6th moves, but the gambit line runs 1.b4 e5 2.Bb2 f6 3.e4! Bxb4 4.Bc4 Ne7 5.f4 d5 6.exd5 and now Reti played 6...Bd6 and Colle played 6...exf4.  Both got brutally beaten!

yeam moving f pawns early is dodgy esp as black but it can serve a purpose , e4 tho eh thats just naughty but nice lol

Thanks all.  I've just tried this opening about 10 times, and often, Black does play 2.f6. (I'm 8-1-1 with it so far...course at my level, that may not say much)    So I may try 3.e4 next time.  That's what Fischer did in his game, playing as White.(I'm sure he must have studied Mr. Tartakower's game.)     He also moved 4.Bc4.   And he checked with Qh5+.  Mr. Fischer went on to mate black on the 19th move!  lol   Amazing. 

"All chess players should have a hobby." 

"It's always better to sac your opponent's pieces." 

              S. Tartakower

Just a funny follow-up...   In one game, I played

b4, he played g5, I then played Bb2 and he played Bg7 ???!    Either he was trying to mirror my moves or trying to play King's Indian and got the order mixed up.   lol   I let him take the move back and we resumed.   

¡Por favor, sea relevante, útil y agradable!

no no sicilianka gg

According to all top engines after 3.Bxe5 Nf6, white is around -0.1 to -0.3 worse. Let's try to understand why:

1) Black has two pieces developed to white's one. In addition, white's bishop on e5 will have to lose another tempo.

2) In the upcoming middlegame, white lacks a plan. Black's development is comparably easier and he has strong central pieces and can occupy the center with pieces (Nf6, Re8) or pawns (c5,d5).

What does white have going for him? Not much, really. But he's more solid and has the open long diagonal which he can use to his benefit. There is no reason why white should be better.

Just didn't really understand the terminology of "black's best try at equalizing." If anyone's equalizing, it should be white.

1.b4 isn't the way to go for an advantage, anyway. 1.b3 is much better.

Again, that's why 1.a3 makes sense, in case of 1...d5 white can play 2.b4, and now the pawn is protected, and on 2...e5 white can play Bb2, on 1...e5 from black he can choose between the sicilian set-up or even 2.e4 ( it's not such a bad move ).

He does have an extra central pawn.