Spanish vs Italian

@Godsoriginalfool

Nah you're no idiot at all.  Easy to make quick comments online, it happens!  Thanks. 

The Spanish used to be called the Queen's Gambit of the Kingside Openings.

Where DID you find this thread?

spanish

I think the Italian is more accurate than the Spanish, as it attacks black's weakest square in the open games (f7) while 3.Fb5 is a pseudo-threat on the e5 pawn as black can regain the e4 pawn with interest : ...a6 4.Bxc6 dxc6 5.Nxe5 Qd4 ! 

Generally against 3.Bc4 Nf6 I play 4.Bb5 to attempt a reversed transposition to the Berlin Endgame or the Berlin Wall and against 3.Bc4 Bc5 I play 3.d4 the Italian Gambit and usually try to transpose to a Scotch Game: Scotch Gambit / Haxo Gambit after Ng5 Nh6 Nxf7 Nxf7 Bxf7+ Kxf7 Qh5+ ... Qxc5

Both are fine.

The Italian has less theory, and can be played either aggressively, or positionally (you can answer 3...Bc5 witrh the traditional c3 and d4, or with the Evans gambit, or with the Dubov gambit (4.c3 Nf6 5.d4 exd4 6.b4!?), or finally with the slow Italian with d2-d3).

White has no objective advantage in the Italian, but the same can be said about the Ruy.

Ah, pfren, usually I agree with you, but not here. White has no objective advantage in the Italian, but the same *cannot* be said about the Ruy Lopez. Of course chess is a draw after any sound opening by black, but the Spanish has just enough of an annoying, nagging, long-lasting "pull" that when the draw is finally agreed black is usually grateful white did not keep trying. The downside of the Spanish is twofold: (1) requires excellent tactics AND excellent strategy from white, whereas many players are only good at one or the other; (2) black has a ton of reasonable tries so white needs to know a ton of theory to apply any pressure.

If we look at two simple early positions, 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc3 Nf6 4.d3 Bc5 versus 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 Nf6 4.d3 Bc5, the Spanish version has many (admittedly tiny, and not additive) advantages: ...Nc6-a5 is not a "threat", ...Bc8-e6 doesn't offer a trade, ...d6-d5 is much harder to arrange (Pe5 needs guarding and Bb5xc6 damage needs to be considered), ...Rf8-e8 and/or ...Qd8-d7 are self-pins, maybe others. In the Spanish, equality is so close and yet so far away.

Even Carlsen's Marshall Gambit, GMs may know precisely how to draw these pawn down positions, but is that the same as true equality?

Going back to the ton of theory idea -- this is black's compensation! Pick one good defense (or even a not-so-good defense!?), learn it inside/out, and prey on the many, many, lazy players who haven't done their homework with white. But don't look at me, I gave up the Ruy Lopez for white a long time ago and now only use it against players I know are not really 1...e5 players.

italian is good but spainish is sooo good and kings gambit

is good