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Thoughts on the Colle-Zukertort?

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x-9359487958

What do you guys think about the Colle-Zukertort?

I am looking mostly for flaws in it, but pros are also helpful!grin.png

x-9359487958

I like this opening because i used to be a colle player, but I hated when my bishop on d3 was kicked away by a pawn on c4.

ThrillerFan

A number of things to keep in mind:

 

1) There should have been no issue with ...c4.  If you used to play the Colle Koltanowski, the Bishop could easily go to c2.  If you failed to play either c3 or b3 in response to ...c5, that's your own fault!

2) The Colle is not an "all-purpose" opening.  If you are trying to make it into some kind of all purpose opening, you will fail!

 

The Colle requires the following to be effective:

 

A) First and Foremost, BlACK MUST HEM IN HIS OWN BISHOP!  Without out, the Colle's totally useless!

 

After 1.d4 d5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.e3 e6, you are good, but after 3...Bf5 or 3...Bg4, White has nothing better than 4.c4 (4.c3 or 4.Bd3 are horrible and give White ZILCH) and now 4...c6 is the Slow Slav.  After 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 g6, the move 3.e3 is useless.  Either 3.c4 or something that works against the Fianchetto Structure, like 3.Bg5 (Torre Attack) are more effective.

 

It also fails against Benoni setups, like 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 c5, the move 3.e3 is ineffective.  Play 3.d5 and 4.Nc3 (no c4, use that square for the Knight on f3 via d2.

 

2) Black actually needs to be playing active with moves like ...c5 and ...d5.  If Black is playing extremely passive, then why are you playing a passive opening like the Colle?  1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 d6 3.e3?! c6 4.Bd3 is really ineffective.  Black is doing nothing to fight for the center, you need to take it over!  Doesn't matter that you play the Colle against mainstream defenses.  This ain't mainstream.  Adjust and destroy Black!

 

3) The Zukertort may be more aggressive than the Koltanowski, but again, that means that Black has to comply and advance his pawns, like to d5.  Otherwise, what does White's moves do?  They don't open up lines as there are no Black pawns to trade them with and open up the diagonals for your Bishops on b2 and d3.

x-9359487958
Thank you @ThrillerFan for your input, it really helps! :)
penandpaper0089

1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 d6 3.e3 isn't a mistake... Usually they play it to go into a reversed King's Indian attack.

 

Yigor

Is it necessary to think about it ?!? grin.png

Yigor

Colle-Zukertort ?!? The first game in this database is Blackburne-Chigorin (1881) blitz.png:

https://www.chess.com/games/view/2302

Yigor
crolisto wrote:

@Yigor hahaha that was a good one. Colle, London or Queenspawn Openings don't require thinking about the moves. Just play 20 moves standard plans. Just ignore everything your opponent does.

 

Yeah, there are openings like that. In the Modern defense, U can play g6, d6, a6, Bg7, Nf6 and O-O vs almost everything. wink.png

FaceCrusher

Just took it up not long ago. 

Right now, it is my favorite opening, the one I play the most confidently, and probably one of the more solid openings for someone not having a strong expert or master vision and tactical ability. It has always been safe but solid, low risk but capable of great attack. If I met someone I didn't know, and had to play them in chess for the fate of the universe, they could be a beginner or a Grandmaster, I'd play either Nimzo Larsen or the Colle - Zugertort variation if possible. Both are very similar in opening families. 

Also, we are people with limited time. If you want to play e4, you have to first know the open game bullshit, with the differing genius, families and trees of four knights, piano, pins, knight to d5/d4 tricks, and countless hundres of ways to screw up without barely drawing a breath. Once you navigate that minefield, great, now you have the Sicilian you have to deal with, and a family of variations literally large enough to fill a library. Then, the french, Scandinavian, caro kann, and pirc.  That's if you don't play the Ruy Lopez, which itself could be a whole lifetime of study. 

Or you could go Queen Gambit, and have a great solid opening, still, with a cosmos of possible thorns to deal with. 

Or you could go Colle....and after a few modest weeks understanding the pawn structure, weak and strong squares, typical motifs and plans, and some training, you could be set up against any normal person "who plays chess" for the rest of your life. With a year of study, you'd probably be about as ready for tournament chess as you're going to get. And...it's studied far less than the "mainline" openings. So while the weeks before a tournament everyone spent untold manhours on their Sicilians, Ruys, Gambits, Indians, and so forth, you come in and sidestep most of it, and play on a field you've almost certainly got more training in. Leaving you most time for Endgame, Planning, Strategy, tactics, and more Endgame training.

I cannot recommend the Colle enough. Don't take our word for it. Go get a couple books off amazon, tool around for a few hours in your database, get your engine out, and play for a few days with it. Come back and tell us that you love it, because you will. 

Merovwig

If you want general ideas on or against the Colle-Zukertort, you may have a look at The Zukertort system: a guide for Black and White by IM Bogdanovich.

 

Excerpts are probably available online.

kindaspongey

https://web.archive.org/web/20140627131000/http://www.chesscafe.com/text/hansen143.pdf