Chess - Play & Learn


FREE - In Google Play

FREE - in Win Phone Store


What to do against this move order?

  • #1

    I sometimes run into the Maroczy Bind via this move order.

    and ive seen people play Qa5+, Qb6 stuff against me, how should I proceed against the possible moves stated in the board below

    if black doesnt play these moves, then we likely have a normal Maroczy bind.

    Any thoughts? I am having annoying troubles against this early queen development.

  • #2

    Second diagram is broken.

  • #3

    Ugh my bad, stupid internet is failing me, so boards are not proper.

    I meant after 1.nf3 g6 2.c4 Bg7 3.e4 c5 4.d4, what should I do against the folowing: 4...Qb6, 4..Qa5, and 4..cxd4 5.Nxd4 Qb6 to get a decent/good position?

    This move order is killing me in my live games, and i'd like to keep it as a reference for later.

  • #4

    I dont play this from either side, but I can offer my 2 cents.

    4....Qa5 5.Nc3 looks good enough to me. Or 5.Bd2 and 6.Bc3 looks even better. Would almost say ...Qa5+ was a mistake.

    4....Qb6 database gives 5.dxc5 as most popular. But I don't like it because of Qb4+. I would prefer 5.Nc3, when if 5....cxd4 6.Nd5 looks very good for white. (6...Qa5 7.b4)

    4....cxd4 5.Nxd4 Qb6, white has the choices of either 6.Nb3, or 6.Nb5 (Planning N5c3 with a compact position.) Looks to be a matter of taste.

    Sorry I don't know more. Not really my bag.Frown

  • #5

    Just looking briefly this is what I'd do:

    vs 4...Qb6 either 5.Nc3 (if 5...cxd I'm planning Nd5) or
    5.dxc5 with 6.Nc3 (I don't mind doubled pawns if Bxc3)

    vs 4...Qa5+ just 5.Nc3

    vs 4...cxd and 5...Qb6 (of the three seems most reasonable for black) just 6.Nb3

  • #6

    My references say this:

    Qa5+ (recommended book line)

    Bd2...Qb6.  Bc3...cxd4.  Bxd4...Bxd4.  Qxd4...Qxd4.  Nxd4...Nc6.  Nb5 =

    Nc3...Nf6.  Bd3...cxd4.  Nxd4 =

    cxd4 (recommended book line)

    Nxd4...Nc6.  Be3...Nf6.  Nc3...0-0.  Be2...d6.  0-0...Bd7.  =

    Nxd4...Nc6.  Be3...Nf6.  Nc3...Ng4.  Qxg4...Nxd4.  Qd1...Ne6. =

    Qb6? (not recommended book line)

    dxc5...Qxc5.  Be2... +/=

  • #7

    Qa5+ Bd2 Qb6 Bc3 cxd4 Bxd4 Bxd4 Qxd4 Qxd4 Nxd4 Nc6 Nb5 line - I agree that while white might be slightly more active, black has a solid position and has solved his space problem by trading pieces. Probably is about equal.

    Qa5+ Nc3 Nf6 Bd3 cxd4 Nxd4 - white seems to still have the slight positional edge and space advantage the maroczy offers. I disagree that black has completely equalized, and, checking my database, white scores well from this position.

    cxd4 Nxd4 Nc6 Be3 Nf6 Nc3 0-0 Be2 d6 0-0 Bd7 - Black still has a space disadvantage and all of the normal maroczy disadvantages. IMO white is better, and results from this position do favor white.

    cxd4 Nxd4 Nc6 Be3 Nf6 Nc3 Ng4 Qxg4 Nxd4 Qd1 Ne6 - I again disagree that black has equalized. The position is quite complicated but white scores well.

    Qb6 dxc5 Qxc5 (Qb4+ Nc3 (Qd2 is a safer approach) Bxc3+ bxc3 Qxc3+ Bd2 Qa3 Rb1 Qxc5 Bd3 with great compensation for the pawn.) Be2 - agree that this is better for white.


    What book is this, MCO? Reminds me of my edition, just claiming most positions are = without much analysis. In every one of those lines white scores better than black, although only in the first one could black possibly hope to claim equality in my opinion.

  • #8

    I'm a bit confused. Do you want a Maroczy bind? if so why are you playing d4 so early? I would think you would play c4 and Nc3 before d4 to get a Maroczy bind.

  • #9

    Of course I'd like to play 3.Nc3, but can't black avoid it with 3..c5 4.d4 cxd4 5.Nxd4 Nc6(?) when e4 is just not happening for white. The play goes into a some english opening, that's why I thought 3.e4 is necessary.

    Notice that 3..c5 discourages 4.e4 because of the gaping weakness on d4, i suspect black somehow has an okay position in this botnivik system like setup...and white won't be pushing d4 any time soon.

  • #10

    Actually your move order looks fine

    4...Qa5+ 5.Nc3 is a Maroczy with a slightly misplaced Black queen

    4...cd 5.Nd4 Qb6 was the other line?

  • #11

    And 4..Qb6

    Shepi posted some analysis, and it looks alright from my view

  • #12

    No, I just looked at Borg Queen's lines and announced that most of them seem to give white an advantage, despite the fact that his book claims most of them are equal. Took very little work on my part.

  • #13

    Fair warning, Dzindzi recommends stuff like this for Black. There are some gaping holes in his analysis though. 

    How about this game as a template for white:

  • #14

    Did anyone see Kamsky-Morozevich:


Online Now