Why isn't the English Opening played so often in tournaments

Geluss

As I watched the recent Carlsen v. Karjakin world championship I noticed that the English opening wasn't played that much. Surely after so many games of Ruy Lopez the English would be a nice surprise weapon? Why isn't it played as often as e4 or d4 or even Nf3?

12Knaves

Preference probably. 

Geluss
+Smnrkssn

I see that does make sense. Thanks for clearing up my doubts ^_^
kindaspongey

The February 2017 issue of Chess lists the top twenty openings compiled from a list of 4561 December games where both players were rated over 2400 Elo. One can not take position on this list too seriously because it is greatly influenced by how the openings are grouped. For example, all the Retis are grouped together, while English is separated into 1...c5, 1...e5, etc. Nevertheless, for what it is worth, some of the list entries are: 336 Retis, 198 King's Indians, 186 Caro-Kanns, 159 declined Queen's Gambits, 158 Nimzo-Indians, 148 Najdorf Sicilians, 135 Slavs, 128 1...c5 Englishes, 114 Kan Sicilians, 102 Italians, 98 1...Nf6 Englishes, 97 Queen's Indians, 88 1...e5 Englishes, and 78 Berlin Ruy Lopezes

JohnnyKGB

because 1..e5 refutes to 1.c4  ,  sicilian is a fraud in both colours

Geluss
kindaspongey wrote:

The February 2017 issue of Chess lists the top twenty openings compiled from a list of 4561 December games where both players were rated over 2400 Elo. One can not take position on this list too seriously because it is greatly influenced by how the openings are grouped. For example, all the Retis are grouped together, while English is separated into 1...c5, 1...e5, etc. Nevertheless, for what it is worth, some of the list entries are: 336 Retis, 198 King's Indians, 186 Caro-Kanns, 159 declined Queen's Gambits, 158 Nimzo-Indians, 148 Najdorf Sicilians, 135 Slavs, 128 1...c5 Englishes, 114 Kan Sicilians, 102 Italians, 98 1...Nf6 Englishes, 97 Queen's Indians, 88 1...e5 Englishes, and 78 Berlin Ruy Lopezes

Your point is? The English is still slightly less common than Nf3 and a lot less common than d4 and e4 if you count together the sicilians and caros or the different Indians. I thought the English would make for a solid opening to take your opponent out of preparation but as Smnrkssn pointed out, I suppose it does make a weaker claim to the center.

Gamificast

Some openings are just more popular than others, I guess.

1. c4 is a solid and sound opening with a very good winning percentage. I play it occasionally, as I like the setups that it allows.

I also find it easy to play, as you don't have to know too much theory (unlike a lot of openings).

MickinMD

I think most players like games less closed than what Black can choose against 1. c4, even though the English Opening, according to the database at chessgames.com, gets as good or better results as any other opening with enough games listed to assume a random sample.

Personally, as Black I try to steer the game into a Slav Defense where I can get my QB outside the pawn chain before ...e6 makes it a "Bad Bishop:" 1 c4 c6 2 d4 d5 3 Nf3 dxc4 4 e3 Bg4, where White's 2nd, 3rd, and 4th moves are, by far, the most common in those positions and where the 15 games that reached 4...Bg4 resulted in 5 wins for each side and 5 draws.  Chess King's huge Gigabase has 40 such games with much better White results: 21 wins, 9 loses, and 10 draws, but notable for Black are:

V. Anand (2690) - B. Dibenyu (2550) 1/2-1/2 - 1992

A. Bosko (2450) - B. Dibenyu (2510) 0-1  - 1993

E. Boguljubow (UKR) - A. Alekhine (RUS) 0-1 - World Champ. Match, 1934.

The seven games that followed the most common 1st 6 moves, like Boguljubow-Alehine: 1 c4 c6 2 d4 d5 3 Nf3 dxc4 4 e3 Bg4 5 Bxc4 e6 6 Nc3 Nd7 resulted in 3 wins for White, 2 wins for Black, and 2 draws - all the games involving 2000-2600+ players.

If it's good enough for Alekhine, it's good enough for me!

 

Farilya
JohnnyKGB yazdı:

because 1..e5 refutes to 1.c4  ,  sicilian is a fraud in both colours

1...e5 is no problem for players who play Sicilian with black pieces, Sicilian is the choice of brave!

omnipotent00001

We're playing an English over there at the open discussion club.

Lion_kingkiller

A fabulous opening. And very dynamic. Most people are right handed... playing c4 feels very awkward and strange,

IvanovitchCM88

Ding Liren usually plays It. 

A-mateur
LionWillCrush a écrit :

(...) Most people are right handed... playing c4 feels very awkward and strange,

This is why I only play 1.c4 online... On a real chessboard I have to play 1.Nf3.

Farilya
A-mateur yazdı:
LionWillCrush a écrit :

(...) Most people are right handed... playing c4 feels very awkward and strange,

This is why I only play 1.c4 online... On a real chessboard I have to play 1.Nf3.

If you start with 1.Nf3, you have to play 2.d4 after black's 1...d5 response. Because 2.c4 is not good, it is necessary to understand this difference.

A-mateur
Farilya a écrit :
A-mateur yazdı:
LionWillCrush a écrit :

(...) Most people are right handed... playing c4 feels very awkward and strange,

This is why I only play 1.c4 online... On a real chessboard I have to play 1.Nf3.

If you start with 1.Nf3, you have to play 2.d4 after black's 1...d5 response. Because 2.c4 is not good, it is necessary to understand this difference.

After 1.Nf3 d5, 2.c4 is a perfectly playable move. It is sometimes called the Reti gambit. It has been played by Alekhine, Tartakower, Korchnoi, Kramnik... Among others. As far as I could see it can lead to fascinating positions after 2...d4, but they are also very complicated. This is why I'm now considering to follow Carlsen's advice for a "casual player" (https://chess24.com/en/read/news/magnus-carlsen-i-think-i-ll-enjoy-chess-to-the-day-i-die) and play 1.Nf3 2.g3 3.Bg2 4.0-0, though against some variations I don't think it is extremely sound (for instance 1.Nf3 d5 2.g3 c5 3.Bg2 Nc6 and 4.d4 seems to be the most reasonable move) 

pfren
Farilya έγραψε:
A-mateur yazdı:
LionWillCrush a écrit :

(...) Most people are right handed... playing c4 feels very awkward and strange,

This is why I only play 1.c4 online... On a real chessboard I have to play 1.Nf3.

If you start with 1.Nf3, you have to play 2.d4 after black's 1...d5 response. Because 2.c4 is not good, it is necessary to understand this difference.

 

It seems that you have decided that the style which suits you best is never learning anything from what you've been told.

Farilya

Black's score is very good after 1.Nf3 d5, 2.c4 d4. Unfortunately, we cannot agree with you, you don't want to understand me. You may be experienced but the Grand Masters over 2600 ELO said what I wrote here and they know more than you. No problem, I respect everyone's ideas.