Girls, girls, girls, calm down and keep it real.
A number of us are in agreement with your thoughts on the subject.
Is it cheating if I use a real chess board during a live game?
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Dec 30, 2021
0
#64
I highly doubt that would be considered cheating. As long as a computer or person isn't helping you with your moves.
Carrots666 wrote:
Good question... I don't think that you can't (u can), but it is not analysis so it's fine I guess.
Huh ????
You don’t think - but give an answer anyway by saying … it’s fine - u can.
Beyond my comprehension members who make such guesses often providing wrong and misleading information.
I will say this - the right answer is provided in the guidelines and rules of fair play. A clear distinction is made between Live and Daily where in Daily clear language is used sanctioning the practice. The language for Live play is also clear - however it often gets interpreted incorrectly to suit those who believe the practice should be ok.
It’s simple. The practice is undetectable - therefor no rule can be put in writing prohibiting it. CC makes it very clear - the practice is highly discouraged. There are many valid reasons - but disputed by those uneducated in the matter. Hence they make there own interpretations of the language. Their main focus is because no rule is written against it - it must be OK and is endorsed. That is incorrect.
Dec 30, 2021
0
#66
CooloutAC wrote:
Anonymous_Dragon wrote:
ColoutAc I can't believe that you think Databases and Engines are the same thing
I think their both cheating. I can't believe you don't think so.
The world doesn't revolve around you and what you think
StormCentre3 wrote:
lfPatriotGames wrote:
paranoiddelusionist wrote:
nah cheating is using an engine or getting outside help
Chess. com has openly admitted using a real board is considered outside help. And thus, is not allowed. However, when called out on it they revised their position. Chess.com claims they want to promote the real chess experience as much as possible, which obviously would include using a real board. So when they realized they are contradicting themselves, they reluctantly admitted using a real board is ok to do.
Obviously using a real board would have to be done as you would in an actual real game of chess. Meaning you only move the pieces as you would in a real over the board game. No "practice" moves allowed.
When I play online chess I often use a real board because I like the actual real experience. Because I only move the pieces as I would if the other person were sitting across from me it's ok.
The post is inaccurate. A made up interpretation of this topic that has been discussed in many threads for years. Not going to get into the facts nor debate these kind of misleading and false assumptions that members make regarding the subject. These posts are merely guessing at what they think is the proper use of a 2nd board for live play.
CC staff highly discourages the practice and has never said nor admitted otherwise. It is not ok. Staff has never endorsed nor promoted differently.
It is an unnecessary practice which is undetectable and hence no rule is written prohibiting it. Learn to using one board - the screen. Anything else is not desirable and can easily result in unwanted practices.
I'm not sure why you think it's inaccurate. It's from a forum conversation with staff. If you disagree you are free to contact them yourself if you need verification.
When we talked about this before, in another topic, I advised you to contact staff. I don't know if you ever did, but MGleason presented his view that using a second board (in the manner discussed here) was "no big deal". Further, Martin addressed you directly about this. For which you thanked him for explaining. I don't know, maybe you have forgotten and need to ask again. I suspect the answer will be the same now as it was then.
Dec 30, 2021
0
#68
With the ability to have arrows showing all available moves for a particular piece plus confirm move, isn’t that giving those using those features an advantage?
It's probably easy for people who are banned to create new accounts and try their shenanigans again, it's a lot of work to find rule breakers.
CooloutAC wrote:
... people come on the forums and defend alt accounts as not being prevalent or harmful, it really fosters such behavior.
People do come on the forums and defend alt accounts. They then get informed that the site rules prevent them unless the staff explicitly allows it for a specific player (if my memory is correct, those explicitly allowed alts get the majority of the posts saying they are not harmful).
Personally, if I were to direct a US Chess-rated on-line event I would want an alt account used solely for directing, but I would need to first check to see if the staff would allow it (just assuming it was okay would be courting ejection).
Dec 30, 2021
0
#71
StormCentre3 wrote:
Carrots666 wrote:
Good question... I don't think that you can't (u can), but it is not analysis so it's fine I guess.
Huh ????
You don’t think - but give an answer anyway by saying … it’s fine - u can.
Beyond my comprehension members who make such guesses often providing wrong and misleading information.
I will say this - the right answer is provided in the guidelines and rules of fair play. A clear distinction is made between Live and Daily where in Daily clear language is used sanctioning the practice. The language for Live play is also clear - however it often gets interpreted incorrectly to suit those who believe the practice should be ok.
It’s simple. The practice is undetectable - therefor no rule can be put in writing prohibiting it. CC makes it very clear - the practice is highly discouraged. There are many valid reasons - but disputed by those uneducated in the matter. Hence they make there own interpretations of the language. Their main focus is because no rule is written against it - it must be OK and is endorsed. That is incorrect.
+1
Rules need be enforceable to be meaningful.
If an activity is undetectable - it is impossible to fairly enforce any rule attempting to regulate such. Hence CC wisely avoids any attempts to regulate the use of a 2bd board during live play- except to say the practice is discouraged and advised against. It is suggested it being best to learn to play 2D.
No advantage is gained by using one. Most games- even longer time formats often end in time trouble where it becomes impractical.
StormCentre3 wrote:
Rules need be enforceable to be meaningful.
If an activity is undetectable - it is impossible to fairly enforce any rule attempting to regulate such. Hence CC wisely avoids any attempts to regulate the use of a 2bd board during live play- except to say the practice is discouraged and advised against. It is suggested it being best to learn to play 2D.
No advantage is gained by using one. Most games- even longer time formats often end in time trouble where it becomes impractical.
But using a second real board is not against the rules. Only outside assistance is against the rules. Which is why I asked the staff about it. And they answered. If you remember, they also answered your question.
Maybe you need to ask them again. If it were against the rules, why wouldn't they take action against those who openly say they do it?
Dec 30, 2021
0
#74
JohanKjeldahl07 wrote:
is it cheating if I have an actual chess set with me and copy the moves that are happening online?
Seems your topic has attracted some trolls and mentally ill people. Too bad.
The answer is simply "no"
CooloutAC wrote:
lfPatriotGames wrote:
StormCentre3 wrote:
Rules need be enforceable to be meaningful.
If an activity is undetectable - it is impossible to fairly enforce any rule attempting to regulate such. Hence CC wisely avoids any attempts to regulate the use of a 2bd board during live play- except to say the practice is discouraged and advised against. It is suggested it being best to learn to play 2D.
No advantage is gained by using one. Most games- even longer time formats often end in time trouble where it becomes impractical.
But using a second real board is not against the rules. Only outside assistance is against the rules. Which is why I asked the staff about it. And they answered. If you remember, they also answered your question.
Maybe you need to ask them again. If it were against the rules, why wouldn't they take action against those who openly say they do it?
He just answered your question. Because they can't do anything about it. Its up to the community to discourage or condone it at that point. I'm in the camp that sees nothing wrong with it, especially if a player just wants to practice playing with a real board. I do think having a second screen with an analysis board can be seen as an unfair advantage though.
If they can't do anything about it, then it's not against the rules, as claimed. A rule is not a rule unless it's enforceable. That's kinda what the word rule means.
So that's why outside assistance is against the rules. It's enforceable. But using a second board (in the manner described here) is not listed as a fair play violation. It's not against any rule.
I have not seen anyone from staff suggest the practice is discouraged or advised against. In the past they HAVE said it was technically against the rules, but also not a big deal if done in a manner that mimics otb play.
A rule that cannot be enforced is a suggestion.
Dec 30, 2021
0
#77
Not ig using chess board during online chess is a best way to calculate moves and virtual boards i hate them tbh and it's not possible to use chess board at blitz and bullet yuh can use them on rapid and slow games stuff
lfPatriotGames wrote:
A rule that cannot be enforced is a suggestion.
What is so difficult to comprehend?
No rule is written regarding the use of a 2nd board during Live play. The practice is highly discouraged in the guidelines. A few on Staff in the past have said that it’s “OK” if practiced correctly. They misspoke- as some members interpreted this to mean things it does not.
If practiced correctly and honestly it is not regarded as using a form of assistance- violating fair play practices. Problems easily occur when players / especially new players to not practice and follow quite restrictive guidelines regarding proper use.
No advantage is gained by using one - in fact it is detrimental to results. It is completely impractical and a hinderance when time is running low. Anything less than 10 minute games and a 2nd board is pointless. Most all games , even 30 minutes games can end with 5 minutes left on the clock - where again the board needs discarding.
Learn to play with just One board - the screen.
The reason no rule is written prohibiting it’s use is simple. The practice can not be detected- hence any enforcement becomes impossible to fairly administer and enforce.
Note: Now… if someone were to leave their screen open and visible, by example when streaming and they were seen as using a 2nd board- you can bet a warning to be made.
Having an analysis board onscreen is, of course, wrong. It wouldn't occur to me to cheat, though. I'd far rather lose than do that. Something called pride and self-reliance.